A/C foam

[John Wesley Hardin]

Couple weeks a go or so after I installed my new A/C in the Jetta, I noticed what appeared to be a small piece of foam up in the double vents above the radio. Didnt think much of it till I went to pull it out. I started pulling on that thing , it was about 5 -6"long, 1/2 x 3/8" rect. pc of foam ! I couldnt believe. Anybody know where that came from ?

 

[J_dude]

From the blend doors, it’s a common issue as the foam degrades over time.

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

From the blend doors, it’s a common issue as the foam degrades over time.

This was a fine looking piece of foam almost like it came unglued. Yes Ive heard of that. Since the new A/C Im getting very cold air. I run it on high with the recirculate mode on . Which keeps it quite cold. However I am sure the blend door may be a problem also. Another issue is in South Texas right now we are getting 115-120 degree heat index . At work my car is preheating in an open parking lot with no shade for 8-10 hrs before my drive home. My Jetta is a GLS the interior is black and the seats are black leather ! I think I mentioned in an earlier post my leather seats are still tanning ! So Im getting a triple whammy. It seems when I first turn the A/C on its cold but not real cold. After about 15minutes at highway speed its very cold . Cold enough to start freezing the metal plate in my forehead.

 

[csstevej]

Leave your windows cracked a 1/2” to prevent excessive heat build up.
yeah once it starts to spit out it’s just a matter of time before it’s all gone.
There are a lot of write ups on repairs from complete removal of dash and complete removal of HVAC box to disassemble and recover the panels to doing the repair with the dash mostly in place.
You probably won’t notice the foam missing with using the AC ….. but you will notice that the heat isn’t as great because the hot air blends with the cold air due to the lack of intact foam on the panels.

 

[fatmobile]

Common enough that someone even made plugs to replace the foam,..
but i can't remember where.

 

[Nuje]

Developed and sold by the late, wonderful @alphaseinor.

DSP "Foam Fix" Blend Door plug kit

The plug kit we designed and have been installing in our customer cars for years is now available for sale. Basically, if you don't have heat, or are tired of being pelted by foam coming out of your vents, this is the kit for you These are made in house, and typically ship the same business...

forums.tdiclub.com

Pretty sure still available through dspauto.com

 

[csstevej]

I’ve installed theses kit…. There great ….. also bought 3 additional kits for future repairs on families fleet.

 

[J_dude]

also bought 3 additional kits for future repairs on families fleet.

Good idea, I probably should do that as well. So far mine has been okay but it’s only a matter of time lol.

 

[Nickmix]

Couple weeks a go or so after I installed my new A/C in the Jetta, I noticed what appeared to be a small piece of foam up in the double vents above the radio. Didnt think much of it till I went to pull it out. I started pulling on that thing , it was about 5 -6"long, 1/2 x 3/8" rect. pc of foam ! I couldnt believe. Anybody know where that came from ?

Probably the foam seal between the center double vents and the upper ductwork.

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

Leave your windows cracked a 1/2” to prevent excessive heat build up.
yeah once it starts to spit out it’s just a matter of time before it’s all gone.
There are a lot of write ups on repairs from complete removal of dash and complete removal of HVAC box to disassemble and recover the panels to doing the repair with the dash mostly in place.
You probably won’t notice the foam missing with using the AC ….. but you will notice that the heat isn’t as great because the hot air blends with the cold air due to the lack of intact foam on the panels.

Oh I do all that, crack the windows put the sunshade on the windshield. dont matter its still a 100 degrees every day

Probably the foam seal between the center double vents and the upper ductwork.

Thats what

Probably the foam seal between the center double vents and the upper ductwork.
[/Q

Probably the foam seal between the center double vents and the upper ductwork.

Thats what I thought, thanks for the info!

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

Developed and sold by the late, wonderful @alphaseinor.

DSP "Foam Fix" Blend Door plug kit

The plug kit we designed and have been installing in our customer cars for years is now available for sale. Basically, if you don't have heat, or are tired of being pelted by foam coming out of your vents, this is the kit for you These are made in house, and typically ship the same business...

forums.tdiclub.com

Pretty sure still available through dspauto.com

Thats great information thanks for posting that I appreciate it!

