ALH+Quattro+81 caddy!

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
So since I'm starting to run into the TDI portions of the build now figure it's time to post up on here.

I'm currently working on converting my 81 VW caddy (AKA rabbit pickup) into a completely mental TDI.

Car is a fairly good 81' CAddy I bought as a summer DD a few summers ago. I loved the thing. Slammed it on the stock 13's via a flipped axle, drop plates, and cut springs (it's a mk1 didn't make it any more bouncy). I rocked it like that for a summer and drove it everywhere. The 1.6L CIS engine only had ~61k when I bought it and i drove it ~7k miles. After sitting for a winter the E10 fuel that I was running took it's toll on the CIS. The system leaked, ran horrible and eventually failed, by flooding all the time.

Been trying to decide which route to go and started repairing the body. Being a MK1 from northern IL/southern WI area it had seen salt. Floors were toast, needing the rear suspension mount fixed and basically a full pan. I looked at a few different swaps, but really wanted a "work" truck. I haul lots of different things from engine blocks, to interiors for my other projects and selling things. A tdi swap sounded cool, but the only spare tdi I had really needed AWD to make it viable for even semi daily use. I had looked at putting it in my coupe, but plumbing and mounting issues made it more difficult then the V8 I already had. So I toyed with the idea of AWD TDI caddy.

Did a bunch of reading on here, and caddy forums about different swaps from haldex to RWD. I really didn't like the expense and complexity of haldex, and RWD just didn't seem much better then FWD. I wanted real permanent AWD, AKA quattro. I have lots of old quattro parts in my collection collecting dust so I started mocking things up and measuring and well the math wasn't telling me no. So I went a little deeper and test fit an engine. Confirmed a few things I feared, but also proved that the math though slightly flawed was not far off. So began the build. It's going to progress a little slower now, do to having to relocate, but hopefully that doesn't slow it down to far.

Basic engine specs
ALH block/crank
BEW pistons with valve pocket work
Girdle
Rosten I-beams
Race ALH head, oval ports, lots of porting, .475/.438" lift cam, 38/35mm valves
Custom intake (from 10vt audi)
Compounds
10mm with .341's for now

Some pictures:
the caddy


bay coming apart


oil cooler mounting in new bumper.



engine mocked up




axle flange centers are 190mm from bellhousing




 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
A6 tdi DQT 6-speed



New intake


LP turbo mounting option 1 (HX35W)


Option 2


Turbos Hw35w with Gt1749v compressor (from blown engine) on it, next to Gt2256v


ALH Quattro


Floor before cutting


After cutting
 

mrchill

TDIClub Enthusiast, Super Secret Diesel Ninja Vend
Joined
Sep 16, 2003
Location
MASS! home of THE WORLD SERIES CHAMPION RED SOX! x
TDI
96 B4v red \ 98 Mk3 green\98 Mk3 Jetta black\ 99 Mk4 Jetta green x2\ 99 Mk4 Golf silver x2\ 99 Mk4 Jetta black\ 97 B4 sedan green\04 JSW gold\03 JSW silver
Very nice...similar to what I was doing to mine....only my pickup is really rusty....terribly so...but thats what I prefer to use as its cheap and is going to be cut up anyway......
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
Very nice...similar to what I was doing to mine....only my pickup is really rusty....terribly so...but thats what I prefer to use as its cheap and is going to be cut up anyway......
as you can tell from my pictures mines not perfect.

I forgot to mention rear end is being sourced from an Audi 90Q. with Locking Diff Function enabled for some rear locker fun!

Floor is going to be a tube frame chassis that will also be tied into the rear bed frame to house the new rear subframe and diff. Modify the 90Q strut housings to run a koni motorsports short shock (for lowering and clearance). I will have to add strut towers in the bed, but they will be minimal and Not cut to much into the Truck portion of the vehicle.

I'm probably going to pull the fenders to tuck some 245/45-16 tires under it. That way I can actually have traction. My pass side quarter is already dented in so I'll cut the quarter and build a new box flare! I just have a hard on for box flares. I'm also going early westy front, save the squares!
 

greengeeker

Vendor
Joined
Feb 8, 2006
Location
Cambridge, MN
TDI
2002 Jetta GLS
Hand roughly shows spindle location
Have you considered modifying your header panel so you can slide the engine forward 4-5"? You are going to have some wicked driveshaft angles both front to back as well as up and down. On that last one, since you have removed the floor can you cut some more away to tuck the engine/trans up further?
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
Have you considered modifying your header panel so you can slide the engine forward 4-5"? You are going to have some wicked driveshaft angles both front to back as well as up and down. On that last one, since you have removed the floor can you cut some more away to tuck the engine/trans up further?
I can't the bottom of that header panel isn't much more then 1-2" thick. The engine is on the ground in the pictures so I can figure out were to cut the tunnel. I will be tucking the engine up quite far.

