8 hours for a turbo swap ????

Crazy Memphis

Veteran Member
Joined
May 30, 2007
Location
Canada, Québec, Montreal
TDI
VW Jetta TDI 2000
my mecano is charging me 8 hour for a turbo swap with the cleaning of the egr and the intake . ?????????? is that kind of to much ???????

i was more exprecting 3 hour for the swap and 1 hour for the cleaning !!!!!

it's a bolt on 1852 with manifold

please answer back quick cuz i should pay him tomorow morning !!!!
 

Drivbiwire

Zehntes Jahr der Veteran
Joined
Oct 13, 1998
Location
Boise, Idaho
TDI
2013 Passat TDI, Newmar Ventana 8.3L ISC 3945, 2016 E250 BT, 2000 Jetta TDI
I agree 4 hours for labor.

I can routinely get the entire turbo out of a New Beetler in 1.5 hours.

Install is the same time.

Cleaning the EGR...Depends on how far he is taking it...I have a hunch that he will do a quicky job. Now if he is using a diptank..I would guess at most 2 hours for the whole cleaning.

DB
 

Justler

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2003
How much experience does he have in something like this? Could be the reason for the high labor time.
 

Whitbread

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Location
Johannesburg, MI
TDI
Several
8 hours is wayyy to much for a bolt on turbo swap. I changed the clutch on my car in the driveway in 7 hours including food and beer break and clean up without a trans jack. The last time i changed a turbo in a fwd car at a shop we charged 2 hours IIRC. I'd try to speak with him to get it knocked down especially if you're regular.
 

|WYG|Buu

Member
Joined
Sep 19, 2006
Location
Sheboygan, WI
TDI
A4 Jetta soon
If he doesn't have much experience in a turbo swap and it takes him 8 hours to do it while it should take like 4 hours; the custumer shouldn't have to pay for that added expense which is actually like you paying for him to learn.
 

whitedog

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Location
Bend, Oregon
TDI
2004 Jetta that I fill by myself
Whitbread said:
8 hours is wayyy to much for a bolt on turbo swap. I changed the clutch on my car in the driveway in 7 hours including food and beer break and clean up without a trans jack. The last time i changed a turbo in a fwd car at a shop we charged 2 hours IIRC.
I'm sorry, but neither of your examples are of any use in this thread.

One is about a clutch swap.

The other is about "a turbo in a FWD car".

Neither is about a turbo swap in a TDI of this year.
 

whitedog

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Location
Bend, Oregon
TDI
2004 Jetta that I fill by myself
|WYG|Buu said:
If he doesn't have much experience in a turbo swap and it takes him 8 hours to do it while it should take like 4 hours; the custumer shouldn't have to pay for that added expense which is actually like you paying for him to learn.
Tellwit the labor hours, what is the final bill?

DB does it in four hour hours and charges X,XXX.XX dollars.

Your guy charges X,XXX.XX doallars and does it in 24 hours.

Either way you would pay the same, the guys with the wrenches are just working at different pay scales.

You need to ask if the quality of the work is worth the time and money paid.

My bet is that the four hour DB job would be at least as good as the eight hour job by other guy. Since the job is already done though you are in a pickle unless you can work him over on a flat rate.

Also, was there any diagnostic time involved? He should be paid for that as well.
 

penclnck

Member
Joined
May 9, 2001
Location
Knoxville, TN
Take this info with a grain of salt... but from what I can tell, VW warrenty time breaks down like this:

r/r turbo is 290
r/r oil return is 70
r/r oil supply is 50
r/r intake is 110

These are time units, 100 being 1 hour. So the total on there is 520, or just under a tick of 5 hours and 15 minutes.

When I replace a turbo, I always replace the oil supply and return lines, nothing worse than killing a new turbo.:eek: But I find it very odd that VW says it takes more time to replace the oil return line than the oil supply line. Also note that on 99% of the customer pay jobs, the labor time is going to be higher than the warrenty rate, typicial is warrenty rate times 1.5, so 520 X 1.5 = 780 time units.

