2015 Sportwagen Tow Rating

[jdummer]

Towing with the TDI DSG combination

I just arrived in Lake Tahoe from San Diego towing a Little Guy Silver Shadow with a 2013 Gulf TDI DSG. The gulf pulled the roughly 1500 pounds with ease. Went over the Tejon and various Sierra mountain passes on cruise control going 65mph. The most comfortable tow experience I have had. Decided to test out the US VW warning that the TDI DSG combo will lead to certain drive train failure. This was the first leg of a 4000 mi trip to the Canadian Rockies, so I will have plenty of oportunity to test the performance and realizability.

 

[CraziFuzzy]

I understand that some years ago the 5 mph requirement was changed to 2.5.
There is little difference in the stock bar and the OEM hitch bar. Perhaps 1/2" of rubber between the bar and the steel bars.

That rubber is exactly what constitutes the 5mph bumper. The tow bar, on the other hand, would transfer any force directly to the major structure of the vehicle.

 

[redbarron55]

Towing and specifications for Variant (Sportwagen)

http://www.volkswagen.de/de/models/...7a|trimlevel=af0f4cde6012bbdd2e6236941d472ec6

Towing and specifications for Golf

http://www.volkswagen.de/de/models/...de|trimlevel=20ec34909f7ac4a8b14b576a67275897

 

[CraziFuzzy]

Towing and specifications for Variant (Sportwagen)

http://www.volkswagen.de/de/models/...7a|trimlevel=af0f4cde6012bbdd2e6236941d472ec6

For those with no sprechen, it looks like

Towing 12% grade with trailer brakes: 1,600kg (3,500 lbs)
Towing 8% grade with trailer brakes: 1,800kg (4,000 lbs)
Towing without trailer brakes: 720kg (1,500 lbs)
Tongue weight: 80kg (175 lbs)

Those are some pretty hefty ratings, and I certainly wouldn't push near them, on a drivability aspect alone. Having such a light tongue weight limit is likely going to make the rig more susceptible to swaying. I've always looked to have tongue weight between 10-15% of the trailer weight. Assuming the max 3,500 lb trailer limit above, that would put ideal tongue weights at 350-525. Reversing that, staying within the 175 lb tongue weight limit puts a practical trailer weight limit at 1750 lbs before sway would start to be a problem.

 

[gen3ric]

curt has one for the 2015 diesel (i'm not sure about the JSW)

 

[fz1miller]

I just arrived in Lake Tahoe from San Diego towing a Little Guy Silver Shadow with a 2013 Gulf TDI DSG. The gulf pulled the roughly 1500 pounds with ease. Went over the Tejon and various Sierra mountain passes on cruise control going 65mph. The most comfortable tow experience I have had. Decided to test out the US VW warning that the TDI DSG combo will lead to certain drive train failure. This was the first leg of a 4000 mi trip to the Canadian Rockies, so I will have plenty of oportunity to test the performance and realizability.

Subscribed. Get us some pics please.

 

[dieseltdi]

Here is the translation from the German VW site for the 2015 Jetta Bluemotion TDI with DSG (150 hp model with 6 speed DSG).
Empty weight - 3192 lbs
Total weight (loaded GVW) - 4321 lbs
Payload - 1294 lbs
Axle load (GAW) front/year - 2337/2094 lbs
Trailer Weight, braked, 12%/8% grades - 3307 lbs/3748 lbs
Trailer Weight, unbraked, 1587 lbs
Vertical load (tongue weight) 165 lbs

 

[nakkers]

So does anyone have clear and definitive tow ratings for MT6 Golf/Jetta TDI in NA?


I know my 2014 GSW with DSG is a no go according to VW.


Our 05 Matrix is likely due to be replaced. Looking at a new Golf variant with manual Transmission. Before I wander to the Dealer, just doing some web research. VW web site doesn't mention tow capacity. Just wondering if it's a no go.

We camp a lot and a hitch would be nice. Our GSW is a company supplied vehicle so, can't go against manufacturer.

We've towed a pop up trailer with the Matrix and it manages just fine because we take it easy and don't go far.


Just love the driving dynamics of the VW and TDI powertrain. Prefer a manual tranny and it will be our car we can equip it the way we want.

 

[Bikebits]

So does anyone have clear and definitive tow ratings for MT6 Golf/Jetta TDI in NA?

The short answer is "no".

VW is playing both sides of the fence on this in North America. We all know the Golf is approved for towing in other markets, even with OEM hitches and wiring available.

