real world EVs review

[kjclow]

That's what I get for not proof reading! Fixed it now.

 

[Rob Mayercik]

Most trucks I've owned, I've always thrown about 100 pounds of sand in the bed for a smoother ride. Helps in winter and rain for traction too. If you get stuck somewhere, you've already got the sand too. My fil used to say that that the only thing four wheel drive did for you on ice was to get all four wheels spinning.

Funny you should mention this - the earliest car I remember my mother driving was a '78 Fairmont wagon with an I-6 motor. My dad would load 200lbs or more of play sand in the back of that thing every fall she had it besides putting the studded snow tires on it, because that car was so light in the rear it would fishtail on a dry dirt road in the height of summer.

My dad used to say something similar about 4WD: Just because you can go in the snow with 4WD, doesn't mean you can turn or stop."

 

[braddies]

Reminds me of the lady who sold her snow tires because she doesn't need them now that she has awd

 

[Daemon64]

So update. Drove P2 238 miles on Friday. EA charger 110 miles into trip had 2 completely offline 1 person troubleshooting another and the last one with a line of like 5 cars. Left right away and found a "62.5" kw charger at a gas station 15 miles up the road. But that's 62.5kw at 1000v.... sooooo it was 30.8kw at 400v since most cars are 400v, with a handful at 800v. That charging stop cost $10 for 15kwh and took 30 minutes... ( .67 / kwh or .237/mile of charge, car was averaging 353wh/mi and total battery is 75kwh ). It was 80f out we had the air on set at 76deg on eco climate, and I was driving an avg of 68mph for reference.

I get to repeat this trip again with all the same chargers today. Let you know how it goes later but my guess is more of the same.

Can't wait to get back into a diesel--> 22 mo and counting left on the lease.

 

[gearheadgrrrl]

The lack of charging on road is going to kill electrification- Last weekend did an 800 mile 3 day road trip through rural western Iowa and Missouri, didn't see a single charger. Was hauling a motorcycle, so electric range would have been down to around 200 miles and required some out of the way routing to find chargers along I-29. This weekend made a 400 mile day trip to MSP from southwest MN, charging would have added a couple hours to this 15 hour trip and gotten me home long after dark, probably need a motel too.

Conclusion: The low population density in rural America won't support the cost of maintaining chargers out here, even if state and federal grants pay for them. Biofuels are a better option for reducing GHG out here.

 

[compu_85]

Tesla has released some data showing an average of 12% battery degradation after 200k miles. Not bad.

At 180k miles our '18 AWD long range 3 is at about 12% degradation. It still charges wicket fast. Our '18 rear drive midrange is at about 16% loss IIRC.

-J

 

[gulfcoastguy]

I was telling my ID4 to chill out, that we had plenty of range. I mean it was showing 32 miles left when I got back home and plugged in. Of course it is warm weather now and the ranges are probably at their yearly maximum.

 

[03TDICommuter]

That charging stop cost $10 for 15kwh

For my eGolf that would be a little over 60 miles for 15KWH. My TDI Beetle has been getting 49 MPG lately and diesel is $4.43/gal here in overpriced CA.

I do like my eGolf. I don't like what SoCal Edison charges me for eletricity ($0.32/KWH), I don't like the 85 MPH top speed, and I don't like the 120 mile freeway range.

 

[compu_85]

$0.32/kWh!! That's almost 3x what is is WA!

-J

 

[turbobrick240]

$0.32/kWh!! That's almost 3x what is is WA!

-J

I was thinking the same thing- crazy how close WA and OR are with MUCH cheaper power.

 

[03TDICommuter]

$0.32/kWh!! That's almost 3x what is is WA!

-J

I was thinking the same thing- crazy how close WA and OR are with MUCH cheaper power.

Yep, totally getting screwed here. The $0.32 is all-in. Take my bill and divide by the total number of KWh used.

SCE just did a change to net metering too - pretty much doesn't make sense to get solar anymore unless you also get battery storage.

 

[turbobrick240]

It looks like Ford is going to adopt Tesla's NACS charging port for their EVs going forward. That's a big deal, and just the first domino to fall leading to NACS truly becoming the North American charging standard, imo.

Ford EVs will use Tesla charging tech in surprise partnership between rival automakers

Ford Motor will partner with Tesla on several charging initiatives for its current and future electric vehicles in an unusual tie-up.

www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org

 

[tikal]

^^^^
turbobrick240, it is a step forward indeed.

