Volkswagen's Clean Air Act violations on 2009+ TDIs spark huge recall, investigations

[crazyrunner33]

Im not inclined to accept class action. I think class action is pre mature since we dont know the outcome.

If I am left alone, and my warranty honroed, a small token for false advertising would be nice.

If I lose any amount of power or economy - even 2mpg, then its hammer down time as far as I am concerned.

Or they can replace my 2015 TDI SEL with a 2015 TSI SEL and send me a check for the difference in MSRP. We know that wont happen.

Buybacks, LOL. Right. This is VW. $200 loyalty card.

The only buyback will be a federally mandated one, IF the cars cannot be made to comply with spec.

The result will likely be: cars made to fall in to spec with moderate to significant fuel economy and performance hit (10-20% likely) Think 8-10MPG hit on non urea cars - urea cars -???. Devaluation due to TDi losing the main benefit - it now gets the same FE as a gasser TSI, but diesel is more - huge hit in value, no one wants them.
VW compensates owners with $200 gift cards for service / parts / driver gear
FED mandates VW extends emissions warranty to 150K(?) miles.

Thats your likely solution.
Oh and Class action lawsuit members will see about $50, while the law firm gets about 500,000.00.

That sounds about right. People are getting a bit too excited about the possibility of a buyback. The Ram that the media blew out of the water was barely above trade in value, or people were given the option to fix the recall with a hundred dollar gift card.

 

[Borsig]

A buyback seems almost as a guarantee in my opinion, if the fix is a detune and lessening the capabilities.

Why do you people think that vw cares if you lose power and economy?

Thats NOT going to cause a buyback. Not unless its forced on them by the fed. The fed doesn't care as long as the car complies

 

[totitan]

With tune and 'other' work....335d would beat the pants off my M3 in almost all aspects...I had a E93 335i with a Dinan tune and other goodies, it was north of 400 hp/lb ft as well...
Your garage list is impressive...RESPECT.
I am also a gear head. Grew up under the hood of a 69 Cuda and a couple 69/70 Mustangs...

LOL...thanks. They all have specific purposes

240Z...autox and road racing
Hemi RR and Cuda....like mutual funds that you can have fun with
Titan.....modded with big brakes and airbags...great tow rig
Rabbit....daughters car
JSW.....intown workhorse
335d......road trips and wifes 70 mile freeway commute

 

[evoblade]

Where are these facts that VW will be fined $18 billion? Caterpillar was fined $2.5 million over 590,000 diesel engines that were non-compliant. They, too, lied about the engines.

That is not a fact. It is the maximum theoretical fine based on the numbers and statute/EPA regulations. Just like every criminal/civil case there will be negotiations and VW will be paying some percent of that maximum. Probably a small one. Doing a recall on the cars will almost certainly cost more than what the fines will end up being. Unless they get away with just a re-flash and no buybacks/compensation.

 

[lynnejohn]

I don't think it sounds like EVERYONE wins here. I would still be driving a car that violates the very reason I purchased a "clean" diesel in the first place. Because I thought it was clean. I would be disappointed with that resolution. I want a buy back or a swap for a non-TDI model.

Ok, almost everyone. Anyone having purchased a TDI that feels ripped off because of false advertising(saying a cars emissions are clean when they will not pass EPA tests) would be shafted. I stand corrected.

 

[Chris]

Huh? The Volt can't do fast charging. It's limited to 3.3 KW. You must be confusing it with something else

It all comes down to reading comprehension my friend...

 

[rhino4evr]

Ok, almost everyone. Anyone having purchased a TDI that feels ripped off because of false advertising(saying a cars emissions are clean when they will not pass EPA tests) would be shafted. I stand corrected.

The Environment still loses. So you could spin this as EVERYONE loses. Depending on how strongly you feel about it.

 

[arcticcat93]

So despite this being dream thinking. I'll throw water on something else.

