2 stroke oil in your diesel = smiles?

[Digital Corpus]

Believe what you want if it makes you feel good to put 2 stoke oil in your fuel go right ahead. It's a free country I just feel that there are better options such as bio diesel not chain saw oil.

2SO is for a cleaner burn. Bio is for lubricity.

 

[bloc]

Just more forum Hyperbole
no real reports shown. And sulfer is not a high pressure lubricant as the author would lead you to believe. But I guess it's true because it is printed on the internet.

Just something to back you up:

"The reason for the poor lubricity of low-sulfur petrodiesel is not theremoval of the sulfur-containing compounds but rather
that polar compounds with other heteroatoms such as
oxygen and nitrogen are also reduced in low-sulfur
petrodiesel."

From: "Lubricity of Components of Biodiesel and Biodiesel. The Origin of Biodiesel Lubricity"
http://www.biodrive.net/media/lubricity$20study$20of$20biodiesel$20and$20ffa.pdf

 

[MichaelB]

2SO is for a cleaner burn. Bio is for lubricity.

Then why don't the fuel manufactures who also produce 2SO just blend it in the fuel? It would cost them virtually nothing and the EPA would applaud the move. I know it's all a conspiracy eh? Everybody is chasing the golden goose here. That thread that Lensdude referred to mentioned cleaner burn but it also stated other things are simply not true. Who do you want to believe? I really don't think his car is going to last any longer than mine because he puts 2SO in the fuel. Do you?

 

[Digital Corpus]

Then why don't the fuel manufactures who also produce 2SO just blend it in the fuel? It would cost them virtually nothing and the EPA would applaud the move. I know it's all a conspiracy eh? Everybody is chasing the golden goose here. That thread that Lensdude refereed to mentioned cleaner burn but it also stated other things are simply not true. Who do you want to believe? I really don't think his car is going to last any longer than mine because he puts 2SO in the fuel. Do you?

I love your assumptions about me being a conspiracy theorist

I mean, I just love the decimation of rain forests have attributed to the extinction of unicorns!

Less smoke under moderate load? Confirmed through testing this myself. Logically, this means that my VNT turbo's vanes will take longer to soot up.

I never mentioned the other "benefits" in my post. Now, diesel is a fuel. Biodiesel is an alternative, but under the pressure in modern fuel pumps, it allegedly breaks down and isn't so great as a fuel anymore. I have an old car, thus old tech. And it is mentioned by some, but not thoroughly know and tested, but 2S0 can damage the DPF; even ashless 2SO.

Also, when it come to manufacturing for the masses, pennies add up. Since it will not work with every type of diesel engine, it's not added to the fuel. Wow, amazing what a little logic does...

People will do things to make their lives a little bit easier. In this case, 2SO can help prolong the engine and components. Then, if something does go wrong, they have cleaner engine to troubleshoot, possibly. Not all of this is subjected by the rigors of scientific study because the average person doesn't give a damn and they think a car is worth zip after 100K miles. So, some of these benefits are perceived, but some are real. Take it with a grain of salt. But don't use so much salt that you have cardiovascular problems...

 

[MichaelB]

I do not even have a box of salt in my house. I also try to purchase salt free food products when I can. I can also see we are having some fun with this discussion. So be it. But I take my stand on the thought that 2SO is the magical cure for what is perceived to be wrong with pump diesel. And if you don't add some stuff to it it will destroy your engine in a short time.

 

[Digital Corpus]

I do not even have a box of salt in my house. I also try to purchase salt free food products when I can. I can also see we are having some fun with this discussion. So be it. But I take my stand on the thought that 2SO is the magical cure for what is perceived to be wrong with pump diesel. And if you don't add some stuff to it it will destroy your engine in a short time.

And that opinion is not one I share, so please don't assume.

 

[MichaelB]

And that opinion is not one I share, so please don't assume.

Alright I guess I'm done here. It is starting to go to the next level which will bear no fruit for anybody. It is becoming tit for tat. Let's concentrate on posting something of value to the forum readers.
.

