507hp TDi. 423hp without NOS, Anyone got any bigger numbers?

[ryanp]

Just thought i would post a picture of our latest dyno graph:

These figures are Brake Horse Power, our dyno is known to be a heartbreaker and from previous tests it looks like a Dynojet or Mustang would read about the same but at the wheels, not a dyno debate anyway...

The turbo is a Borg Warner S356v running 45psi boost with 30psi EMP so could easily run 60psi+ if it keeps making power. The engine is a 2.0 16v BKD (PD)

We have had a little more than this but the boost control was not so good (spike of 60psi made 461hp without nos) and power dropped at upper RPM. We also have another 50% NOS in reserve should we need a bit more at the track!
This is on a totally stock Long block, had a few issues with our built engine so we have ran stock engines the last couple of outings, we are trying to test them to destruction, so far its just the head castings being porous that have stopped play.

Although the turbo is very large we have managed to make 35psi boost while staged @ 4500rpm so in theory we should be able to make a good launch right into the power. The gearing is just about perfect for these curves, should drop right into the sweetspot.

We have an event this weekend so fingers crossed we can beat our best time from well over a year ago!! Launching has been my worst problem, i'm just not a good driver!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2hIT8C5HSg

 

[martin_r_smith]

Simply awesome.

 

[Yucca]

Very nice numbers Ryan!

I like that charger very much. It is quite big for 1/4 mile but i hope you can make new record.

Can i ask what 16V nozzles do you use?

 

[Brent_B]

Awesome

 

[majesty78]

M5 V10 Power in a Arosa, nice

 

[Layerz]

Nice! Now just to put it through VW's emission tests

Looking forward to the outcome! Thought can't see the images attached.

 

[numbnuts]

Hey ryan, awesome numbers and amazing that the stock long lock takes it
I would just like to say I am an amazing driver if you wouldike to call on my services this weekend drop me a line

 

[sam-]

Amazing achievement, hope record follow, best luck

ps: will you get an On board cam this week end ?

 

[KERMA]

There's no getting around it: Those numbers are impressive. 250 hp/liter

 

[sandmansans]

Holy mother of Jesus...That is nucking futs!

Just out of curiosity and to perhaps throw at some tree hugger, what kind of MPG do you get in Satan's sleigh..I mean your car when not at the track?!

 

[bhodgkiss]

Which gearbox will take 600ft.lbs?
Wowsers

 

[andy2]

That's Great news about the big turbo.You'll be able to launch with it fine.Keeping on top of the turbo between shifts has been an issue I've had in the past. I'm also heading to the track this weekend with mine,Fingers crossed. Good Luck Ryan !

I dug up my old dyno printout from 2011 its in wheel horsepower.

 

[ATR]

Subscribed

Great job!

I'm also wondering what mods are needed to allow the transmission to hold the massive amount of torque.

 

[ryanp]

Sorry, Fixed the Images now

We use Firad Nozzles, we need something like 200% upgrade if we want to make more power.

I can gain +20hp with adjusted cam timing but the pistons hit the valves on a stock engine if you do that!

We hope to have 3 cameras on the car and at least 2 filming! I made a mis-shift earlier in the year and the back wheels came 6" off the ground, no-one filmed it...

Joel, I decline you offer to drive the car, i refuse to pay for someone else to break my car, hahaha

One of the other guys ran his Ibiza with the same engine/injectors but 2566 turbo, made 500lbs and 350hp every time we dyno'd it, that returned about 45mpg average day to day.

We run a modded 02M, this is the second gearbox with this spec, the first one stripped 4th on the dyno but we had a funny feeling it was our mistake so the latest gearbox is fresh and not a mix match of casings, gears and bearings. We run a 4th gear support brace and a casing support and sometimes we have ran them with a retrofit input shaft Spigot bearing but time did not allow it this time around!

Andy, good luck for this weekend, what power do you expect to have now? The turbo, even with a very rough tune, never dropped below 2-bar boost on the 1 run i did a couple of months back. I wish i had a cast Iron head! haha

 

[mk1-83]

nice work Ryan youre setup is nuts in a arosa.

 

[Layerz]

I assume it's easier to replace as they brake.

But what can the drive shafts take? And do options like carbon come into play etc...

Or because as I mentioned above, easier to break and replace?

 

[Digital Corpus]

And so little smoke in that drag run. Very nicely tuned.

 

[ryanp]

Never broke a driveshaft, i just ordered brand new genuine CV joints and had the shafts made locally. You can buy GKN Motorsport inner CV joints but those would only help for a track car i think.
I'll post a video of boost vs EMP later, not much smoke there until you get some load on it!

 

[p0wer]

Very nice numbers Ryan! Does your dyno show only total power coming out from wheels, or does it calculate engine power with measured rolling loss after the pull?

Most of our dynos in Finland shows usually both, although its naturally to tell engine power instead wheel power since manufacturers does it that way too.

 

[ryanp]

DD calculate the losses, Its easy enough to get the WHP figures from the dyno, its 5 miles away from me ATM but i can get them no problem. I must admit i never look at them as like you say, everyone wants to compare to stock manufacturer figures.

