2015 Passat and Regeneration Issue

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
I appreciate your opinion and I mostly agree that that's how it *should* be, but the world isn't perfect and some of the modern emissions devices do handicap these vehicles in terms of fuel economy, price, longevity, etc.

We are here to share information and make the most of what we have. I understand that lots of people buy cars as appliances to get from A to B. TDIs have never been the best ignorable appliances, which is why this community has flourished.
 

eats1963

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2007
Location
Saint Anne, IL
TDI
2015 Passat TDI SEL Premium
My two cents on this subject would be that VW should have put some type of indicator on the dash to let you know when your in a regen cycle. I purchased a Scangauge so I can see when my DPF temp jumps up into the 1000's. That way I don't inadvertently shut off the car in the middle of a cycle. Just had my 20,000 oil change and inspection done yesterday, and they also did the ECM update. I've had my 2015 since 1/2/2015 and so far just loving this car. I do miss the higher MPG's that I used to get on my 2001 Jetta TDI 5 speed though, but still impressive for a car this size.
 
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showdown 42

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2012
Location
naples,FL
TDI
2016 TDI touareg
90 % of the car buyers would have nothing to do with a car that needed some kind of special driving to keep it going ,hell a 1955 chevy is more reliable.in fact my 1978 Alfa Romeo spider has been more reliable, how scary is that for all the VW execs. BTW I do love my JSW TDI, BUT you drive with your fingers crossed.
 

jrm

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2013
Location
Oregon
TDI
2013 Passat SE with nav (totaled)
That mite be changing as I work with very diverse crowd and it seems that the generation x are pretty lazy and just drive until it runs out of oil and blows a rod threw the block. But the younger "millennial" generation really dig learning about how their ride works- I work with many people digging the tech and love to understand their ride- here are a few examples:

19 year old female coworker drives a leaf and wears a coat to avoid using the heat to get extra range
21 year old guy, drives a prius with the solar panel, parks in the sunny spots to get free ac on lunch.
20 year old guy, bmw 335i constantly uploading tunes.
All the above are very intrigued by my Passat and respect its size and fuel range while the older co-workers have the "who on earth would wait 5 minutes" for it to cool down mindset.
 
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NSTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Location
Nova Scotia
TDI
13 Passat Sep 12
I appreciate your opinion and I mostly agree that that's how it *should* be, but the world isn't perfect and some of the modern emissions devices do handicap these vehicles in terms of fuel economy, price, longevity, etc.

We are here to share information and make the most of what we have. I understand that lots of people buy cars as appliances to get from A to B. TDIs have never been the best ignorable appliances, which is why this community has flourished.
My 1998 NB TDI was "ignorable" from the point of view that if you did regular maintenance per what is in the manual, there were not a lot of issues to worry about. The addition of urea has added a lot of what appears to be non "ignorable" issues. I don't recall issues with turbos going frequently at under 1000 miles.

I am not convinced that interrupting regens causes issues with turbos blowing up, considering the low mileage on some blown turbos, like under 1000 miles. Same goes for urea issues, also happening at very low miles. I think in both cases it is a design that is "sensitive" and if a part is the least bit "off spec" it fails.

Many of us who buy VW diesels do so to put a lot of trouble free miles on them, say 300,000, without major components blowing up and costing a fortune to fix. My Beetle with 350,000 drove as solid as it did when new. Turbo wise, I had to put a new actuator on it. That's it.

Don
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
Let's not confused the premature "infant mortality" Passat turbo failures with cumulative lifespan reduction from hot shutdowns; they are two completely separate issues. The former is a small turbo that is being stressed during warm-up with high boost, high temperatures, and cold viscous oil, perhaps compounded by a component design flaw, and an obvious programming design flaw (that VW addressed with the 23N5 software revision). The latter involves bearing coking from overheating the oil when the engine is shut down at high temperatures. The latter may also be a contributing factor to cracked DPFs, but that's speculation on my part.
 
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NSTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Location
Nova Scotia
TDI
13 Passat Sep 12
Let's not confused the premature "infant mortality" Passat turbo failures with cumulative lifespan reduction from hot shutdowns; they are two completely separate issues. The former is a small turbo that is being stressed during warm-up with high boost, high temperatures, and cold viscous oil, perhaps compounded by a component design flaw, and an obvious programming design flaw (that VW addressed with the 23N5 software revision). The latter involves bearing coking from overheating the oil when the engine is shut down at high temperatures. The latter may also be a contributing factor to cracked DPFs, but that's speculation on my part.
I think the bearing coking etc. is speculation as well since I am sure many people interrupt regens all the time and the turbo doesn't fail (since it says nothing about that in the manual and most owners do not visit this site so how would they know). Most of what we discuss on the causes of turbo issues is speculation?

Don
 

Lightflyer1

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 13, 2005
Location
Round Rock, Texas
TDI
2015 Beetle tdi dsg
90 % of the car buyers would have nothing to do with a car that needed some kind of special driving to keep it going ,hell a 1955 chevy is more reliable.in fact my 1978 Alfa Romeo spider has been more reliable, how scary is that for all the VW execs. BTW I do love my JSW TDI, BUT you drive with your fingers crossed.
As cars get more complicated it is harder and harder to make them reliable. It is amazing that they do as well as they do. My 1935 Ford is pretty darn reliable too, but it is about as simple as it can get. It in no way compares to anything modern as neither of your two examples do either. I would much rather be involved in a crash with my Passat than either of the 3 cars discussed here. Much more safety built in and it is very complex to implement. I generally have to do nothing about regens, but I do like to know when they are happening, just like I like to know oil pressure and water temp.
 
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VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
I think the bearing coking etc. is speculation as well since I am sure many people interrupt regens all the time and the turbo doesn't fail (since it says nothing about that in the manual and most owners do not visit this site so how would they know). Most of what we discuss on the causes of turbo issues is speculation?

Don
I dunno... there sure seem to be quite a few turbo failures out there that many people would consider to be short-lived. As most people don't autopsy them and instead toss them in the bin, there is no way to verify the cause of failure. The speculation isn't wild and out there - it's based on sound information from decades of turbochargers being on internal combustion engines. Volkswagen's turbos aren't particularly special or unique, and are arguably more high strung and on-the-edge than large lazy turbos from the past.

As for "most of what we discuss on the causes of turbo issues is speculation," I hit the nail directly on the head when I suggested that Volkswagen's warm-up strategy was the leading contributor to premature turbo failures on new Passats. That speculation on my part was quickly followed by a software revision from Volkswagen to reduce the aggressiveness of the warm-up mode as well as a turbo warranty extension.

So at the end of the day, you're right - I don't have evidence directly linking any of these things together, and that's okay because more data will become available as these cars age. :)
 
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NSTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Location
Nova Scotia
TDI
13 Passat Sep 12
I agree with what you are saying- at this point too early to say, but your speculation may be correct.

Don
 

ThatGuyYouKnow

New member
Joined
Aug 8, 2015
Location
Minnesota, United States
TDI
2015 Volkswagen Passat 2.0TDI SE
Even if...

^^^exactly this. I've used this "excuse" many times here in my new neighborhood, Ft. Worth. I've got a good idea where all the good destinations are...Mex. restaurants, Mex. restaurants, Mex. restaurants...etc...
Even if you can't spare the time, you should get a good warm up in by leaving to wherever you're going early and then letting the car warm up to operating temp when you get to your destination. VW says you can drive without warming up first, so let it idle for about 15-30 seconds and go; then let it warm up outside your destination. I agree though, driving another couple miles just because is always nice.
 
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