 

[FXDL]

This is of valve to some, if not so be it. If you were look up and read what I found, it was a German maker of auto's who did the testing of 2 stroke oil and in fact they had a rally of sorts and they for fear of the diesel fuel not being so good added low ash 2 stroke oil to the tanks of their cars to protect them. Read and learn. They also stated that they tested diesel fuel additives and found they were not worth the money for what they had tested. Bottom line this I believe it is of value to most of us.The reason makers don't want us to use it because helps and our cars will last longer and thay make no oney along with dealers. So many on so many diff.,sites have nothing bad to say about it, only good. Go to the link read and learn. The German auto maker proved that it helps big time. Bottom line some are near sighted and can't wrap any real thought around something that improves and is so simple to do. It just might be of some value if one were to read it, and than again not likely for some I guess.

 

[MichaelB]

This is of valve. If you were look up and read what I found, it was a German maker of auto's who did the testing of 2 stroke oil and in fact they had a rally of sorts and they for fear of the diesel fuel not being so good added low ash 2 stroke oil to the tanks of their cars to protect them. Read and learn. They also stated that they tested diesel fuel additives and found they were not worth the money. Bottom line this I believe it is of value to most as so many on so many diff.,sites have nothing bad to say about it, only good. Go to the link read and learn which you by the sound of it did not.

I could chase my tail on the web for all the facts you quote but it always turns up somebody said or somebody read. No real world documentation. Believe what you have read but don't quote websites without certified testing. documentation. Think PT Barnum, there is a sucker born everyday. And as I said previously this thread has no valuable info just hyperbole. If you want to be right then be right. I'm still not going to put that crap in my fuel. You and others can choose to do what they want. In the end I think it won't make a hill of beans to your car.

 

[FXDL]

Thought you were done here eh

 

[MichaelB]

Thought you were done here eh

Yeah but you weren't

 

[FXDL]

Using 2SO will help to prolong the life of the diesel, no one is saying make it last forever. The 2SO will add back some lubrication to the diesel fuel that has been removed in making it ultra low sulfur. There is something wrong with the new diesel fuel as it has been proven by MB and countless others makers. This is of value to some and some not. If it is not of value to one then why does one read it, I will never understand when one does not agree or like something why do they bother. Some or most out here, are here to learn I am sure that it why we are out here and some to just disagree with anything and everything. Each their own. Some people are just going in circles, and always will.

 

[South Coast Guy]

Using 2SO will help to prolong the life of the diesel, no one is saying make it last forever. The 2SO will add back some lubrication to the diesel fuel that has been removed in making it ultra low sulfur. There is something wrong with the new diesel fuel as it has been proven by MB and countless others makers. This is of value to some and some not. If it is not of value to one then why does one read it, I will never understand when one does not agree or like something why do they bother. Some or most out here, are here to learn I am sure that it why we are out here and some to just disagree with anything and everything. Each their own. Some people are just going in circles, and always will.

Please provide the science behind your statement.

 

[Digital Corpus]

Bio, at between 2% and 5%, will add back the needed lubricity lost between LSD and ULSD. This has been discussed and quantified on the forums before.

 

[MonsterTDI09]

I still can't believe this still thread is still going

 

[n8ronJ]

I've been following this thread with some interest. It's been a fun conversation to read.
What I've gathered is that in a non-CR TDI such as my ALH, I could run 2SO without any ill effects. I might also see some improvements with lubricity and a cleaner burn. I would have no real way of knowing unless I tear down my engine right now and document the "cleanliness" of it and then tear it down again sometime in the future after many thousand miles and document any changes.
I run PowerService in my car mostly in the cold months and it helps my starts and with my FE.
Given the area of new York state that I live in I cannot get my hands on any BioD from a pump. I also cannot afford to buy in bulk and try and store it. I understand that Bio is the best for lubricity. Since this option is out then I just might try 2SO mixed with some power service.