 

[p0wer]

I mean, manufacturer specs are always engine power as you know, not wheel power. That´s the same way that we usually measure here too, so no difference on this one. Just wanted to be sure this slip is engine (or flywheel, as mentioned on slip) power, not wheel power. Personally, i really don´t care about wheel power when comparing quite same kinda cars.

However, congrats. I am trying close 400hp without nos from my dailydriven 1.9 VE at end of next month. With ~402hp would be about same hp/liter ratio, but maybe just can´t make it. That´s DD dyno too, where i´m heading this time.

Spooling is very much same as on your setup, boost about same also. Revs much higher with full power though.

 

[ryanp]

Yeah i got ya, would be nice to see a true coastdown loss for diagnosis, had a few cars with issues that would be easy to prove with coastdown loss!

400hp from VE will be nice, I dont think the extra .1L makes a difference, my 2.0 8v with same spec as stock 1.9 8v has the same power for same spec.

Shame the engine wont keep making power at upper RPM like a VE! i dont 'need' to rev past 5600/5700rpm but i might add a few 100 more if 2nd - 3rd is too long in reality. I've only lost 250rpm compared to the 2566 we had before. Of course from 1000-3000rpm almost it wont drive as good but i never see those RPM's at the track!

do you run the 1/4 mile in your car?

 

[ryanp]

Got a Video of the Boost vs EMP while stationary

https://youtu.be/ihmpCaGf8lo

 

[v8 coupe]

Wow great numbers gives me hope of hitting them in my 16v CR TDI.

 

[p0wer]

Yeah i got ya, would be nice to see a true coastdown loss for diagnosis, had a few cars with issues that would be easy to prove with coastdown loss!

400hp from VE will be nice, I dont think the extra .1L makes a difference, my 2.0 8v with same spec as stock 1.9 8v has the same power for same spec.

Shame the engine wont keep making power at upper RPM like a VE! i dont 'need' to rev past 5600/5700rpm but i might add a few 100 more if 2nd - 3rd is too long in reality. I've only lost 250rpm compared to the 2566 we had before. Of course from 1000-3000rpm almost it wont drive as good but i never see those RPM's at the track!

do you run the 1/4 mile in your car?

True, it´s not that significant difference between these 2 size of engines, only 10-20hp which can be reached maybe. Also it´s amusing that my WG turbo with 80´s turbine spools about as good as S356, 3 bar can be reached below 3500rpm without stall. I also have one S356V on shelf, maybe i´ll try that too some day. Although i like this Holset very much on daily driving too.

I tried 1/4 once, didn´t have that good time but got 184km/h end speed. Tried 1 mile month ago and got ~265km/h. Car weights maybe 1250kg, totally stock interior etc. Here´s 2 videos which i posted to another thread earlier as well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzWA8dayfuI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKofLl3O2s8

Got a Video of the Boost vs EMP while stationary

https://youtu.be/ihmpCaGf8lo

Do you really have 65psi EMP with 35psi of boost?

 

[andy2]

Andy, good luck for this weekend, what power do you expect to have now? The turbo, even with a very rough tune, never dropped below 2-bar boost on the 1 run i did a couple of months back. I wish i had a cast Iron head! haha

Thanks,I think that we were only making somthing like 375bhp currently.Hopefully some improvments that have been made will get over 400 bhp again.We might have some work to do for next year to get around the 500 bhp mark.

The only issue with the iron head is that the block isn't a whole lot stronger.

 

[numbnuts]

What I notice Ryan from watching many fwd tdi launches on YouTube (I have done too much research in this area) is that it seems to be best to rev out the engine whilst staged, then drop the clutch in 2nd gear, let it wheelspin and then snatch third and get traction. Seem to waste too much time with 1st gear

 

[[486]]

Do you really have 65psi EMP with 35psi of boost?

They're just revving it with no load, without any heat to lose across the turbine, the only other way to impart energy into the turbine is with a lot of pressure drop.

 

[bloc]

Keeping on top of the turbo between shifts has been an issue I've had in the past.

I was thinking about this the other day... Would there be a way to rig up a blow off valve to work without a throttle plate (sense throttle lift, clutch, etc) to at least reduce back pressure and keep the turbo spinning between shifts? It might need tuning to avoid dumping ALL of the pressure.. But kinda seems like a solution for this problem?

Obviously not an issue on a stock car but when we are talking 50+psi with little to no fuel keeping the hot side hot, that wheel will slow down quickly.

 

[[486]]

I was thinking about this the other day... Would there be a way to rig up a blow off valve to work without a throttle plate (sense throttle lift, clutch, etc) to at least reduce back pressure and keep the turbo spinning between shifts? It might need tuning to avoid dumping ALL of the pressure.. But kinda seems like a solution for this problem?
Obviously not an issue on a stock car but when we are talking 50+psi with little to no fuel keeping the hot side hot, that wheel will slow down quickly.

I've thought on a propane antilag system, the exhaust is already oxygen rich, just dump it in there, maybe have to light it off with an ignition coil and a spark plug, maybe there's enough heat in there for autoignition.
Dunno how it'd get along with the computer's vane control though. Probably cook the vanes anyways. On a WG turbo, just find a way to light it off and the wastegate(s)'ll figure out the rest.