 

[06bluebeetletdi]

I also put a sunshade in the rear windshield of my beetle and passat as well as tinted windows.

 

[AndyBees]

I did the blend-door repair (plugs) last spring in my 03 Jetta. I used the plug kit. I also used a clear-drying calk
mostly to prevent rattle. I've also done this job on several New Beetles but a different access procedure.

The thing I ran into was pushing the top snap back in place on the vent tube. So, I cut it off. The other tabs hold it in place tight enough to seal.
Also, you are better off to remove both of the supports shown in the YouTube How-to Videos. Likely you'll need to replace those 8mm head bolts with phillips screws (I did). And, you'll need to drill a hole on the left side for a long screw driver.

All the above will make sense when you look at the YouTubes and get in there. I do have photos but have not uploaded them here in the TDI Photo Gallery.

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

I also put a sunshade in the rear windshield of my beetle and passat as well as tinted windows.

I also put a sunshade in the rear windshield of my beetle and passat as well as tinted windows.

I have tinted windows and the rear tinted glass is the most important . Its legal to have it super dark tint on every window except the driver and passenger side in Texas anyways. Mine is for the purpose of keeping tailgaters and other vehicles from blinding me from behind. It seems nowadays everyone drives with their brights on with no regard to other motorists. Plus the new LED headlights and others are so bright its unbelievable ! Also with a Jetta or similar small car you are eye ball level to most truck headlights from behind or oncoming traffic . I need a sunshade visor just to drive at night!

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

I did the blend-door repair (plugs) last spring in my 03 Jetta. I used the plug kit. I also used a clear-drying calk
mostly to prevent rattle. I've also done this job on several New Beetles but a different access procedure.

The thing I ran into was pushing the top snap back in place on the vent tube. So, I cut it off. The other tabs hold it in place tight enough to seal.
Also, you are better off to remove both of the supports shown in the YouTube How-to Videos. Likely you'll need to replace those 8mm head bolts with phillips screws (I did). And, you'll need to drill a hole on the left side for a long screw driver.

All the above will make sense when you look at the YouTubes and get in there. I do have photos but have not uploaded them here in the TDI Photo Gallery.

I gotta check that out because thats gonna be one of my next moves before winter cause Im tired of freezing my ass off! Well I get very warm air but not hot and it takes about 30 minutes before it gets to that level of warmth. By that time its to late . 15 minutes later Im at work and shut the car off.

 

[AndyBees]

Also, keep in mind, the VW Diesel engines warm-up slow.

 

[J_dude]

Yeah unfortunately short trips are pretty hard on diesels in the cold, they take too long to warm up so the fuel isn’t getting burnt efficiently or completely and so they start coking up

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

Also, keep in mind, the VW Diesel engines warm-up slow.

How long does it take approx.? My drive to work is 40 minutes in the dark. Thats just when its heating up inside when I park. You know by the way Im not even sure if my glow plugs work When i turn the key on the symbol comes on briefly then goes off on the instrument panel. When its cold it takes two to three times of trying to turn the motor before it fires up and I end up with diesel residue from the exhaust on the car body after those cold morning starts.

 

[AndyBees]

The advice here is to start and go immediately. That's about how I've always done it. However, the idling engine is warming oil and coolant as well as all the metal, ever so slow though. Rationale is, the diesel fuel could be pushing you toward your destiny instead of being wasted.

If you have a hard-start (longer than normal cranking) on a typical morning now, not winter, well, the Injection Pump may be losing prime. Losing prime is more noticeable after the car sits overnight.

All GPs don't go out at the same time. If one or two GPs are out, the engine will idle pretty rough for a few seconds after you start it. If the GPs are all out, likely the Glow-plug Relay is the culprit. The GPs can be tested with an Ohm Meter without removing them. Off top my head, I don't recall the specs. Also, the GPs don't stay on very long after the engine fires-up ........ less than a minute. So, there shouldn't be any unburned diesel fuel coming out the exhaust pipe. Likely there is some condensate and soot accumulation. Lastly, the GP light is basically an indication that they've begun the cycle.