What I don't understand is that so many want to chime in and nay-say - when I read a thread and don't agree I usually just move on. To each their own. No reason to pick a battle.
And it seems that most of the "you cant do that" crowd are all CR TDI owners.

 

[steve05ram360]

steve05ram360 I think you are on the wright track and will not be sorry. Check out the above I have shown. I think you will be happy with your decision to use 2 stroke oil. I will be from now on.

Keep it at 200:1 ratio, no less

Still looking for some logic to adding 2-stroke oil to diesel. Does the manufacturer recommend it? Does any diesel auto manufacturer recommend it? Or is this just one of those old wives' tales from 60 years ago.

Read the 1st paragraph, then go read the threads on the lack of lubricity in the diesel these days, then, if you have a HPFP, go read the threads on them failing, lots of them. Almost all of them do not use additives regularly and there are a couple that did. No long term history on those though.



Then go read those threads that say "drive more, worry less" and recall those threads where the HPFP blew where they did not do what they could to keep things working correctly.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-stroke_oil

Just more forum Hyperbole
no real reports shown. And sulfer is not a high pressure lubricant as the author would lead you to believe. But I guess it's true because it is printed on the internet.

While there is a lot of crap on the internet, there is also a lot of good info. If one uses some common sense they could wade thru the crap and find good answers.

Most of you guys with the HPFP will only keep their cars until the warranty runs out then move on. Those of us who stick with it will do whatever it takes to keep it on the road. To me in this case is to add lubrication to the fuel (2 stroke, made for lubricating internal parts) and pull heat out of the fuel to be able to cool the HPFP as much as possible. Since heat & lack of lubrication can kill a part, any part, seems like the best approach to making sure it doesnt blow.


edit: Oh yeah, 25k miles on 2SO on my 2011 golf, no problems... in the exhaust or HPFP. Started adding 2SO at 50k, reduced fuel temps back in the 40k range.

 

[FXDL]

steve05ram360 I think u r on the wright track. I have been running the Walmart 2SO ashless oil in my 2010 at the 200:1 and some times maybe even richer. I am using the Amsoil 5W30 low SAPS engine oil as I changed as soon as I got the car. Some of the tests have been using low ash not ashless and I would think the ashless is the better choice. I had my mech check my DPF and it is at 120 ml. The car had 209500 km's on it when I got it about a mon., ago used from the dealer. I have put about 3000-4000 k's on since getting the car and having the DPF checked. Pretty much started using the 2SO soon as I got the car. It took my mech., about 3 mins to get the reading and a dealer wanted 1 hour labour. The dealer also said to take a white cloth and wipe the inside of the tail pipe .to tell, real bright on their part. Will check like once a month to see how much the reading changes. Like n8ronj said above if one doesn't like or agree with what we are trying to do then move on and read about something else rather then just picking a battle. We are all, or most of us are trying learn and apply diff., things to help our wheels last longer and at the same time keep the cost down in doing so. Again each their own. Happy Easter to all and a safe one.

 

[tdiatlast]

FXDL: How about updating your signature, etc. so we can quickly see what car/engine you're talking about? Thanks.

 

[FXDL]

tdiatlast I have updated, was easier then I thought. Didn't know I could. Learn something new every day. Thanks for asking and getting me to check it out.

 

[FXDL]

Well ran out of the Amsoil additives but still using the 2SO [ashless] from Walmart at about 200:1 or so. I was using the Amsoil and 2SO at the same time by now just the 2SO alone and I am happy with the way the car runs. The 2SO is most likely richer at times then the 200 to 1. I find that the car by the seat of my pants just seems to run better and it sounds better too. The car seems to really like the 2SO, so still a go for the usage of it. Now some say 2SO is for 2 stroke engines but in the old days they only used 4 stroke oil like 10 wt oil and they would mix with the gas before 2SO started to show up. In the old days also before multi grade oils they would just use 10 or 20 wt in the cold weather and 30-40 in the summer in four stroke engines, diesels and gassers. Lube oils have come a long way but not the fuels we use or are read alee available. Use what you may but for me the lubrication of the 2SO is a plus and with our new crappy diesel fuels with the lack of lubrication we need something to replace it. And now with diesels getting more pollution control then gassers, maybe soon time to go back to a gasser. Back 30 years ago that is why I started driving diesels as they had nothing in the way of pollution control and were so much simpler then diesels of now. Use what you will and believe. There are a lot fuel additives for diesels and gassers that claim to work wonders but really no proof.

