Bosch - made in Germany? I think not.

Almost everything I've ever seen from Bosch says "made in Germany" on the product.

Last week, two associates in our Engineering department were in China on a business trip. When they came back, one of them asked me, "hey, do you use Bosch parts for your little diesel vee dub?"

He came back with photographs of huge lines of Bosch parts coming down the lines being stamped with "made in Germany". Everything. According to what the chinese representatives told them, Bosch's diesel automotive division is one of their biggest customers (along with other divisions of Bosch).

All I'm saying is... all I know is what I saw. And in the photographs I saw Bosch fuel filters and glow plugs all being stamped with "made in Germany", sitting right there in China. So... that that however you will.

I've only seen VR6 spring codes a combination of white/blue

Bosch glow plugs are made in France. BOYCOT FRANCE! /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

[ QUOTE ]
gearhead said:
I've only seen VR6 spring codes a combination of white/blue

[/ QUOTE ]

huh?

gearhead what ya smokin man?

RE: the bosch plant? that bothers me that the stuff stamped there... but are the parts MADE in China or just assembled in china? (just a question that I hope might make it a bit better)...

reminds me of an anti-corporate mag that i was flipping through at my brother's . . . (might have been adbusters?) It is just one big corporate empire feeding us what we want . . . Corporate mantra: "blindfold the consumer and make sure you perfume the poop"

MADE in China. Made and assembled and packaged up and shipped out. According to my fellow engineer. I personally was not in China.

But he said it's how the customer requests it. They'll make anything you want. If you want it to say "made in France" or "made in Germany", fine.

I saw about a dozen pictures. There were a lot of tools being made as well for Bosch. Then at the end, you see the stamp hit it in the still shot, "made in Germany".

I didn't see anything that said "made in France" but I according to the engineer, when he asked the Chinese about it, they replied that Bosch specifies how the stamp should read on every product. There is a bbq grill company that also gets their stuff made in China and stamped elsewhere. He had a whole list of products (mostly German) that are now made in China and stamped with other countries names.

I just creeped me out. I mean, I know that OUR company is sitting in China right now to get our SAME products made (less quality) for the same price we sell to our customers, but at least it's all disclosed that it's made in China. Other countries have other laws.

Shrug.

Like I said, all I know is what I saw. I can not say what company does what with certainty.

Hehehe, my Jetta was really made in China, it's just stamped Made in Mexico....


ROFLMAO

Maybe "Germany" is a city in China /images/graemlins/wink.gif.

[ QUOTE ]
anti-corporate mag that i was flipping through at my brother's . . . (might have been adbusters?) It is just one big corporate empire feeding us what we want . . . Corporate mantra: "blindfold the consumer and make sure you perfume the poop"

[/ QUOTE ]

adbusters Rocks!

When I was in college, one of my summer jobs was in a packaging warehouse. We took Harley Davidson parts from boxes that said "Made in China" and put them in boxes that said "Made in America." I worked there for two days.

-Nick

Maybe that's why all the MAF are going bad /images/graemlins/crazy.gif

this has to be the dumbest thread ever... who cares? is there not enough sh1t to stir with oil wars? /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

HOT OFF THE TICKER!!!!

-NEWS FLASH
-FRONT PAGE

-AMZOIL IS REALLY MADE IN CHINA!
-THE LATEST INDICATIONS ARE THAT THEY USE A PROPIETERY SOY SAUCE BREW THATS REALLY NOT A GROUP IV SYNTHETIC. SOURCES WERE QUOTED AS SAYING THEY SAW THE BOTTLES BEING POURED INTO ONES WITH "MADE IN THE USA" ON IT.

-END

All kidding aside, the laws vary from country to country. International commerce is a funny thing. Ship a part via one country to ship to another to save a few $.0001 dollars...yeah no kidding talking microchip products here!

I used to take parts for GM that were stamped "Made in the USA" to Mexico where they would get "Partially" assembled then flown back to the States where they could get the rest of the work done. Usually this was on parts that were dangerous ore required a lot of labor to manufacture. They were still by the letter of the law made in the USA they just had a little help from Mexico.

I don't even want to get into all the stuff I flew from Narita Tokyo to New York or Atlanta! actually I DO!