A few other things to think about... I'm not sure, but I think there is some overlap in the rates I came up with... belly shield being counted twice, and the charge pipes as well. But not counted is how much time is spent on cleaning out the intake and EGR. As I understand it, the labor times are based on using hand tools. VW warrenty can be crazy stupid low. For example, I'm wanting to see the person who can do a complete engine swap in under 4.5 hours (new engine is a bare block, cyclinder head isn't even bolted on) with only hand tools.

Another thing, just because a job is being billed out at X time (5 hours for example) and a tech does the job in Y time (3 horus), don't think you should only pay for Y time (3 hours). You are not so much paying for the time, but the job completed. A good tech shouldn't be taking a pay cut because he/she has purchased thousands of dollars worth of tools and has the skills to do a job quickly. If you think you should be paying for the Y time, then are you ready to pay Y time when a slow tech does the same job?

Anywho... it seems I had too much diet soda and now I can't get to sleep thus I'm rambling on here instead of dreaming about VWs.:rolleyes:
 

Crazy Memphis

Veteran Member
Joined
May 30, 2007
Location
Canada, Québec, Montreal
TDI
VW Jetta TDI 2000
he is charging my 370$ cdn so 350usd for the swap .... he charge 45$ per hour and it take him 7.5 hours so that equal 337.50 $ no taxe cuz i am a really often customer and he charge me 370 $$$$ 370$ should be = to 8hour??? not 7.5 hour.

7.5 hour=370 taxe in at my mecano ( supposedly 45$/hours)
4hour=346.36 taxe in at vw dealer ( with the cleaning at 75.99$/hours)

i know mecano make money on there time and not pieces but this is kinda to much. i towed the car to the dealer and they couldn't swap it before the fest so i decided to town it to my mecano cuz he was cheaper by the hourer and save some money but it took him twice the time so a bit more then what the dealer should have charge me !!!!!!

i even paid for the crappy rental car. with no insurance strait from my pocket. tell me it could be possible to be that slow ...... i will find an other mecano that work on tdi and just screw him off !!!!

when you are expecting to pay 250$ and it's 370$

pissed up Quincy:mad:
 

LNXGUY

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 10, 2004
Location
Barrie, Ont, Canada
TDI
'05 Jetta TDI Wagon
$350 for the swap isn't expensive at all.. Either do it yourself, or pay the price. His per hour labour rate is about $30 less then any mechanic I know of...
 

black_and_chrome

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2004
Location
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
TDI
Black Jetta 2005
Crazy Memphis said:
he is charging my 370$ cdn so 350usd for the swap .... he charge 45$ per hour and it take him 7.5 hours so that equal 337.50 $ no taxe cuz i am a really often customer and he charge me 370 $$$$ 370$ should be = to 8hour??? not 7.5 hour.

7.5 hour=370 taxe in at my mecano ( supposedly 45$/hours)
4hour=346.36 taxe in at vw dealer ( with the cleaning at 75.99$/hours)

i know mecano make money on there time and not pieces but this is kinda to much. i towed the car to the dealer and they couldn't swap it before the fest so i decided to town it to my mecano cuz he was cheaper by the hourer and save some money but it took him twice the time so a bit more then what the dealer should have charge me !!!!!!

i even paid for the crappy rental car. with no insurance strait from my pocket. tell me it could be possible to be that slow ...... i will find an other mecano that work on tdi and just screw him off !!!!

when you are expecting to pay 250$ and it's 370$

pissed up Quincy:mad:

"Ca vas mal dans shop"...lol

The big question is, how is the car running?
 

Kayakkermit

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Location
Ontario
TDI
Jetta TDI, 2002, Silver
7.5 hour=370 taxe in at my mecano ( supposedly 45$/hours)
4hour=346.36 taxe in at vw dealer ( with the cleaning at 75.99$/hours)
AND
when you are expecting to pay 250$ and it's 370$

Why would you be expecting to pay $250 when by your own calculations the going rate is more along $346??
Also, if I read this correctly, you paid $370 instead of $346. Uh, where is the beef? Thats $24, done by a mechanic that you obviously trust as you go to him all the time, instead of the local VW tech that you don't trust.
Forgive me, but this seems like an awful lot of whine for the cheese involved.
 

Dunno513

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2006
Location
Mirror Lake, NH
TDI
2006 NB PD-TDI DSG
Find out what the book labor is for those two services and use this to negotiate. If the mechanic is a real prick, just remind him this will be the last check he gets from you.