There are three Glow Plug/Heat Elements in the coolant flange on the end of the head..... only on the 5-speed. Those Heat Elements stay on until the coolant begins to warm-up..... likely controlled by the ECU based on data from the Temp Sensor.

 

[P2B]

You know by the way Im not even sure if my glow plugs work When i turn the key on the symbol comes on briefly then goes off on the instrument panel.

If there is an issue with the glow plug system the ECU will have stored a DTC. Guaranteed. If the glow plug indicator does not stay on longer when ambient is below freezing, the temperature sensor may be at fault.

 

[csstevej]

If it’s taking that long for your car to warm up in Texas you have some issues going on.
In 2 miles my low temp coolant light goes out , 2000 NB , 5 speed , coolant GP’s not working as they are disconnected using my scan guage at temps as of today at around 75 degreesF.

By mile 10 I’m pretty much up to 188F on scan guage.

I would check your coolant temp with Vcds or scan guage to see what it’s reading .

It could be you temp sensor or it could be your thermostat not fully closing , I’ve had both issues not allowing the engine to git to full temp or give erron

Also as you mentioned your blowing foam out your vents , this does not help your heating issues as your mixing cooler air with hot and alls you want is hot air…..gonna have to fix the blend door.

You can also install a frost heater into your car , set it on a timer after you plug it in and your engine will be up to temp when you leave the house…..if it can be plugged in by work then that’s a bonus.

I have installed frost heaters in all our TDI’s for the winters here , when we get home we plug the cars in as they are already at temp , and it’s just keeping them there. Added bonus if you set the temp and direction to windshield just by convection air flow it will help keep your windshield clear of most of the ice and snow.

I’d first start off to see exactly what temp you have after it’s warmed up……the dash guage is worthless…..I’ve had it read 190 on my golf when scanguage says it’s 160 degrees……

And if takes two or three times to fire off when cold and your having white smoke out the back…..your timing is retarded too much , reverify that the timing is spot on to slightly advanced with the lock down tools and then with Vcds.

Just my .02 on this.

 

[AndyBees]

[QUOTE="csstevej,

Just my .02 on this.
[/QUOTE]

Excellent points..

John mentioned foam blowing out the vents. There's a possibility that could be part of the warm-up issue. But, I am not sure how the air is routed for heat vs AC cooling.

And, it is likely the T-stat is opening too quick to allow the engine to warm-up normally.

About 8 miles from my house, on the now obsolete and replaced highway, there was a very long hill to the top of the mountain (about two miles). Then, from the top down to the bottom on the other side was a little over 3 miles. On sub-freezing mornings, I'd allow my Jetta to coast in gear which shuts-down fueling. When I got to the bottom the Temp Gauge would drop considerably off straight up (190). Anyway, the point is, cold ambient really affects the heat output of these little engines and the colder the more the impact.

 

[dieseldonato]

When I bought my jetta I was warned that it took forever to heat up and had low airflow out the vents. Tore the dash apart and did the foil tape fix (didn't read about the plugs till later). I have a 20 minute drive to work and the car makes good heat 5 minutes into the trip. Before I did the door fix I had to keep a little electric dash heater going to keep the windshield defrosted. It took the better part of 5 hours to complete. If the tape ever falls off, I'll be using the plug method.

 

[csstevej]

Andy the air comes over the evaporator regardless of if the ac is in use or not.
The large door that you see in all the pictures is the one that forces the air to go through the heater core, that’s the long thin slot to the left of the large door. If your not forcing air through that slot your not getting heat, what ever does that go through is minimal if that foam is missing.
I tool have a long hill I give down, in the winter I take it in 4th and I watch the temp drop 15 degrees or more.

 

[AndyBees]

So, that explains why the AC is affected with missing foam.... some cooled air goes thru to the heater core.

Well, I did the plugs on my Jetta. I've done the aluminum tape on several New Beetles. On the NBs, I used a Dremel to cut a hole in the heat/AC box to access the blend doors. When I am finished, I JB Weld piece in place then cover with the aluminum tape.

I do have photos of the plug work on my Jetta. I've not uploaded them.

 

[J_dude]

Probably the foam seal between the center double vents and the upper ductwork.

