2006 BRM with excessive blowby

[fredjmillard]

History (sorry for the long post)
I picked up a 2006 Jetta TDI with 93,000 from the original owner. The car has been serviced regularly at the dealer with the stamps in the book. At 88,000 miles a timing belt kit was installed by a 3rd party not the dealer. Shortly after the car was parked and driven sparingly. After sitting almost a year the owner decided to part ways. He bought a new battery, started the car and drove it to the carwash. After hosing down the engine back he could not get the car to start and thought it was electrical. The car is in fantastic shape other than some bubbling paint and the fact that it wont run.
Upon inspecting the car I found

• that the coolant bottle was empty with an oil residue

• the oil cap had milky oil

• the dipstick had gray milky oil.

After showing the owner this he genuinely looked surprised. With that limited knowledge I purchased the car with the thought it could be a headgasket or hopefully an oil cooler. So with new fuel filter, oil, oil filters and oil cooler I have ~$1100 into the car.
Upon draining the oil and coolant,

• I would say roughly ~1.5 quarts of coolant came out first, then the milky oil out of the sump.

• The oil filter showed no signs of metal.

• The coolant was green but was a bright green and looked not to have pink

• There wasnt much oil in the coolant system

• Oil cooler pressure tested fine, but replace it anyway

So after I Inspected timing belt, changed fuel filter and air filter and tightened the battery terminal, filled the oil and put water in the coolant it was decided to see if it would fire. The car cranked over fired up and then quit within 5 seconds. I tried priming the tandem pump think it was fuel related. Pulled the intake at the MAF sensor and notice vapors coming out of the intake and the MAF had an oil residue. While cranking it would crank over fine, but slowly crank like it was struggling more and more to turn over, different than the battery draining.
Here is where it gets weird. I pulled the oil cap between trying to start and forgot to put it back on and the damn car fired right up and idled just fine, albeit with a a ton of blowby. As soon as I put the oil cap back on the car would die, which was also when I had to call it a night.
So what is known

1. Oil had a lot of coolant
2. Coolant had some oil
3. oil cooler pressure tested fine
4. car only starts and idles if oil cap is off

Things to check

1. Compression, Bad rings bad head gasket, anyway to decern between the two with a compression check? does anybody know the proper fitting for the glow plug hole?
2. Exhaust resricted? I dont think exhaust is going out the tailpipe but am not sure yet. I only say that because after cranking when i thought it was a fuel problem i sniffed the tail pipe and couldnt smell any fumes, but didnt check it after the car did idle.

Am I missing anything. For the bettors out there with the info above what do you think the root cause for the cross contamination of oil and coolant with excessive blowby would be?
Thanks
Fred

 

[sptsailing]

You bought a project car. Sounds like the PO used incorrect coolant and the car has corrosion issues. Get a VCDS and shop manuals. Good luck.

 

[fredjmillard]

You bought a project car. Sounds like the PO used incorrect coolant and the car has corrosion issues. Get a VCDS and shop manuals. Good luck.

I suspected the system was flushed at the 88,000 mile timing belt kit (3rd party) it was changed over to green which I have read isnt ideal but if the pink is completely flushed it should be fine. The issue arises when the pink and green are mixed together where you get the problems. Thanks for the reply.

 

[fredjmillard]

A quick update as I had 15 minutes before golf league.

Started with oil cap off. Absolutely zero exhaust or air from the tail pipe. As soon as I start restricting the oil cap, I can hear the turbo spool and start to build lots of pressure before it would either choke the engine out of blow the cap off.

Fred

 

[oilhammer]

Very strange, but I suspect at this point a known good used engine is the best course of action, since clearly something is seriously screwed up with that one.

However, on the way to removing it, you can start by taking the downpipe/catalyst loose from the turbo and move it enough away as to create an air gap. Then see if the engine starts and runs, that will at least tell you if the catalyst is plugged shut. You can take the lambda sensor out too, but that hole may not be enough... although if it does start and blows out crazy amounts of exhaust, then you can figure the cat's plugged anyway.

Another thing is maybe remove the vacuum line from the VNT actuator and see if anything changes. The vacuum reservoir on the BRM is inside the valve cover. I suppose some strange set of events could have caused a crack or breach in there causing some strange behavior.

 

[fredjmillard]

I will try removing the down pipe and see if it will run normally. Could a head gasket leak over time cause a clogged catalyst? Then after time the clogged catalyst compounds the head gasket failure?

On the VNT actuator, at idle is it suppose to have full vacuum or the opposite way around?

 

[oilhammer]

Idle I believe it will put vacuum on the VNT, then backs it off as boost control requests.

Burning coolant can melt a catalyst substrate down to solid globs, absolutely.

 

[Rx7145]

Take the o2 sensor out and try starting it.

 

[fredjmillard]

Take the o2 sensor out and try starting it.