I love how mechanics charge by the book time when the real time is shorter and charge by the hour when they forget how to do their job in a timely fashon.
 

Piranha

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2003
Location
Malta (Europe)
TDI
golf 2000 Flash Red
It took me 4 hours to install the turbo, (inc all pipework and intercooler) and cleaning loads of oil from the whole intake after I had blown my previous turbo.

So I would expect a mechanic to do it in less, as i'm sure he's not going to clean an intake as thourouly as i did
 

Doc_Oc

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 22, 2005
Location
Orangeville, Ontario
TDI
03 Golf TDI
Crazy Memphis said:
i even paid for the crappy rental car. with no insurance strait from my pocket. tell me it could be possible to be that slow ...... :mad:
You mean you were able to return that after the abuse I saw you giving it? :p

Talk to your mech and tell him that the dealer quoted you 4 hours...not 8 and tell him you are willing to meet him half way...at 6h but not 8...he might move down a litle.
 

whitedog

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Location
Bend, Oregon
TDI
2004 Jetta that I fill by myself
Kayakkermit said:
7.5 hour=370 taxe in at my mecano ( supposedly 45$/hours)
4hour=346.36 taxe in at vw dealer ( with the cleaning at 75.99$/hours)
AND
when you are expecting to pay 250$ and it's 370$

Why would you be expecting to pay $250 when by your own calculations the going rate is more along $346??
Also, if I read this correctly, you paid $370 instead of $346. Uh, where is the beef? Thats $24, done by a mechanic that you obviously trust as you go to him all the time, instead of the local VW tech that you don't trust.
Forgive me, but this seems like an awful lot of whine for the cheese involved.
Not only was it just $24 difference, His mechanic was able to do it before the Fest and VW wasn't. Being able to meet the deadline is certainly worth money.

I just gotta agree about the whine/cheese ratio.
 

Justler

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2003
ELSA claims 250 2 on a turbo R&R for an ALH car.

Not sure what that means, however.
 

Ed's TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2001
Location
Victoria, BC, Canada
TDI
2001 Bora and 2016 Touareg
Justler said:
ELSA claims 250 2 on a turbo R&R for an ALH car.

Not sure what that means, however.
100 = 1 hour

so that means 250 = 2 and a half hours.

Dunno513 said:
I love how mechanics charge by the book time when the real time is shorter and charge by the hour when they forget how to do their job in a timely fashon.
The book time is what is allowed for the job to be done. Mechanics are supposed to use the allotted time as their guideline. If the job takes less time then allowed, the customer is still charged the full amount of time. This may seem unfair but, on the flip side, if the job takes an extra 1-2 hours, the same rate is (supposed to be) still charged. Unless there are extreme circumstances, the job should have been completed in the allowed time and any extra is absorbed by the shop/mechanic doing the work.
 

Eck

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Sep 21, 2003
Location
was: CA, 95630 now: Bavaria 91058
TDI
Golf TDI 2003 reflex silver 2dr, 5 speed
It took me 5 hours to uninstall the 17/20, take it all apart, clean the vane mechanism and reinstall.
But...if you don't know how to wrench on your own car but still want to have it modified, you better not ask how much $$ mechanics will charge you. You want it modified, you pay and if you have to complain over 3 or 4 hour difference in labor then you simply can't afford to modify your car.
End of story!
 

Justler

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2003
So by this logic, one should expect to pay 2.5 hours of labor (probably charged by the dealer in 3 hour increments). Our dealer rate is $90/hr... so $270 USD to remove and replace your turbo. I assume they would remove and replace your stock turbo with any other turbo, and charge the same fee, so long as everything just "bolted right up".

The end.

Ed's TDI said:
100 = 1 hour

so that means 250 = 2 and a half hours.



The book time is what is allowed for the job to be done. Mechanics are supposed to use the allotted time as their guideline. If the job takes less time then allowed, the customer is still charged the full amount of time. This may seem unfair but, on the flip side, if the job takes an extra 1-2 hours, the same rate is (supposed to be) still charged. Unless there are extreme circumstances, the job should have been completed in the allowed time and any extra is absorbed by the shop/mechanic doing the work.
 