The 2015 Canadian GSW owner's manual devotes a full eight pages to trailer towing, including illustrations that clearly show the European style tow bar. On the chart on page 70, it shows information for both the TSI and TDI and explicitly prohibits towing with the DSG. But, there is a footnote in every box on the towing weight chart stating "Information not available at time of printing".

For all the things VW has done right with the GSW, I don't understand why they can't come up with a clear answer on this. If this car is rated and supported by the manufacturer for towing in ROW markets, why can't they do that in North America? As it sits, with no factory approved towing equipment available, you know dealers and VW corporate could use it as an excuse to deny any warranty claim that could remotely be related to towing. Both dealers I spoke to would not condone towing but couldn't answer why there was a section in the manual regarding it.

There has to be some fear that in the litigious US market (and in a case of guilt by association, Canada) they don't want to sanction towing. That being said, why have the eight pages in the Manual?

As an aside, BMW won't sell its branded motorcycle helmets in the USA, out of fear of possible litigation, but does sell them in Canada. They have put the Canadian dealers on notice if they are caught selling to US residents they will be severely sanctioned. VW probably doesn't want to deal with a similar scenario of Canadian dealers supplying forbidden goods to US buyers.

 

[nakkers]

The short answer is "no".

VW is playing both sides of the fence on this in North America. We all know the Golf is approved for towing in other markets, even with OEM hitches and wiring available.

The 2015 Canadian GSW owner's manual devotes a full eight pages to trailer towing, including illustrations that clearly show the European style tow bar. On the chart on page 70, it shows information for both the TSI and TDI and explicitly prohibits towing with the DSG. But, there is a footnote in every box on the towing weight chart stating "Information not available at time of printing".

For all the things VW has done right with the GSW, I don't understand why they can't come up with a clear answer on this. If this car is rated and supported by the manufacturer for towing in ROW markets, why can't they do that in North America? As it sits, with no factory approved towing equipment available, you know dealers and VW corporate could use it as an excuse to deny any warranty claim that could remotely be related to towing. Both dealers I spoke to would not condone towing but couldn't answer why there was a section in the manual regarding it.

There has to be some fear that in the litigious US market (and in a case of guilt by association, Canada) they don't want to sanction towing. That being said, why have the eight pages in the Manual?

As an aside, BMW won't sell its branded motorcycle helmets in the USA, out of fear of possible litigation, but does sell them in Canada. They have put the Canadian dealers on notice if they are caught selling to US residents they will be severely sanctioned. VW probably doesn't want to deal with a similar scenario of Canadian dealers supplying forbidden goods to US buyers.

So NO to DSG. That much is clear.

MT6? No specs but, there is info on towing etc.

I'm looking at a lighter pop up in the 1000 to 1200 range. maybe a utility trailer for my motorcycle.


I guess I head to the dealer and see what they can provide me.Not going to take the sales associate's word.

Thanks for the reply. Much appreciated.

 

[davidlp]

Okay, straight from my 2015 owners manual:
TDI 6spd - "information not available at time of printing"
TDI DSG - "This vehicle cannot be used to tow a trailer!"

Not much help, eh?

 

[nakkers]

Okay, straight from my 2015 owners manual:
TDI 6spd - "information not available at time of printing"
TDI DSG - "This vehicle cannot be used to tow a trailer!"

Not much help, eh?

That is terrible. It's not rocket science.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Gaspereaux]

2013 TDI JSW Hitch / Lighting

I equipped a 2009 TDI GSW that I used to tow a 20' 2400 lb sailboat many thousands of miles without experiencing any issues in MA and NH - even passing other vehicles going up Pinkham Notch with power to spare. While towing on the highway, I was able to get about 26 MPG. VW America published tow ratings for this vehicle. I now have a 2013 TDI GSW and as discussed here VW says no towing but I have installed a U-Haul hitch. Uhaul was unable to get the lighting set. Would the lighting set for a 2009 work on the 2013. I think so but can anyone confirm that. I plan to tow to the European specs with a trailer equipped with brakes on a 1500 mile run from the Boston MA area to South West FL.

 

[South Coast Guy]

I equipped a 2009 TDI GSW that I used to tow a 20' 2400 lb sailboat many thousands of miles without experiencing any issues in MA and NH - even passing other vehicles going up Pinkham Notch with power to spare. While towing on the highway, I was able to get about 26 MPG. VW America published tow ratings for this vehicle. I now have a 2013 TDI GSW and as discussed here VW says no towing but I have installed a U-Haul hitch. Uhaul was unable to get the lighting set. Would the lighting set for a 2009 work on the 2013. I think so but can anyone confirm that. I plan to tow to the European specs with a trailer equipped with brakes on a 1500 mile run from the Boston MA area to South West FL.