If I move the engine forward I also don't have anywhere to put the cooling system. I want to still retain the car as streetable and a fuctional truck so rear cooling isn't an option. Axle angle isn't any further then a off roader or slammed air cooled. It'll be roughly 10 degrees.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
Shove it off to the side Dasher-style.
I wanted to do that. that is how all my old Audi;s were. Issue is if you relocate the oil filter, which I'm still working on, you only have ~10" by 20" that's not a very big rad. Plus it's behind all the accessories.

Is the axle axle a little extreme yes, will it work, I think so.
here is a picture of Dahlback racings 900-1100HP golf RS. this car is tracked to all hell and doesn't break axles
 

2many diesels

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2011
Location
Nor Cal
TDI
rabbit pickup 1z swap Audi A4 Quattro ALH. 02 Beetle TDI. 99 Golf TDI. 03 Wagon TDI. 914 Porsche ALH t
You can cool that motor with a very small radiator. I am using a modified midget radiator in my rabbit truck with a 1z. Really it is still too much radiator.
I hope you have addressed the steering issue on your project. Your steering rack will have to be on top of the trans at the firewall, and the tie rods will have to pass through the inner fenders right about where the frame horns/torque boxes are for the shock towers. I think that will bring your steering sector shaft right about where the brake booster is.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
You can cool that motor with a very small radiator. I am using a modified midget radiator in my rabbit truck with a 1z. Really it is still too much radiator.
I hope you have addressed the steering issue on your project. Your steering rack will have to be on top of the trans at the firewall, and the tie rods will have to pass through the inner fenders right about where the frame horns/torque boxes are for the shock towers. I think that will bring your steering sector shaft right about where the brake booster is.
Is your car running 50+ PSI? I want excess cooling for this engine as I have no idea how it will behave when run wide open. Stock yes I can see a tiny honda radiator working, but at 250-300WHP I don't think so.

Steering yes I am relocating the rack on top of the transmission and using modified 90 front suspension to do it. with steering behind the struts not in front like the audi.

Going to be building the frame for this car basically as a independent chassis then dropping the body back on. Not sure if I'll make it removable or weld it on, probably the later. The suspension will end up being basically all sourced from the 90. still torn on going 5-112 or 4-100.
 

scubagli

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Location
leeds ny
TDI
1986 audi 4000Q ALH SWAP in progress...
Nice project.
Love it.
Where did you source that trans?


Sent from crazy town.
 

2many diesels

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2011
Location
Nor Cal
TDI
rabbit pickup 1z swap Audi A4 Quattro ALH. 02 Beetle TDI. 99 Golf TDI. 03 Wagon TDI. 914 Porsche ALH t
Is your car running 50+ PSI? I want excess cooling for this engine as I have no idea how it will behave when run wide open. Stock yes I can see a tiny honda radiator working, but at 250-300WHP I don't think so.

No, I am running just slightly over stock. The radiator I am using is (supposed to be) rated for 500 hp, although I am sure I will never get there.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
little update on this car.
Going to go air ride on this. I want the ability to haul things in it from engines, to tool boxes, bikes, body parts, whatever else I can think of. Coils just won't be good enough, so I will be doing my first ever air install, just to complicate things I guess.

As no kit exists for this car I will be completely designing everything. Which does give me some flexibility in design since I made the choice before building the frame. Now to figure the rest of the geometry out and set mid stroke at my lowered ride height. Hopefully have frame design stuff done this week. Get started on frame in the next week. With air I just feel it gives me the ability to make this really as an all purpose vehicle less compromise and better handling more then likely.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
http://oldskoolvw.com/ check out this link i think you will find what your needing
his kit is a very nice kit if you have stock caddy suspension which I don't. This car is using a modified audi suspension and drivetrain. The bag system needs to be for that and of the 8 companies i've looked at not one I've found offers a bolt in solution. it's a strut system similar to the mk1 fronts, but with different mounting.

what I will end up having to get is a DIY kit from air lift and welding the tubes up and then making the brackets and steering arms. will be about the same work as coils as there are no bolt in coils that are short enough. I need 90 suspension that is 2" shorter then stock just to get to stock ride height on the rabbit.
 