 

[formerPDfan]

Nice mileage bump with JASO/ISO 2-stroke oil

I've had a 2005 Passat from new-12/2012 with geared BSM and another with BSM delete. I've never gotten over about 35 mpg highway or otherwise, with or without RocketChip or Malone tune. After reading the Spicer report, I decided to try TCW-3 2-stroke oil solely for the lubricity and any pump/parts longevity that might go with it. I added it a 200:1 ratio as specified by Spicer (which equates to 10 oz per avg 16 gal fill-up). I also added 6 oz Power Service Diesel Kleen. I did not expect and did not see any change from my average ~33-35 mpg.
While shopping for 2-stroke oil another time, I noticed Lucas Semi Synthetic 2-Stroke Oil. I was unfamiliar with JASO FD and ISO GD standards, so I looked it up. I read this forum post which I understood to say that TCW-3 should be used in the water and JASO/ISO should be used on land. I got the Lucas product and added it at the same 200:1 ratio as the TCW-3 above, along with the same 6 oz of Diesel Kleen. I have consistently been getting ~37 mpg since then.
Can this appropriately be attributed to the JASO FD/ISO GD 2-stroke oil adding lubricity, energy content, or both?

 

[greenskeeper]

2-stroke oil isn't going to anything for fuel economy

 

[jayb79]

it will look like it did if you don't figure in that extra quart in your calculation

 

[formerPDfan]

It's a pint, not a quart, and it still doesn't change the outcome

it will look like it did if you don't figure in that extra quart in your calculation

I see what you're getting at, but a little math demonstrates it to be incorrect. Let's say for round numbers that I get 600 miles to a tank on a 15 gallon fill-up.
600 mi/15 gal = 40 mpg
I add 10 oz of JASO 2-stroke oil and 6 oz of Diesel Kleen. 16 oz = 1 pint = 1/8 gal = 0.125 gal. Adding this quantity to the fuel we get:
600 mi/15.125 gal = 39.669 This equates to a difference of ~0.33 mpg.
Therefore the volume addition of additive is insignificant contributor to the observed ~2 mpg increase in fuel economy in this case.

 

[FordGuy100]

35 to 37mpg is within a range of error. Usually its the subconscious decision to drive slightly more economically because you think that the additives are helping...when in fact it is just how you are driving that is helping.

 

[formerPDfan]

35 to 37mpg is within a range of error. Usually its the subconscious decision to drive slightly more economically because you think that the additives are helping...when in fact it is just how you are driving that is helping.

It might be within the range of error in many cases, but having never broken the 35 mpg mark over an 8 year period with the same car and no other variables provides too much of a reference/trend to suggest that it would be possible to suddenly get a 2 mpg bump from driving more conservatively. Something else is going on.

 

[JohnWilder]

I don't understand this dedication to 2 stroke oil. 2 Stroke oil was designed to lubricate a crankcase charged 2 stroke engine without fouling the spark plug. It is not a better lubricant than most 4 stroke oils. A 4 stroke oil in a 2 stroke engine will foul the plug very quickly. A 4 stroke oil in diesel fuel will simply burn.

 

[jayb79]

2 stroke is designed to burn without leaving deposits that 4 stock will leave behind.

 

[Spring1898]

I believe the reason for two stroke oil is for increasing the lubricity of the fuel for the parts that are handling it. Mainly aimed at replacing the lubricity lost by modern low sulfur diesel (although there was a following long before this occurred, still aimed at parts longevity).