A/C install TDI powered Vanagon

[markward]

A/C Compressor Adapter Fittings

Hello, over the last few weeks I have started to install an aftermarket air conditioner into my TDI powered Vanagon. I am at the parts collection stage and have run into a small snag. My intention is to use the OE Sanden SD7V16 Compressor 1JO 820 803 A. I can't use the original compressor lines for a few reasons. I am looking for compressor line adapters to go to conventional #8 and #10 AC hoses. No luck so far. So anyone have an idea where I can find the adapters? No luck at Vintage air or Nostalgic. Another option would be to find a rear cover with different fittings. So any AC conversion experts out there that can help? Thank you mark

 

[JoaoT4]

Mark, I would like to help you, but right now I have no idea how you can fit the AC. I also what to fit an AC on my T4 (Eurovan). On my case I have the compressor already mounted on the engine.
I will follow this tread closely.

João

 

[AndyBees]

Mark,

Touch on the obvious reasons not to use the existing compressor lines. Are you talking about the lines that come in the Vanagon?

I know that flaking inside of old lines is an issue discussed pretty often. I converted my ole '83 Air Cool Vanagon from R-12 to R-134 without changing out the lines. I did that back in 1992. Of course, I did have some leak issues (had those with R-12). However, after finding the leaks, repairing, etc., the system functioned quite well. The Vanagon has been parked for several years and no doubt the system most likely doesn't have pressure.

One point of interest relating to the flaking. As part of the conversion, I did replace the dryer and the expansion valve. The old expansion valve looked just fine. There was no debris in the strainer inside. In fact, I believe it would have worked just fine.

Lastly, I did a similar conversion on an '84 Jetta Diesel. It worked for a number of years.

I'm progressing with my TDI Vanagon conversion on the assumption that I will be using the compressor that come on the engine...... knowing the support bar will have to be modified!

I too will be following this Thread! Keep us informed!

 

[markward]

I retitled the thread. I am starting from scratch. Not reusing any stock VW Vanagon AC parts. I have the compressor from the TDI engine and will be using that with an aftermarket a/c system. The TDI AC compressor had custom lines attached to it. They are aluminum with bends to clear the original front valance. They are in the wrong place for the vanagon. There are some aftermarket compressor hose adapters for many styles of compressors including the Sanden 508 and other Sanden compressors. I just can't seem to find adapters to fit this particular compressor. I thought maybe others here might have overcome this problem. I am sure someone must make the adapters, but no luck so far. mark

Edit: Vintage Air gave me the name of a company that I once had a card for. The company is Doc's Blocks. I don't see what I need exactly on their website, but called and they asked that I send a photo of my compressor and the hose ends I have. If they can't match it up, they think they can make them. So for the moment, my search is on hold. mark

 

[JoaoT4]

I heard that you already have your AC working. Did you have a lot of work with the tubes?
Right now I have the Compressor on place and I bought an evaporator and the condenser from a van identical to mine. I hope this will simplify my work. I already have some tubes that I will have to rebuild. I hope I can have it working during the next month.

 

[markward]

Joao, I purchased new bulk hose from Vintage Air and the fittings I would need. My evaporator is behind the dashboard. So my hose sizes and lengths would be different. I installed all of the fittings, then fitted up the hose. I then marked the hose and fittings, removed them and had a local hydraulic shop crimp the hose ends on. This way I knew they would fit. My hoses run down through the tank area, then to the l/s frame member and then cross over to the compressor above the transmission. It was too much bulk to follow the coolant tubes.

My AC uses conventional O ring fittings including the AC compressor where I did find some compressor adapters that I was able to use. mark

 

[AndyBees]

Wow! I've been scratching my head this afternoon trying to come up with a SIMPLE short term solution to my AC. At the moment, I think I'll hang with the old system. But, I'll probably end up splicing the lines for length purposes.

Mark how was the MPGs on the trip?