DSG or manual transmission? You say your owner's manual says no towing but you are going to anyway? If you have a failure of brakes or transmission while towing don't expect any warranty. What if you have an accident while towing? Will your insurance company cover you even though the manufacturer says no towing?

 

[use2h8VW]

The Hidden Htch model 60632 was installed today on my 2015 VW Golf Sportwagen TDI Highline by a local shop north of Toronto (King City Trailers). They said that it took them a bit longer than expected. I only got delivery of the wagon on Monday. I note that EcoHitch came out with a nice design and announcement yesterday about a compatible hitch fit the 2015 Sportwagen, but wait time to get it to Canada was going to be almost a month and I would also have to pay shipping costs and import duties to have it delivered from Washington State. Using it for a hitch mounted bike carrier this coming weekend.

Do you have a link to the hitch that you bought. I can't seem to find one. I also have a '15 GSW TDI and have been looking for a hitch for it

 

[skramer]

Do you have a link to the hitch that you bought. I can't seem to find one. I also have a '15 GSW TDI and have been looking for a hitch for it

http://www.etrailer.com/hitch-2015_Volkswagen_Golf+SportWagen.htm

http://torkliftcentral.com/trailer-...agen/2015-volkswagen-golf-sportwagen-ecohitch

Two that I know fit the GSW TDI's

 

[BeninNB]

It's all BS

This spring I traded in a 2012 Ford Focus with DSG(yes the new focuses have dual clutch auto) for a 15 Golf wagon TDI with DSG.
In 2013 I installed a hitch on the Focus at a ford dealer and towed 2,500lbs(small enclosed UHaul trailer with all our junk) 1 thousand miles....15 hour drive for a family move. I used the focus for another 3 years with no problems. People! The focus only has 160hp and 135lbs of torque.
The new VW wagon has 150hp and 235lbs of TORQUE.

Guess what! I recently installed a hitch on my wagon and did the same trip back with a bigger UHaul trailer....total weight in my estimation is close to 3,000lbs. It's been a months since the trip and I am still fully enjoying the wagon TDI getting amazing mileage. Getting 500 miles per tank mixed driving and not broken in yet! Only have 8,000 mile on it.

Trust me.....These cars can do it ...just like the Europeans say.

 

[Smokn337]

Trust me.....These cars can do it ...just like the Europeans say.

Playing the devil's advocate here, yes the cars can do it. However, VW in Europe has specific mounting points where the hitch must be placed in order to not void warranty. The only hitch I've seen that fits VW Europe's criteria is the European OEM hitch. VW North America does not have a tow rating nor have they authorized the use of a hitch. If you are in warranty and have engine or transmission issues, VW can void your warranty simply by the hitch being mounted. Be nice to your dealer and they may look the other way. If a VW warranty rep needs to look at it, you may be in trouble...

 

[CraziFuzzy]

Playing the devil's advocate here, yes the cars can do it. However, VW in Europe has specific mounting points where the hitch must be placed in order to not void warranty. The only hitch I've seen that fits VW Europe's criteria is the European OEM hitch. VW North America does not have a tow rating nor have they authorized the use of a hitch. If you are in warranty and have engine or transmission issues, VW can void your warranty simply by the hitch being mounted. Be nice to your dealer and they may look the other way. If a VW warranty rep needs to look at it, you may be in trouble...

Or remove four bolts and remove the hitch.

 

[South Coast Guy]

Consider this scenario. You are involved in an accident and are at fault. The other driver sues, and discovers you were towing when the manufacturer says no towing. Do you think your insurance company is going to cover this?

 

[CraziFuzzy]

Consider this scenario. You are involved in an accident and are at fault. The other driver sues, and discovers you were towing when the manufacturer says no towing. Do you think your insurance company is going to cover this?

They'd still have to show that the towing itself was the cause of the accident.

 

[South Coast Guy]

Maybe, maybe not. A judge or jury could apply a greater percentage of responsibility based on the fact that you were using the car for a purpose not approved by the manufacturer. It is the same as racing your car. Your car insurance policy will not cover any damage caused when you are racing (involved in a contest of speed).

 

[Smokn337]

Or remove four bolts and remove the hitch.

You would do this every time your car goes to the dealer for something?