For exclusively city driving, are the prices of used (and even new) GM Bolts tanking to the point of being competitive against a used similar ICE vehicle to keep long term (8 to 10 years)?

 

[turbobrick240]

^^^^
turbobrick240, it is a step forward indeed.

For exclusively city driving, are the prices of used (and even new) GM Bolts tanking to the point of being competitive against a used similar ICE vehicle to keep long term (8 to 10 years)?

I haven't priced out used Bolts, but they must be a bargain based on the low price of the new ones. If the used Bolt has only had one owner, it's also eligible for a decent rebate/tax break. I would think they'd be a superb city car.

 

[turbobrick240]

Following the Ford announcement about their NACS plug adoption next year, Freewire has announced that they will be adding NACS plugs to their chargers next year as well. Electrify America is already using Tesla battery storage at many locations- I wonder how long before they add NACS cords to their stations.

Two Charging Companies Respond To Ford's Adoption Of The Tesla/NACS Plug - CleanTechnica

Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! Yesterday’s announcement that Ford’s ... [continued]

cleantechnica.com

 

[gulfcoastguy]

Following the Ford announcement about their NACS plug adoption next year, Freewire has announced that they will be adding NACS plugs to their chargers next year as well. Electrify America is already using Tesla battery storage at many locations- I wonder how long before they add NACS cords to their stations.

Two Charging Companies Respond To Ford's Adoption Of The Tesla/NACS Plug - CleanTechnica

Sign up for daily news updates from CleanTechnica on email. Or follow us on Google News! Yesterday’s announcement that Ford’s ... [continued]

cleantechnica.com

If they won't maintain their existing chargers , what difference does it make. I just wish that Tesla would sell me an adapter so that I could use the Superchargers.

 

[turbobrick240]

If they won't maintain their existing chargers , what difference does it make. I just wish that Tesla would sell me an adapter so that I could use the Superchargers.

I think it would mainly just be another indicator that NACS is on a path to displace CCS as the favored charging standard for automakers selling cars in N. America. Tesla wants to be able to control which of their stations are available to other manufacturers, but maybe VW comes to a similar arrangement as Ford. In which case you'd probably get the adapter from VW.

Edit: I just came across this outfit that's working on a CCS to NACS adapter.

Magic Dock & Tesla to CCS Adapter • Charge non-Tesla at Supercharger • Ultimate Guide

Here you will find the Tesla-to-CCS1 adapter for charging non-Tesla electric vehicles on the Supercharger network. With the Magic Dock Supercharger Adapter, you can charge your car and motorcycle.

evadept.com

 

[turbobrick240]

All of the Tesla Model 3s, including the standard range rear drive, qualify for the full $7500 federal tax credit again. Pretty sure the standard range is still using the CATL LFP battery, but they may have switched back to Panasonic ternary.

 

[gmenounos]

All of the Tesla Model 3s, including the standard range rear drive, qualify for the full $7500 federal tax credit again. Pretty sure the standard range is still using the CATL LFP battery, but they may have switched back to Panasonic ternary.

Wow, I was about to tell you that was no longer true, but I just checked their web site and it's back to $7500 for the RWD standard range. That car is temporarily down to $37,830 for ones already in stock before any tax credits. The long range AWD that I bought (EPA range of 358 miles) is no longer available and has been replaced with one with a different battery that has a range of 333 miles. They seem to be switching batteries a lot this year. Anyway, not regretting my purchase, but a great deal for anyone getting the RWD now, especially if you can get a federal or state tax credit or rebate.

 

[turbobrick240]

Wow, I was about to tell you that was no longer true, but I just checked their web site and it's back to $7500 for the RWD standard range. That car is temporarily down to $37,830 for ones already in stock before any tax credits. The long range AWD that I bought (EPA range of 358 miles) is no longer available and has been replaced with one with a different battery that has a range of 333 miles. They seem to be switching batteries a lot this year. Anyway, not regretting my purchase, but a great deal for anyone getting the RWD now, especially if you can get a federal or state tax credit or rebate.

I don't know if that range change represents an actual change to the battery or just the way they're rating it. Must be a little confusing for those who bought a standard range 3 in the last couple of months. Not sure where they stand with the credit.

 

[turbobrick240]

It looks like Ford is going to adopt Tesla's NACS charging port for their EVs going forward. That's a big deal, and just the first domino to fall leading to NACS truly becoming the North American charging standard, imo.

