Another oil thread

[KHCRTDI]

Hello, this may have already been answered somewhere, but I got tired of dredging through post. I am wondering if anyone knows the specs of vw507 oil. Sulfated ash, phosphorous, sulfate allowable maxes. I can get my hands on Caterpiller brand oil pretty cheap. We run it in everything cat brand, after-treatment or not. (I work at a Cat dealer) I figure the Cat engineers are just as smart as the VW engineers. I have been able to find the Cat ECL specs which are
Name: CAT DEO-ULS
Max:
1.0% sulfated ash
.4% sulfur (weight)
.12% phosphorous (weight)

I just want to know if this is allowable in the common rail TDIs that still have all of the emissions. Thanks!

 

[Lightflyer1]

If it doesn't have the 507 on it, it isn't approved for use by VW, no matter the specs. The other oil may work but if you have any issues they more than likely won't cover them under warranty, assuming oil related in any way. But owners can choose to use whatever they want if the warranty isn't important to them. There are some others that have posted here that are running alternative oils. Some emissions deleted and some not.

 

[CleverUserName]

VW 507 is 0.6-0.8% ash and phosphorous is typically < 800 ppm. I believe the allowable ash level is actually higher but VW doesn’t publish their requirements but can be inferred by other approvals like SN and C3.

Ive used CJ-4 10w30 and 5w40 in my TDI because LM 507 did not perform well or even last to 10K without TBN depletion. I’d say you’re fine with synthetic CJ or CK-4 but theoretically may have a lower emissions system lifespan. If you have a healthy engine that doesn’t burn oil then oil ash is insignificant IMO.

The Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 however is 507, good oil and will last to 10k. Never seen a bad oil analysis with it either.

 

[DivineChaos]

You have any idea how many oil threads there is? Hell I even did research. I stopped updating this. If it does not have the proper spec. Do not use it in a emissions vehicle. https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/vw-502-00-505-00-505-01-and-vw-504-00-507-00.503946/

 

[KHCRTDI]

You have any idea how many oil threads there is? Hell I even did research. I stopped updating this. If it does not have the proper spec. Do not use it in a emissions vehicle. https://forums.tdiclub.com/index.php?threads/vw-502-00-505-00-505-01-and-vw-504-00-507-00.503946/

Yes, that is why I named this “another oil thread”

That is a very nice thread you have built. My questions is to those who may run other then 507 oils in there common rail. The oil I am interested in using is ran in more complicated after treatment systems with no problems for thousands of hours. I’m guessing there are oils not on the list that would in fact meet the specs, but may just not have ever been tested? I do not care about warranty, and I do plan on deleting in the future. I am more worried about engine (not after treatment) longevity.

 

[CleverUserName]

Yes, that is why I named this “another oil thread”

That is a very nice thread you have built. My questions is to those who may run other then 507 oils in there common rail. The oil I am interested in using is ran in more complicated after treatment systems with no problems for thousands of hours. I’m guessing there are oils not on the list that would in fact meet the specs, but may just not have ever been tested? I do not care about warranty, and I do plan on deleting in the future.

The 507 specs aren’t published but it’s going to be a C3 type oil with some additional oxidation resistance to be Long Life Euro IV classification.

With a synthetic CJ or CK oil you will likely get lower wear metals and better performance. I have 2 GM diesels that require Dexos 2 and only run CJ-4 5w40, 10w30 and 10w40 in both them, one since new. I don’t believe a small increase in ash content is significant unless your engine burns oil which mine don’t.

I would not use a mineral based or synthetic blend CJ or CK HD oil and run it to 10k miles. You’re just asking for problems by leaving it in that long IMO.

 

[KHCRTDI]

The 507 specs aren’t published but it’s going to be a C3 type oil with some additional oxidation resistance to be Long Life Euro IV classification.

With a synthetic CJ or CK oil you will likely get lower wear metals and better performance. I have 2 GM diesels that require Dexos 2 and only run CJ-4 5w40, 10w30 and 10w40 in both them, one since new. I don’t believe a small increase in ash content is significant unless your engine burns oil which mine don’t.

I would not use a mineral based or synthetic blend CJ or CK HD oil and run it to 10k miles. You’re just asking for problems by leaving it in that long IMO.

Thanks for this information. Can I ask what problems your are referring to?

 

[CleverUserName]

Thanks for this information. Can I ask what problems your are referring to?

Oxidation and sludge formation. I would never try to run a mineral based oil for 10k miles in a small 4 qt sump. You’re in uncharted territory with that one. Good luck!

 

[DivineChaos]

Yes, that is why I named this “another oil thread”

That is a very nice thread you have built. My questions is to those who may run other then 507 oils in there common rail. The oil I am interested in using is ran in more complicated after treatment systems with no problems for thousands of hours. I’m guessing there are oils not on the list that would in fact meet the specs, but may just not have ever been tested? I do not care about warranty, and I do plan on deleting in the future. I am more worried about engine (not after treatment) longevity.

Yeah I did a lot of research to find all the oils that were spec'd and passed. Amsoil has a 507 oil but it is not "approved"

 

[CleverUserName]

Yeah I did a lot of research to find all the oils that were spec'd and passed. Amsoil has a 507 oil but it is not "approved"

Amsoil AEL 5w30 does have the 507 and 504 approval and has for a number of years. It’s on the PDS.

 

[KHCRTDI]

Being a former Cat tech, if you have your DPF still on your car, don't use it. Short term isn't going to hurt the emissions but long term its going to plug up way faster. Even normal truck DPFs get plugged up quickly. Also running 10W30 in a cold weather is too thick when cold in a CR tdi
It's not a bad oil by any means, just not right for your VW CR. If you lived in a warm state and didn't require emissions, crack on.

Thank you Dannyboy, that was very helpful! Michigan is pretty cold especially this time of year. I see that Walmart has the Castrol Edge II back in stock right now so maybe I’ll pick up some of that.

 

[tikal]

HCRTDI, this might be helpful also: https://360.lubrizol.com/Resources/Relative-Performance-Tools

And if you want to get your PhD in motor oils

Afton Oil Specifications | PDF | Motor Oil | Litre
Afton chemicals info about oil specifications

(source of this link)