2013 Passat: Impressive

nord

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2010
Location
Southern Tier NY
TDI
All turned back to VW. Now a 2017 Hundai Tuscon. Not a single squalk in 10k miles.
But the $5k sticker difference is subject to negotiation and the bulk of the real difference will come back when the car again goes on the market.
 

psd1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Location
OR
TDI
2006 Jetta 2013 Passat SE 6Man
I had a Jetta TDI for 2 years prior and statistically speaking I dont see any difference in winter and summer mileage in it. Perhaps not having to run the AC in the winter makes up for any difference in the fuel. Either that or perhaps down here in the south in Chattanooga the winter fuel is not much different.
My guess is that your moderate temperatures are the reason you didn't see much of a drop. I've operated diesels for a majority of my 30 years of driving and have always kept a usage log. My log always shows a decline in MPG when winterized fuel is used, it didn't matter if it was an 82 Isuzu P'up, 86 Toyota Hi Lux, 99 7.3 Powerstroke or an 06 Jetta or a 13 Passat.

Another difference could be A/C usage, I am more of a windows down guy. It has to be pretty dang hot for me to use A/C. It's possible that your summer MPG is suffering and that makes the transition to winter time MPG less noticeable.
 

Smaug

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2005
Location
NH
TDI
2013 Passat SE with DSG and Sunroof
I have 1300 miles on mine and love it. I love the space, being 6'6", and have plenty of room. Love feeling the torque. I even like the DSG. It ismy first non manual car I've owned in a while. The wheel could telescope a bit father back, but then again I have to reach to touch the radio with the seat most of the way back.
 

pparks1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Westland, Michigan
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SE
I can handle a 10-15% drop in mileage in the winter. I used to get at least that with my gasoline Passat in the winter as well.

The sticker price of the TDi is around $2000-$2,000 from the website (From an SE to an SE), but somebody above mentioned $5k. That's seems way too high....but I guess they might be comparing the S model to the TDi SE since those are the lowest in each tier.
 

zoop

Active member
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Location
New Jersey
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SEL
I love my TDI as much as the next guy, but people should realize that the MPG scale is a flawed scale because it is non-linear. The cost difference in the lower end of the scale (in the 20s) is much, much more than the cost difference in the higher end of the scale (late 30s and 40s). I wish US would shift to use a more realistic scale, like gallons/100 miles.
 

pparks1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Westland, Michigan
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SE
I love my TDI as much as the next guy, but people should realize that the MPG scale is a flawed scale because it is non-linear. The cost difference in the lower end of the scale (in the 20s) is much, much more than the cost difference in the higher end of the scale (late 30s and 40s). I wish US would shift to use a more realistic scale, like gallons/100 miles.
I don't understand what point you are trying to make.
 

zoop

Active member
Joined
Jul 15, 2013
Location
New Jersey
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SEL
The point I'm trying to make is that going from a car that does mid to higher 30s to a car that does 40 or higher MPG doesn't make that much of a difference, especially when you factor in the cost of the car. It makes sense to do a real calculation about running costs before comparing cars or MPGs.
 

psd1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2011
Location
OR
TDI
2006 Jetta 2013 Passat SE 6Man
The point I'm trying to make is that going from a car that does mid to higher 30s to a car that does 40 or higher MPG doesn't make that much of a difference, especially when you factor in the cost of the car. It makes sense to do a real calculation about running costs before comparing cars or MPGs.
Nope.

Running costs are running costs, end of! It is cheaper to run a diesl car that returns 40 MPG than it is to run a diesel car that returns 30 MPG.

Total cost of ownership is another story, factors such as maintenance, purchase price, cost per mile and insurance must be included.
 

pparks1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Westland, Michigan
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SE
The point I'm trying to make is that going from a car that does mid to higher 30s to a car that does 40 or higher MPG doesn't make that much of a difference, especially when you factor in the cost of the car. It makes sense to do a real calculation about running costs before comparing cars or MPGs.
Yeah, absolutely makes sense to me now. I've had people say to me, "heck, that car is paying for itself with your fuel savings". Um no...I don't even remotely come close to saving my car payment each month on fuel.

I would never consider getting a new high mileage car simply to get better fuel mileage. But for those who are in the same boat that I was in, and wanted to replace a 12 year old car that was due for a substantial number of repairs which could have resulted in costs nearing 20% of the cost of the new car, considering a high mileage car certainly factored in.

Overall for me, I went from an older Passat which was averaging around 25mpg to a TDI averaging about 43mpg. Driving approx 1500 miles per month, that is the difference between 34 gallons of diesel versus 60 gallons of gas. With diesel in my area running 3.99 per gallon and premium unleaded (which my old Passat required) at 3.79 a gallon, that's a difference of (227.40 - 135.66) of around $90 per month.