All I am saying is you are potentially giving up your warranty at this point if you install a hitch. Even if you only use it for a bike rack. You're giving VW an out clause on the warranty.

 

[CraziFuzzy]

You would do this every time your car goes to the dealer for something?
All I am saying is you are potentially giving up your warranty at this point if you install a hitch. Even if you only use it for a bike rack. You're giving VW an out clause on the warranty.

The lack of caring and competence in most dealers wouldn't even notice the euro hitch being there.

 

[dgoodhue]

You would do this every time your car goes to the dealer for something?

All I am saying is you are potentially giving up your warranty at this point if you install a hitch. Even if you only use it for a bike rack. You're giving VW an out clause on the warranty.

Tell them its for a hitch mounted bike rack.

 

[Smokn337]

The lack of caring and competence in most dealers wouldn't even notice the euro hitch being there.

Trust me if you go in with engine or transmission problems that are significant, the VW rep will probably get involved and his job is to look for a reason to not warranty it.

Your only saving grace would be if you had the European VW specific hitch mounted to the European VW mounting positions on the vehicle's frame.

As for saying it was only for a bike rack, VW owns the warranty, you placed a non approved aftermarket piece of equipment on the vehicle. The onus will be on you to prove to VW that you didn't use it for towing and for them to believe you.

As for my experience with VW warranty reps, my '02 337's spoiler had paint that was very thin and basically weathered away on one corner after 2 years. They said it wasn't warranty because it appeared the car had been buffed with a high speed buffer. I had never used a high speed buffer on the car up to that point and told them so. They didn't believe me and wouldn't warranty it. My word against theirs, they own the final decision as it's their warranty.

I liken this to doing your own oil changes while under warranty. If you have engine issues, you now need to prove the oil and filter met their specs to obtain warranty service.

VW has their reasons for not recommending towing allowances or providing a tow rating and OEM hitch for the litigious North American market...

 

[Bikebits]

As for saying it was only for a bike rack, VW owns the warranty, you placed a non approved aftermarket piece of equipment on the vehicle. The onus will be on you to prove to VW that you didn't use it for towing and for them to believe you.

Having a trailer wiring harness is an indicator that one is towing a trailer. Not having a trailer wiring harness installed would go a long way in backing up the hitch was only for a bike rack.

Even the little Fiat 500 has an OEM factory hitch available in North America, rated only for a bike rack, with no wiring harness available.

 

[Smokn337]

Having a trailer wiring harness is an indicator that one is towing a trailer. Not having a trailer wiring harness installed would go a long way in backing up the hitch was only for a bike rack.

Even the little Fiat 500 has an OEM factory hitch available in North America, rated only for a bike rack, with no wiring harness available.

Agreed, but other than the European OEM hitch, no aftermarket hitches are mounted to the frame as per VW Europe's guidelines.

 

[Mark]

http://thegarage.jalopnik.com/dont-let-the-car-company-falsely-accuse-you-of-abuse-wh-1736064825

The hitch might make them claim "abuse". The problem is they need to prove abuse, just claiming it is not enough in the eyes of the court.

This 1986 case revolves around a man named Thomas Waldock who bought himself a BMW 320i three years prior. It was warranted as such a car should be, but when he brought it in complaining that the engine failed, BMW refused repairs, saying the engine failure was the result of him over revving the engine.

Waldock “vehemently disputed” this contention and was left to file suit. I’ve always enjoyed this case (it was in one of the textbooks I used when teaching Consumer Law) for a couple reasons. One is that it’s from Alaska.

The other is that the court pointed out that if you are in this situation, it is not enough for the manufacturer to merely allege that you abused the vehicle. They must prove it. Of course, that will mean being in court as well but the burden of proof is on them.

So, as the court wisely noted: The consumer must prove that he had a warranted failure by a preponderance of the evidence. If the defendant wants to raise “abuse” as a defense, then it must prove abuse also by a preponderance of the evidence.

 

[nakkers]

http://thegarage.jalopnik.com/dont-let-the-car-company-falsely-accuse-you-of-abuse-wh-1736064825

The hitch might make them claim "abuse". The problem is they need to prove abuse, just claiming it is not enough in the eyes of the court.

Who has the time to battle them in court if they refuse to repair under warranty?

That's the problem.


I think it's ok to have a hitch and say it's for a bike rack or what ever. The problem is having a wiring harness and or having a breakdown while actually towing something.

For most, they will sheepishly acknowledge the owners manual specifically states towing isn't recommended etc.

Either way, they hold the cards if you can't drive a broken car and expect them to repair it under warranty.