 

[markward]

Andy overall average is still 29.5, but running 72 mph with the air on high more like 25 mpg. It really starts to use fuel as you approach a continuous 3000 rpm. I have stopped tracking the fuel mileage, because I end up back pedaling to 60 and 65 mph. I built this thing to travel and go as far as quick as I can. Running 72mph when legal gets you places in a reasonable amount of time. Remember it takes a full day of driving to get from where I am in Florida to the GA NC line. I need bigger brakes now. That is the next project. mark

 

[JoaoT4]

Thank you for the tips. I also need bigger brakes but I also had that problem with my aircooled beetle, and I still have drums all around
After a while you get used to it

João

 

[akafred]

On my car I just welded the aluminum lines together to accomplish what I needed. Worked fine. Pretty easy with a tig machine.

 

[AndyBees]

Welding AC lines together

On my car I just welded the aluminum lines together to accomplish what I needed. Worked fine. Pretty easy with a tig machine.

Was considering having some welding done on my AC lines as well. So, you said with a Tig machine, is that correct. Or, was it with a Mig welder?

 

[AndyBees]

So, Mark, what is your 4th gear ratio as well as tire size? As I recall., your R&P is a 4.14:1. Is that correct?

I like to drive between 65 and 70. The bulk of the traffic passes me on by. I was hoping to keep my RPMs around 2850 at 65 with the 14 inch wheels. I have EuroVan 15 inch wheels to use if I am not satisfied with the other wheels!

 

[JoaoT4]

Was considering having some welding done on my AC lines as well. So, you said with a Tig machine, is that correct. Or, was it with a Mig welder?

For aluminum we can use both, I think.
João

 

[markward]

Andy, yes 4.14 with a .77 4th gear and 215/65/16 tires. With the stock air cooled transmission I was content to travel 62 mph everywhere. The transmission upgrade, I was happy running 65mph all day long and getting the good mileage still. With the new nozzels, thanks Jon, there is so much available power even at 70mph that it is hard to putt along. Traveling the right lane you always get those situations where you are coming up on slower traffic and there is faster traffic coming in the left lane. Before, I would usually slow down and wait my turn. Now, I can turn on my signal and off I go into the left lane. It will accelerate to 85 mph pretty easy. Pass, get back in the right lane and resume the cruise.

I don't want to give the impression that I am zooming around the country, but have driven to CA once, Wisconsin once, Maine Twice and to the smokeys once. I get only so much time off of work, so we need to make good time. On long trips it can equal cutting 2 hours a day of driving time I believe. Trust me, I would not push the Van if I did not feel it enjoyed it. I monitor the temps closely and the "feel". I know I can get better mpg, by slowing down, but there is time to slow down when we retire and have more time. The mpg starts to suffer above 2900 rpm in my experience pretty quickly. You either lower the rpms with gearing or tires, or you take your foot out of it. Remember, mine is a full Westy with 15 gallons of water and fuel at times, 3 weeks of supplies, my wife and 90 pound dog. We don't like to shop much when we travel and only purchase fruits, vegetables and other perishibles. I missed the dead line for TDI fest early registration. That was yesterday. Bummer. Time is coming quick. mark

 

[AndyBees]

Mark,
I probably should be posting this in my Thread. But, since your Thread is on AC, I decided to put here.

In my conversion project, as it turns out, the AC lines (existing) will be more than long enough to reach the AC Compressor as mounted on the TDI engine. But, as you probably guessed, my problem is access to vacuum and charge the system. The two valves (suction and pressure) are on the OEM system near the compressor on the metal (steel) lines. What I have for the TDI compressor is the two short aluminum lines without valves. .........bummer, should have been looking ahead on this one.

So, question, does Vintage Air have adaptors "with suction and pressure valves" that fit the TDI compressor that will connect to those "old" OEM rubber lines?

Lastly, it looks as if the OEM pump will bolt up to the TDI bracket. The bolt holes will have to be bored out slightly and add the two compression mounting thingys. The other issue would be the pulley. Measurements, etc., indicate everything should work. However, I'm not sure if the pulley will work....shaft diameters appear to be different.