Now that you mention it, given the dimensions he gave of the piece that came out, I think you’re right, there’s several different foam seals between the ducts so that is very likely where it came from.
The blend door foam is such a common issue I guess I didn’t think of that.

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

The advice here is to start and go immediately. That's about how I've always done it. However, the idling engine is warming oil and coolant as well as all the metal, ever so slow though. Rationale is, the diesel fuel could be pushing you toward your destiny instead of being wasted.

If you have a hard-start (longer than normal cranking) on a typical morning now, not winter, well, the Injection Pump may be losing prime. Losing prime is more noticeable after the car sits overnight.

All GPs don't go out at the same time. If one or two GPs are out, the engine will idle pretty rough for a few seconds after you start it. If the GPs are all out, likely the Glow-plug Relay is the culprit. The GPs can be tested with an Ohm Meter without removing them. Off top my head, I don't recall the specs. Also, the GPs don't stay on very long after the engine fires-up ........ less than a minute. So, there shouldn't be any unburned diesel fuel coming out the exhaust pipe. Likely there is some condensate and soot accumulation. Lastly, the GP light is basically an indication that they've begun the cycle.

There are three Glow Plug/Heat Elements in the coolant flange on the end of the head..... only on the 5-speed. Those Heat Elements stay on until the coolant begins to warm-up..... likely controlled by the ECU based on data from the Temp Sensor.

Yep probably a bad temp sensor .

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

If it’s taking that long for your car to warm up in Texas you have some issues going on.
In 2 miles my low temp coolant light goes out , 2000 NB , 5 speed , coolant GP’s not working as they are disconnected using my scan guage at temps as of today at around 75 degreesF.

By mile 10 I’m pretty much up to 188F on scan guage.

I would check your coolant temp with Vcds or scan guage to see what it’s reading .

It could be you temp sensor or it could be your thermostat not fully closing , I’ve had both issues not allowing the engine to git to full temp or give erron

Also as you mentioned your blowing foam out your vents , this does not help your heating issues as your mixing cooler air with hot and alls you want is hot air…..gonna have to fix the blend door.

You can also install a frost heater into your car , set it on a timer after you plug it in and your engine will be up to temp when you leave the house…..if it can be plugged in by work then that’s a bonus.

I have installed frost heaters in all our TDI’s for the winters here , when we get home we plug the cars in as they are already at temp , and it’s just keeping them there. Added bonus if you set the temp and direction to windshield just by convection air flow it will help keep your windshield clear of most of the ice and snow.

I’d first start off to see exactly what temp you have after it’s warmed up……the dash guage is worthless…..I’ve had it read 190 on my golf when scanguage says it’s 160 degrees……

And if takes two or three times to fire off when cold and your having white smoke out the back…..your timing is retarded too much , reverify that the timing is spot on to slightly advanced with the lock down tools and then with Vcds.

Just my .02 on this.

Well the car warms up as it should. The cabin heat takes about 30-45 minutes to heat up. Typical winter here in South Texas temps range in the area of avg. 25-45 degrees. So its cold. In a colder climate like up North or even Dallas I would have big problems trying to heat the cabin up!

 

[J_dude]

Well the car warms up as it should. The cabin heat takes about 30-45 minutes to heat up. Typical winter here in South Texas temps range in the area of avg. 25-45 degrees. So its cold. In a colder climate like up North or even Dallas I would have big problems trying to heat the cabin up!

Have you watched temp with VCDS or a ScanGauge? That dash gauge lies.
Something isn’t right here, 25°F(-4°C) is barely below freezing, maybe heater core plugging up?

 

[John Wesley Hardin]

Have you watched temp with VCDS or a ScanGauge? That dash gauge lies.
Something isn’t right here, 25°F(-4°C) is barely below freezing, maybe heater core plugging up?

Have you watched temp with VCDS or a ScanGauge? That dash gauge lies.
Something isn’t right here, 25°F(-4°C) is barely below freezing, maybe heater core plugging up?

Not sure , so many variables . Trying to isolate the problem . Thanks for all the help from everyone . With the info everyone has provided I believe I will find the solution! Thanks again!