What is a "compliant TDI"? They don't exist at this moment. Who is to say VW can even manufacture a "compliant TDI" without making HUGE changes to the engine, and other components. How long will that take to produce for 500k people? (in America alone).

If they did some sort of buy back if won't be for another TDI, that's for sure.

If they are forced to do a buy back, they cant tell you what you can/can't replace it with.

No one thought toyota tacomas would be bought back.... Till there was a recall Toyota didnt have the resources to fix at the time.


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[rhino4evr]

this article makes me want to punch walls. No Worries, just ask for a Loaner, it's better then driving that toxic missile around, and endangering children

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/what-to-do-own-volkswagen-recalled_55fdcf38e4b00310edf754c4

 

[arcticcat93]

Why do you people think that vw cares if you lose power and economy?



Thats NOT going to cause a buyback. Not unless its forced on them by the fed. The fed doesn't care as long as the car complies

Because the epa rates fuel mileage as well, if the fuel mileage of current cars drops with the 'fix' then they were falsely advertised when sold


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[TDIMeister]

I gave a tech presentation at TDIFest over the Labor Day weekend on the subject of DEF and SCR. I figured it would be relevant and timely to share it here in light of developments.
TDIFest 2015 Tech Presentation - Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) and SCR

 

[trickie]

Decent article, hate the title

"your guide to dieselgate"

http://jalopnik.com/your-guide-to-dieselgate-volkswagens-diesel-cheating-c-1731857018

I got the software update this past spring in my 40k service. I don't think it has run quite as well since - I notice a little less power in gears 5/6 on the highway. But what do I know, it could just be the fumes are getting to me and I drive like a Masshol*.

Man, this really does piss me off. Can't believe they did this so intentionally, AND then marketed it as "clean." My 2013 JSW TDI replaced a very solid 2001 Corolla - this car is a LOT more fun to drive, but turns out the Corolla was actually a lot cleaner, and after the eventual software upgrades the mileage is probably the same at a much lower cost.

And yes, the environmental aspect is a big deal to me as a liberal in the liberal northeast. I get that I am producing less CO2 than almost every other vehicle out there. But no, I don't feel better knowing that much of whatever smog I may be causing might just be blown from Boston towards Europe. If it all ended up in Wolfsburg maybe I might feel better.

If someone has already posted this, my apologies, but here goes an attempt to lighten the mood - be sure to watch it long enough for him to lose it . . . my favorite has to be "has anyone even bought a Passat since 2012?"

"(german dictator) finds out about VW EPA scandal"

http://oppositelock.kinja.com/front-page-me-bro-1731829473

 

[TarwheelTDI]

OK.........first post........my head is exploding trying to read all this crap.

Bought my TDI Sportwagen 3 weeks ago (still don't have a license plate on it). This model has a urea system. Does anyone know why VW would have carried over the software algorithm from the E188 engine to the E288 engine? This doesn't make sense except that, even with a urea system, the engine wasn't compliant. Wouldn't the potential "fix" be easier on the the E288 engine?

I'm grasping at straws.....

 

[Borsig]

Because the epa rates fuel mileage as well, if the fuel mileage of current cars drops with the 'fix' then they were falsely advertised when sold


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And so did kia and hyundai.

There were no buy backs. But people did get $20-200 in class action disbursements.

Stop dreaming. You'll only end up disappointed.

 

[spartanmanor]

And how does the environment win with a buy back?

 

[Borsig]

OK.........first post........my head is exploding trying to read all this crap.

Bought my TDI Sportwagen 3 weeks ago (still don't have a license plate on it). This model has a urea system. Does anyone know why VW would have carried over the software algorithm from the E188 engine to the E288 engine? This doesn't make sense except that, even with a urea system, the engine wasn't compliant. Wouldn't the potential "fix" be easier on the the E288 engine?

I'm grasping at straws.....