What is easier to remove the o2 sensor or the vclamp? It's on a hoist so I have pretty easy access to the underside. I was thinking about removing the whole downpipe, just because regardless of the outcome the downpipe would be coming out. Won't be able to get to it until labor day.

 

[Mattyoctavia]

Sounds like you could have a blocked exhaust and it’s trying to vent through the crankcase breather. Seen it before. Remove the exhaust then start it before condemning the engine

 

[fredjmillard]

Sounds like you could have a blocked exhaust and it’s trying to vent through the crankcase breather. Seen it before. Remove the exhaust then start it before condemning the engine

So I completely removed the downpipe from the car and it wasnt blocked. Car would still only start with the oil cap off. The turbo spooling I thought I heard is still present it the exhaust is restricted at the oil cap. Must just be pressure escaping.

I removed the intake side of the turbo as well. I cant rotate by hand either the exhaust side or the intake side. I can move the intake side up and down and side to side (rocking).

So I think the turbo is siezed/failed. I was thinking is it easiest to remove it with the whole head (intake and turbo) if you think at a minimum the head gasket is needed? Or is it still easier to remove the turbo from the bottom?

Anything else I should check before dissasembly? Compression ect?

Thanks
Fred

 

[oilhammer]

Very strange, but I suspect at this point a known good used engine is the best course of action, since clearly something is seriously screwed up with that one.
.....

Again.... I think you are better off swapping the whole thing.

 

[fredjmillard]

So I am getting ready to pull the head off after not being able to work on the car for a few weeks. Ive pulled the valve cover and the camshaft lobes all look very good. Everything I have read states you have to remove the cam sprocket to pull the head. Is this necessary, I can't picture why it is.

Thanks
Fred

 

[oilhammer]

In about the same time it took to post that, you could have had the sprocket off the cam.

But yes, it makes it easier because the little "teeth" on the hub that trigger the CMP sensor will want to hang up on the inner timing belt cover. You may be able to get it off with it on there, not sure, I've never bothered to try because no matter what, the sprocket was going to have to come off anyway. You can also take the cam out with the sprocket still attached, but that is another issue you will have to deal with later.

There is a triple pin spanner SST to couterhold the inner hub so you can remove the bolt, then any 3-point bolt grip set (sometimes called a "duck foot") will allow the hub to be popped off the tapered end of the cam. Google "duck foot puller".

 

[fredjmillard]

Sorry for the double post. Thanks Oil Hammer.

Why does the cam have to come out? If I find the issue is with the turbo, can i not replace the headgasket and replace the turbo and reassemble? I have a timing belt kit to replace along with head bolts and proper gasket.

 

[oilhammer]

The cam doesn't have to come out. I only mentioned that in case you had no way to get the hub/sprocket off of the cam.

If you are looking to use this engine, I would be sending the head off to get properly checked over anyway.

 

[fredjmillard]

Got the head off.....dont forget the sensor by the thermostat cause I missed it. Upon dissassembly all the head bolts seems tight except for the rear one near the tandem pump. There was also some oil staining on the block there.


The turbo shaft i think is broken. I am going to disassemble it and see if the bearing is seized since i cant move the exhaust side. I am in search of a turbo as I havent read any post about swapping in a new cartridge with any success. But I dont want to dump in a lot of money since the car is still somewhat of an unknown.


The cam and lifters all looked good. I am going to get the head resurfaced. I assume the machine shop will let me know how much they took off so I can adjust the headgasket accordingly??

Thanks
Fred

 

[oilhammer]

That is not how the head gasket thickness works.

 

[fredjmillard]

I understand how head gasket works with measuring piston protrusion. On the head side though wouldn't I need to know how much was taken off to take that in account?

 

[oilhammer]

Nope.

Valve stack height is what matters there.

Same as any other OHC cylinder head, save for on a diesel the margin for error is much smaller. Any machine shop *should* know this, but I would not be surprised if some didn't.

So if you take X off of the head, then you make sure that the valves, valve seats, and the valve stems are also machined accordingly, so when the valve is at full lift, its relative location is the same.

I still think you would be better served sourcing a known good used engine.

 

[fredjmillard]

Nope.
Valve stack height is what matters there.
Same as any other OHC cylinder head, save for on a diesel the margin for error is much smaller. Any machine shop *should* know this, but I would not be surprised if some didn't.
So if you take X off of the head, then you make sure that the valves, valve seats, and the valve stems are also machined accordingly, so when the valve is at full lift, its relative location is the same.
I still think you would be better served sourcing a known good used engine.

I got the turbo dissembled and the shaft did break/shear on the exhaust side. The turbine wheel got pushed and lodged on the outlet completely blocking the exhaust and is why the engine would only run with the oil cap off. The inner housing on the exhaust side is a bit scuffed with the turbine wheel was touching but very minimal. The VNT linkage and actuation works just fine.

So at this point my options are

1. New turbo at around $800
2. used turbo at around $300
3. PD140 turbo at around $1000
4. Replace this cartridge at around $150
5. or oilhammers favorite replace with known good engine, cost unknown.