Whitbread

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
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Location
Johannesburg, MI
TDI
Several
I'm sorry my previous response was apparently of no use to some people. As an automotive technician by trade, I was merely stating my opinion from a professional point of view that a much much more involved job could be easily done in the quoted time for just a turbo change. And the turbo I was referring to changing was on a late 80's dodge csx. They are a rear mounted setup just like ours and much more of a pain in the butt to get in and out. So I felt it was a fair comparison and was just attempting to save someone some money.
 

david_594

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Joined
Feb 28, 2004
Location
Cheshire, CT
TDI
2000 Jetta GLS Silver
$350 for an intake cleaning and a turbo swap with a very short term deadline. Thats a steal. His price is totaly fair. I wouldnt even fret of the hours because his labor rate at $45 an hour is down right cheap.

What are you going to do, show up and tell him he shouldnt have been able to do it in 4 hours because thats what vw says? If you do I hope he comes back with "Your right, and bills your for 4 hours at a vw labor rate for $100 an hour."
 

joevat

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Location
Ont,Canada.
TDI
TDI PD
david_594 said:
$350 for an intake cleaning and a turbo swap with a very short term deadline. Thats a steal. His price is totaly fair. I wouldnt even fret of the hours because his labor rate at $45 an hour is down right cheap.

What are you going to do, show up and tell him he shouldnt have been able to do it in 4 hours because thats what vw says? If you do I hope he comes back with "Your right, and bills your for 4 hours at a vw labor rate for $100 an hour."
sounds like to me, thats basically what he did.
 

whitedog

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2004
Location
Bend, Oregon
TDI
2004 Jetta that I fill by myself
Whitbread said:
I'm sorry my previous response was apparently of no use to some people. As an automotive technician by trade, I was merely stating my opinion from a professional point of view that a much much more involved job could be easily done in the quoted time for just a turbo change. And the turbo I was referring to changing was on a late 80's dodge csx. They are a rear mounted setup just like ours and much more of a pain in the butt to get in and out. So I felt it was a fair comparison and was just attempting to save someone some money.
You were talking about me. (Just in case people didn't know.)

Your examples had zero details of how complicated they were, so there was zero basis for comparison. Unless people have a basis for comparison, the example is menaingless.

Let me provide an example:

I can change a turbo in an excavator on a windswept hill with a bucket full of tools in about an hour.

Your example of "a turbo in a fwd car" is just as menaingless as my example because there is no basis for comparison.

Whitbread said:
8 hours is wayyy to much for a bolt on turbo swap. I changed the clutch on my car in the driveway in 7 hours including food and beer break and clean up without a trans jack. The last time i changed a turbo in a fwd car at a shop we charged 2 hours IIRC. I'd try to speak with him to get it knocked down especially if you're regular.
And this is a professional opinion coming from a professional heavy equipment mechanic.
 
Joined
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TDI
Jetta
Whitbread said:
I'm sorry my previous response was apparently of no use to some people. As an automotive technician by trade, I was merely stating my opinion from a professional point of view that a much much more involved job could be easily done in the quoted time for just a turbo change. And the turbo I was referring to changing was on a late 80's dodge csx. They are a rear mounted setup just like ours and much more of a pain in the butt to get in and out. So I felt it was a fair comparison and was just attempting to save someone some money.
Don't bother trying to tell your actual technician, real world experience in these forums.
You will get second guessed, attacked and ridiculed by the know it alls and their clan.

Funny though, if they state something about how something is done in their job, you probably would not ridicule.
This is an example of the charactor of this forum.
 

40X40

Experienced
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Location
Kansas City area, MO
TDI
2013 Passat SEL Premium
VWDiesel Addict said:
Don't bother trying to tell your actual technician, real world experience in these forums.
You will get second guessed, attacked and ridiculed by the know it alls and their clan.

Funny though, if they state something about how something is done in their job, you probably would not ridicule.
This is an example of the charactor of this forum.
Other than disagreeing with a lot of the people here and being located at 'MOM'S', What are your qualifications? What do you do for a living?

We MIGHT listen to you if you started making more sense and less personal attacks.

Or should I just leave you in the 'newbie troll' column you picked with your very first post??

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=1849106&postcount=13

If you don't like it here, WHY are you here at all?

Bill
 
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