 

[markward]

Andy, Vintage Air sells aluminum weld on service port fittings. They also have inline hose fittings. Since you need to shorten the hoses you might be able to use those. I purchased compressor adapter fittings from AP Air to convert the TDI compressor to #10 and #8 conventional AC fittings. I made up new hoses and the hose end fittings I used at the compressor had the service ports. I can appreciate wanting to maintain that OE flavor, but personally I would not go to the trouble of trying to reuse old hoses. The newer hose is called "barrier" hose and is suited to R134. I know on Samba, everyone raves about RedTek as a substitute to R12, but it is flammable and not something I would want to deal with. Build the system to use 134 and be done with it.

Vintage Air has an online catalog, but it is a little difficult to use because you can only open one page at a time. You can buy the paper catalog which they will refund the money on your first purchase. mark

 

[AndyBees]

Andy, Vintage Air sells aluminum weld on service port fittings. They also have inline hose fittings. Since you need to shorten the hoses you might be able to use those. I purchased compressor adapter fittings from AP Air to convert the TDI compressor to #10 and #8 conventional AC fittings. I made up new hoses and the hose end fittings I used at the compressor had the service ports. I can appreciate wanting to maintain that OE flavor, but personally I would not go to the trouble of trying to reuse old hoses. The newer hose is called "barrier" hose and is suited to R134. I know on Samba, everyone raves about RedTek as a substitute to R12, but it is flammable and not something I would want to deal with. Build the system to use 134 and be done with it.

Vintage Air has an online catalog, but it is a little difficult to use because you can only open one page at a time. You can buy the paper catalog which they will refund the money on your first purchase. mark

I agree with changing over to 134a 100%. I've seen the flamable stuff for sale for years in local Flea Markets (I think it is propane). However, I switched my ol' '83 over to 134a several years ago without changing anything. Of course, it will only hold a charge for about 6 months, which was pretty much the case with R12. Also, I changed over an '84 Jetta Diesel about 15 years ago. It still has charge and works!

I'd like to just put it together for now and address the AC with everything new when I have more time. If I can come up with a "quick" short term fix right now, I'd rather do that.

 

[markward]

Andy, they also have aluminum hose weld on O ring ends I believe. You will need to determine the stock hose end sizes. If they are too long and you want to keep them stock length, maybe you could use a lazy loop. I am still not sure how you are going to adapt the TDI compressor manifold to work with the stock hoses. I found the bends to be completely wrong in my setup. They really needed to come straight forward to clear everything and even then getting the service gauge on was very tight. I can't wait to see what you come up with. mark

 

[AndyBees]

Mark, the reason my hoses are long enough the VW installer did a very nice "lazy loop" that went up into the area above the tranny then down to the left side then to the AC compressor.

Last night while looking thru Vintage Air I did see some Adapters for a GM compressor that look just like what I need. They looked to fit into the back of the Compressor with O-rings and two hold-down bolts. The ends of the adaptors are threaded to accept metal fittings. Of course, they need to be for a VW. I'm thinking about taking photos, etc., and give them a call. Maybe they can come up with a set of adapters to work for me. One problem, the identification sticker on the Vanagon Compressor is defaced so bad that I cannot read the info.

 

[markward]

Andy, check your email.

 

[AndyBees]

Mark, thanks very much. The AC Compressor adapters are ordered! Wow, sure glad to get that out of the way! I have a new Dryer/reciever to install as well as an expansion Valve. I'll do all that when I take down the overhead unit for structural repairs......nice afternoon job!

I stopped by the welder's place this afternoon. He's off tomorrow (regular job), and says he can do the mounts for me.

Tonight, I'm going to put some photos in those last Posts above.

 

[akafred]

Was considering having some welding done on my AC lines as well. So, you said with a Tig machine, is that correct. Or, was it with a Mig welder?

I welded it with a tig machine. Would be probably to hard with mig to make airtight seal

Also tig'ed some lines on friends vanagon Subaru powered project. Both work fine 2+ yrs later.