I figured a new Passat gasser would have netted me around 30mpg combined and on regular unleaded of $3.59, my cost difference would have been between 50 gallons of gas and 34 gallons of diesel, so 179.50 - 135.66 so $44.00 a month.

So yeah, I cannot even come close to justifying a car payment with my fuel savings But now I have a new car, it's under warranty, everything works, it has new features, and gives me something new to obsess over. Not to mention, i can go 2-3 weeks between fillups. :) Just the convenience of that is worth something.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
The point I'm trying to make is that going from a car that does mid to higher 30s to a car that does 40 or higher MPG doesn't make that much of a difference, especially when you factor in the cost of the car. It makes sense to do a real calculation about running costs before comparing cars or MPGs.
This is what I tell myself when I choose to drive my Miata which gets "only" 30 MPG instead of my Jetta or Golf that get in the 40s.

But, 281,000 miles in my Jetta wagon at 45 MPG and a gestimated fuel cost of $3/gallon nets $18,733 in fuel. The '96 Audi A4 I traded averaged 22 on premium. If I multiply that by the same 281K (not that the Audi would have lasted that long) at the same $3/gallon (in the past 11 years sometimes diesel was more expensive, sometimes premium was more expensive) total fuel cost is $38,318. Difference is $19,585. I paid $18,004 for my Jetta new. So the fuel savings may have paid for the car.
 

APT

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2012
Location
Metro Detroit
TDI
2012 Passat SEL
Here's my deal with the 2.0L TDI in these cars. It drives like a gas V6 under 3000rpm which suits my driving style. I get 22mpg (EPA City rating) in a 2011 Malibu 4-cyl on the same commute as my TDI (38mpg lifetime). A V6 in the Malibu might get the same 22mpg with my driving style.

One can compare say the 2013+ Accord 4-cyl to a TDI and not look too impressive. However, I know that I'd never see 37mpg, or even 30mpg in an Accord. Fuel cost is one part, but how it drives is the better part.
 
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nord

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 5, 2010
Location
Southern Tier NY
TDI
All turned back to VW. Now a 2017 Hundai Tuscon. Not a single squalk in 10k miles.
MPG is just icing on the cake for me. Then again when I see an average increase of 20% over my A5 in fuel economy this is nothing to sneeze at!

For me it's range. While I agree about the somewhat minimal overall difference between a reasonably economical gasser and out TDI, there a big difference between seeing a low fuel light at 400 miles versus 700+ miles.

Then the diesel itself... The TDI is a relaxed engine with tons of torque. It doesn't fuss or need to wind up in order to move out. For some of us this is an ideal type of engine. For others not so much. To each his (or her) own.

Resale? Just look at the difference between a TDI and a gasser. There's really not much comparison.
 

drcoopster

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2007
Location
DFW
TDI
EcoDiesel
For me it's range. While I agree about the somewhat minimal overall difference between a reasonably economical gasser and out TDI, there a big difference between seeing a low fuel light at 400 miles versus 700+ miles.
This was a huge factor for me. The Passat TDI has over twice the range of my truck on a smaller tank. MPG is a big part of that, but how many other cars with good MPG have an 18-gallon fuel tank?
 

phlfly

Banned
Joined
Dec 20, 2012
Location
N.VA
TDI
Passat SEL
yes it's very impressive. I got some number compare Tesla S (full electric "EV") vs Diesel. even Tesla is another price range, but it's only one EV can do around 230 to 265 miles (different reports) on one charge.
So there you go:
EV can do 2.6 miles per 1kWh
33.7 kWh is about 1 gallon of fuel.(term of energy)
So avg price per 1 kWh is $0.11, so it cost same 3.7 dollars.
But EV can go about 90 miles on 33.7 kWh (" 1 gallon of fuel").
My diesel can do best 50 mpg (avg all electronics and ect in use), so EV is almost twice efficient, than diesel.
So I considered even 45 mpg on diesel so it will cost me 1,000 bucks per year (4 buck a gallon and 12,000 miles per year)
So EV on same scale will cost me roughly 540 bucks per year. The difference is 500 bucks per year. So the real number is to be even with price difference (30000 USD) is like 60 years, which is close to Tesla’s website.
I looked at Nissan Leaf as well, but most people reporting avg 50-55 miles for year and cost around 36,000.
So even this difference in pice of 5,000-6,000 dollars, take you around 10 year mark.
The EV is not ready to take market and I read article, that VW is looking next 5 years for new diesel engine that would get avg 55 mpg.
 
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