At this point I think I am leaning towards replacing the cartridge and slapping the whole thing back together for the cost of a head gasket and head bolts and timing belt. For about $300 I can see if it works, if not then I can go down the route of a replacement engine or part out.

 

[absalom]

I got the turbo dissembled and the shaft did break/shear on the exhaust side. The turbine wheel got pushed and lodged on the outlet completely blocking the exhaust and is why the engine would only run with the oil cap off. The inner housing on the exhaust side is a bit scuffed with the turbine wheel was touching but very minimal. The VNT linkage and actuation works just fine.
So at this point my options are

1. New turbo at around $800
2. used turbo at around $300
3. PD140 turbo at around $1000
4. Replace this cartridge at around $150
5. or oilhammers favorite replace with known good engine, cost unknown.

At this point I think I am leaning towards replacing the cartridge and slapping the whole thing back together for the cost of a head gasket and head bolts and timing belt. For about $300 I can see if it works, if not then I can go down the route of a replacement engine or part out.

Or for $500 you could get a used engine. Are you allergic to money?

 

[Ol'Rattler]

Since the turbo manufacturer does not sell replacement parts, turbo cartridges are usually Chinese garbage. I guess a runaway from a Chinesium cartridge on start up would help clean out the coolant contamination.

Sure sounds like"washing the engine" isn't the only bonehead move the PO did. Unless you are extremely careful keeping high pressure water from being forced into places it does not belong, washing the engine on a modern car is an extremely bad idea.

If the engine sat with coolant mixed with the oil for more than a couple of days without it being thoroughly cleaned out, the engine is toast. It sounds like it may have sat several months like that.The green coolant is a red flag, the turbo shaft "snapping" at 93K miles is a red flag.......... I agree with OH's recommendation. I'm sure the PO practiced his "genuinely surprise" act in front of a mirror.

Your post has inspired me to go and flush some of the extra money in my wallet into the public sewer system.

 

[fredjmillard]

Or for $500 you could get a used engine. Are you allergic to money?

Where are all these good used $500 engines? I have seen 1 BRM long block for sale and it was $550 and I would still need to source the turbo. Ive been searching here and craigslist, if there are other sources let me know.

 

[fredjmillard]

So after finding a used turbo from a member here, I cleaned the ASV and intake and reinstalled the head and button everything back together. The car fired up and idled and ran great. I put water and cascade in the coolant system to flush out the oil residue in there. All was well as after about the 4th flush (40 miles driving) it was clearing up. There wasnt any water in the oil under the oil fill cap either. During the last flush I took it out when it was raining, the car started acting up.

• temp gauge all over the place
• Glow plug light flashing
• car would stall sometimes
• tach acted funny
• traction control light on and wouldnt disenage
• one radiator fan is on constantly even after sitting over night, turn the key to on and it turns on.
• car doesnt have the power above 3,000 RPM
• Cel on

At first i thought the lack of power was fuel related as it would idle rough sometimes aswell, other times purred like a kitten. So I wanted to drain the fuel as there was a half tank in there. So I pulled the supply line from the fuel filter, and cycle the key and sometimes it will cycle the lift pump and other times it does nothing.

This lead me to think it was electrical and it brought me down the rabbit hole of engine harness chaffing.

My question is on the engine harness is there anything there that would prevent the lift pump from turning on? Because I know it cycled everytime when I was trouble shooting the fuel system earlier.

I should be able to pull codes tomorrow, and inspect the engine harness.
Thanks
Fred

 

[oilhammer]

Check all your grounds. ALL of them.

 

[fredjmillard]

Is this a good list?

Also what is the sensor on the back of the head below the tandem pump?

Grounds on 06 jetta:
1. engine comp, top of right front chassis member, underneath headlight
2. passenger comp, base o A-pillar, behind trim
3. connection at right end of cylinder head
4. battery to chassis, under engine hood, near battery
5.right side of trunk, on inner wheel housing, behind trim
6. left side trunk on C-pillar, behind trim
7. left side trunk,on inner wheel housing, behind trim
8.engine/transmission ground, on top of left front chassis member
9.in plenum chamber, next to right strut tower
10.engine compartment, on top of left front chassis member
11.in plenum chamber, next to left strut tower

 

[narongc73]

Oh geez here we go again. Mixing the coolant does not make for corrosion. 263k miles and damn I'm still good, wonder why.

 

[Ol'Rattler]

Is this a good list?

Also what is the sensor on the back of the head below the tandem pump?

There is a major chassis ground hidden underneath the air cleaner box. Same type of acorn nut as #4.

 

[fredjmillard]

Oh geez here we go again. Mixing the coolant does not make for corrosion. 263k miles and damn I'm still good, wonder why.

narogc73 the turbo you sent seems to be working well and was tight as you described, thanks for the quick shipping aswell. Going to take a look at the car after work tonight.....need to get coolant in the car as temps have been dipping in Michigan.