Ford EVs will use Tesla charging tech in surprise partnership between rival automakers

Ford Motor will partner with Tesla on several charging initiatives for its current and future electric vehicles in an unusual tie-up.

www-cnbc-com.cdn.ampproject.org

Well, the dominoes are falling fast now! GM also adopting NACS is clearly momentous, and more will be following in rapid succession. The widespread adoption of NACS and availability of the Supercharger network will be a huge catalyst for EV adoption.

Tesla is about to pull the plug on its main EV charging rival

Tesla is becoming North America’s plug of choice.

www.theverge.com

 

[gulfcoastguy]

Magic Dock is attached to Tesla super chargers in 11 locations located in only New York(upstate not the city) and California. Then they stopped installing them. It does mean that Tesla could manufacture and release an adapter any time that Elon decides that it benefits him.

 

[turbobrick240]

I bet VW hops on the NACS bandwagon within a couple of months. Then you'll be able to buy a genuine VW adapter straight from VW. Maybe they'll even give you one!

 

[Daemon64]

Yep, totally getting screwed here. The $0.32 is all-in. Take my bill and divide by the total number of KWh used.

SCE just did a change to net metering too - pretty much doesn't make sense to get solar anymore unless you also get battery storage.

.286/kwh here all in. I feel that

 

[Daemon64]

I bet VW hops on the NACS bandwagon within a couple of months. Then you'll be able to buy a genuine VW adapter straight from VW. Maybe they'll even give you one!

The only reason NACS is getting picked up by ford and gm is because electrify america ( VW ) screwed up so bad that Jim Farley and the likes have actually been listening to all the customer complaints and they are smart enough to realize that you cannot sell electric cars if the network they charge off of is super trash. Thanks EA for sucking so hard that I outright refuse to buy another electric. Anyone who is everything is great you go on a long distance trip and get nearly stranded dozens of times and tell me if you want to deal with that ever again even for a minor chance.

No thanks. I'll be over here burning dead dinosaurs for the rest of my life now and I have a long way to go. So someone better come along with synthetic fuels, otherwise deal with my consumer choice.

 

[turbobrick240]

The only reason NACS is getting picked up by ford and gm is because electrify america ( VW ) screwed up so bad that Jim Farley and the likes have actually been listening to all the customer complaints and they are smart enough to realize that you cannot sell electric cars if the network they charge off of is super trash. Thanks EA for sucking so hard that I outright refuse to buy another electric. Anyone who is everything is great you go on a long distance trip and get nearly stranded dozens of times and tell me if you want to deal with that ever again even for a minor chance.

No thanks. I'll be over here burning dead dinosaurs for the rest of my life now and I have a long way to go. So someone better come along with synthetic fuels, otherwise deal with my consumer choice.

I'm sorry that the EA charging experience has essentially been traumatizing for so many CCS EV owners. I bet Volvo and Polestar are not far behind Ford and GM in joining the NACS network. Things will improve immensely once you have access to Superchargers. Maybe that will sway your feeling. It didn't seem like you were immediately unhappy with your Polestar. I've nearly run out of fuel twice on road trips and know exactly how stress inducing that can be.

 

[gearheadgrrrl]

TSLA high speed access ain't gonna help much out here, they're mostly on the Interstates and I'm 40 miles from the nearest Interstate and thus 50 miles to the nearest "Supercharger", 70 to the next, and 100 to the 3rd closest. Being so far from the Interstate means my routes to Fargo, Minneapolis, Omaha, and Rapid City are mostly off Interstate and through rural areas that may never economically justify high speed chargers. so after my county has achieved all of maybe .1% EV penetration after a decade including plug-ins, the future of EVs out here looks pretty dim.

 

[turbobrick240]

It will take time for DC fast chargers to become as ubiquitous as gas stations are today. EVs won't ever suit the needs of 100% of people, just as ICEVs don't.

The value of Tesla's Supercharger network: Is it priceless?

Tesla's network of superchargers is often thought of as a perk, but the truth is it has played an enormous role in shifting the world's perception of electric vehicles.

thedriven-io.cdn.ampproject.org

 

[nwdiver]

mostly off Interstate and through rural areas that may never economically justify high speed chargers.

Have you checked plug share? There's already a lot of DCFC on state highways in Minnesota.

With a lot more coming.

 

[gulfcoastguy]

While I agree that EA sucking so hard anywhere other than the I95 corridor just gave charger victory to Elon it also cripples Teslas competition just when they are opening new EV factories. They will have to spend development capital to re engineer their DC charging.