The common belief is that scr urea cars will be easier to make complaint with more def usage. But the truth is, we dont know. Nor do we know why vw continued to use the switch.

Best guess is to increase mpg and allow urea refills to be done inn10k intervals

 

[lynnejohn]

they shouldn't be given a grandfather option when the specs of the laws were in place before they sold the cars to customers. period.

grandfather'ing' is intended to cover vehicles produced before an emissions law was put into place

So you would rather see all the current TDI owners stuck in the middle? I personally don't believe a fix is possible without effecting the durability of the cars (just my subjective guess) and I also don't think VW could afford a 500,000 car buyback. I would rather they pay for their deception so that most current owners don't get shafted (myself included.)

 

[brewpastor]

so why wouldn't I take the dealer who sold me the car to court locally. They are the ones who told me all the details. They took my money. Let them work it out with their parent company!

 

[applejacks]

Why do you people think that vw cares if you lose power and economy?
Thats NOT going to cause a buyback. Not unless its forced on them by the fed. The fed doesn't care as long as the car complies

Fraud. I was sold a 'clean diesel' vehicle and it turns out it's everything but that. And by design.

There isn't any way to spin this, it has been admitted by VW. Tell me why they wouldn't buy it back, or give some sort of compensation.

 

[Borsig]

Tacomas were bought back because toyota didn't have the resources to fix them all as they came in. They didnt have the parts or man power.

It takes very little resources to de tune via reprogramming, and it takes none for you, the end user, to pour def in the little blue spout every month.

Use your head people.

 

[1854sailor]

Everyone should just turn off their computers and chill for a bit. Waaay too much conjecture being thrown around. Drive more, worry less.

 

[rhino4evr]

so why wouldn't I take the dealer who sold me the car to court locally. They are the ones who told me all the details. They took my money. Let them work it out with their parent company!

You can technically "sue" anyone, but the local dealer would not be found at fault, as they had no knowledge of the issue, nor do they manufacture the vehicle.

So go for it....

 

[Borsig]

Fraud. I was sold a 'clean diesel' vehicle and it turns out it's everything but that. And by design.
There isn't any way to spin this, it has been admitted by VW. Tell me why they wouldn't buy it back, or give some sort of compensation.

Shareholders > you.

That's why. They have your money. They need it to pay fines. Youll be lucky to get that loyalty gift card and a detune.

You really dont get how this all works, do you?

 

[rhino4evr]

Everyone should just turn off their computers and chill for a bit. Waaay too much conjecture being thrown around. Drive more, worry less.

I'm afraid it's only going to get worse before it gets better. I don't think any "solution" will make "everyone" happy. It's an impossible scenario.

 

[brewpastor]

Everyone should just turn off their computers and chill for a bit. Waaay too much conjecture being thrown around. Drive more, worry less.

Do you work for The Company?

 

[arcticcat93]

And so did kia and hyundai.



There were no buy backs. But people did get $20-200 in class action disbursements.



Stop dreaming. You'll only end up disappointed.

Im not dreaming, just putting out facts.

VW bought back my CR TDI last year under lemon law and i replaced it with a GTI to avoid all the foreseen emissions problems in the future with a CR.




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[CDubber]

The stockholders have already fined them 16 billion...Mark

The stockholders (who sold) have simply fined the other stockholders (who didn't).

 

[brewpastor]

You can technically "sue" anyone, but the local dealer would not be found at fault, as they had no knowledge of the issue, nor do they manufacture the vehicle.

So go for it....

OK I won't

 

[Borsig]

I'm afraid it's only going to get worse before it gets better. I don't think any "solution" will make "everyone" happy. It's an impossible scenario.

The only ones that come out better than when they started, will be epa. That's not bashing them. Its truth.

 

[sandydeb]

Buybacks will only happen if the Fed's force it.

Something tells me they are salivating in the billions in 'extra' money they are about to get their hands on to spend on themselves. Good luck getting them to take our (TDI owners') side.