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v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
do to timing on this project and loss of my garage I will need to delay the compound setup. The car is scheduled to be at sowo and I want it there and driving. I have a bone stock 130k ALH I can use. I'll build the manifold for the 2256v as it will be used as the compound. Build the 3" exhaust and just build the car with all the other stuff that's needed to have an AWD slammed mk1.

I figure this will also let me compare my race cam/oval port head to a stock unit with the 2256v before going and cutting the down pipe up and going with the compounds. Will also mean I can run the stage2+ clutch my buddy has and deal with upgrading later.

Air ride on this car will be an interesting project as I want it to air completely out and lay frame.
 

Freestyle72

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 5, 2011
Location
Milton, ON
TDI
2000 Jetta TDI, 2001 Jetta TDI
I have a caddy with more rust issues than I initially thought on purchase. I will be doing something similar. Will probably wind up cutting the floor pan out of a B5 A4 and welding it into the caddy.

Loving your build so far great inspiration.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
http://www.motorgeek.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=50064
someone on motorgeek is selling a bag kit that might work for you with little modification.
would work in the front. I already have a goo idea what I'm using.

I also have wheels sourced now. 16 by 9.5" et 13mm's going to be wrapped in 245/45-16's.

also there is nothing stock that I am using really. Modified this, cut down that. Will be an interesting little car to drive. I can't wait to get the wheels here and start seeing where things sit.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
trying to decide on a few issue. Biggest one right now is what clutch to use. I'm hesitant to just throw a grabby clutch on this. The car will be super light so will that make it easier to drive or worse with an aggressive clutch, I think the later. My other issue is what specs I need for holding capacity. I know the stock engine with large nozzles and a 2256v will only be in the 210-230WHP range and ~300 Wtq. But what will my built engine be 450 wtq? So like 550 crank for safety? I'm only seeing like stage 4's and higher any where close to that rating. Or twin discs, which is kinda the way I'm leaning.

I'm just trying to justify the 1900 dollar Clutchmasters 850 kit. It has 2 8.5" discs one sprung one not, the discs are kevlar and can hold 625 tq or I can step up to the ceramic sprung disc with solid kevlar and have like 790 or something like that. Think 2 kevlars will do it.

The other major thing i can't decide is exhaust system. I know I need a 3" coming out of the 2256v as it has a 3" v-band, and the outlet to the hx35 is 3", but do I stay 3" or go 4" to reduce the back pressure? Then where do I run it. Not really digging stacks, but not sure I want it out the rear, maybe a fender hole behind passenger's wheel?
 

scubagli

Veteran Member
Joined
May 7, 2009
Location
leeds ny
TDI
1986 audi 4000Q ALH SWAP in progress...
It's just me, but I'd run stacks, or the fender dump...in that order, if your doing the box flares you could run it out of the top of the pass side.
My MKII is making 280wtq, spec stage3, it's a pain to drive in traffic, but everywhere else it's great...l know that's a long way from the power your looking at.


Sent from crazy town.
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
It's just me, but I'd run stacks, or the fender dump...in that order, if your doing the box flares you could run it out of the top of the pass side.
My MKII is making 280wtq, spec stage3, it's a pain to drive in traffic, but everywhere else it's great...l know that's a long way from the power your looking at.


Sent from crazy town.
that really makes me lean away from the stage 3 and 4 clutches. I want something smooth. I just found out the 850 can come with a steel flywheel, so that really makes me think that's the solution, it's just a lot of money. Hoping to get started on the suspension and chassis soon so I can get the stance setup and make the flares clear the tires when aired out.

Decided against pulling the track width in to make wide body not needed. The resulting track width would be almost the same as stock, but the overall performance would probably be less then desired. Narrow width with lots of power usually doesn't work well.
 

GT TDI Golf

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Joined
Nov 3, 2006
Location
Birmingham/Auburn, AL
TDI
2001 Golf TDI
The box flares look so awesome! Good grief I've gotta quit looking at these Caddy TDI AWD builds... My Dad has one that's just sitting at his shop. Begging for a TDI swap. Good luck on your build. Do you think you'll have it done by SOWO this year? Pretty ambitious goal!
 

v8 coupe

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Location
bloomington, mn
TDI
09 rabbit 2.5L Gas
The box flares look so awesome! Good grief I've gotta quit looking at these Caddy TDI AWD builds... My Dad has one that's just sitting at his shop. Begging for a TDI swap. Good luck on your build. Do you think you'll have it done by SOWO this year? Pretty ambitious goal!
tis' and I really hope so.
 
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