Want to here a scam! Certain cosmetic companies have third party labs do the animal testing for them to determine whether the stuff that goes in the lipstick or foundation is really "Hypo-alergenic" or "toxic". These off shore companies test all sorts of stuff not just cosmetics, what they do is have hundreds of pure bred Beagle puppies shipped over to Asia per week...we are talking 500-1000 barking puppies here! They then shipped again to over seas testing facilities where they usually meet their fate a few days later, the unlucky ones make it a few weeks /images/graemlins/eek.gif For the women out there, think about the next time you put on litstick that says non-toxic or anything else....keep in mind they had to figure out what "toxic" means in the context of a living Beagle /images/graemlins/eek.gif

Go shopping at Wal-Mart. I was there yesterday and I am now trying to get selective about buying only products that ARE NOT stamped "Made in China". I have nothing against them and there are times that I do buy products made in China, I have nothing against good stiff competition for US manufacturing. BUT I do try to spread my resources around when possible.

US companies that try to compete in manufacturing have a hard time competeing against the cheap labor and business laws in China. We can't forget that when you have a billion plus mouths to feed they are gonna have to do whatever they can to feed them so we need to step up to the plate and be prepared to compete directly with them...

I can hear it now, I will never live in a hut just so I can compete with a Chinese laborer...Well thats the type of person who has no say in the matter, truth be told. The ones that compete are those that figure out how to make large scale production facilites that can rapidly switch to other product lines.

Using VW as an example, In Germany they have mobile stamping that simply rolls into position so that they can make a Golf body for a few cycles then roll in the next one and produce a Jetta on the same machine. The idea is to use automation to compete. It still requires labor but we in the USA need to compete in terms of volume of product produced...its a tough up hill battle.

The laws of Economics will eventually even the playing field (think supply demand and consumer wants on a worldwide scale here, The US is no longer the largest consumer of products) as the workers there or elsewhere for that matter learn to "want" things that of which we have here in the US or other countries we can supply them to them. But first we must learn to compete in this new playing field.

The winner of this latest economic battle will win it not by crying foul to the consumer but by figuring out how we can do it better...I think Americans have forgotten that, but they will figure it out again, someday.

DB

Amen, DB! /images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[ QUOTE ]
Drivbiwire said:
The winner of this latest economic battle will win it not by crying foul to the consumer but by figuring out how we can do it better...I think Americans have forgotten that, but they will figure it out again, someday.


[/ QUOTE ]
Too true, brother. America kicked @$$ in manufacturing for years, but now too many people believe that we're the best because we WERE the best. It's a very dynamic environment, and to succeed, you evolve or you become extinct.

Nothing wrong about stuff made in China....

it's fun to make fun of cheap chinese stuff...but they are very capable in the manfacture of products. It is dependent on how much the customer wants the quality for the price.

The labor is cheaper also...

The chinese manufacturing capabilities is clouded by stereotypes...much like diesels in America -- smelly, stinky, slow, smoke, thanks to GM

There is no doubt that China can manufacture high quality goods like you said it's all about what the buyer specified and whether they are willing to pay for that quality.

To keep things in perspective the issue is with the Bean counters cutting every corner they can. It's kind of funny but the fundamental flaw designed into our economic system ultimatly drives business out of our country...Supply demand and cost of manufacturing in conjuction with the ability to supply goods via a worldwide supply chain. No country is too far these days to provide goods...and soon it will be services /images/graemlins/eek.gif

DB

[ QUOTE ]
Drivbiwire said:
There is no doubt that China can manufacture high quality goods like you said it's all about what the buyer specified and whether they are willing to pay for that quality.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, Fireworks!! /images/graemlins/smile.gif


Anyway, a penny for my thought. It could be "Made in Germany" because it was engineered in Germany? Simply they found a manufacture who can produce them cheap.

Just looked at a Bosch fuel filter on my garage shelf (for my 86 1.6D) and it clearly says "Made in Spain". Could it have been manufactured during WWII when Tito and ****** were buddies?? I suspect that most members on this forum won't have any knowledge of that relationship owing to the apparent age gap between them and the few old farts like me who vicariously enjoy their efforts to get more speed, power, and attract women. Any concerns about Spain being the source of some Bosch products?

[ QUOTE ]
Drivbiwire said:
No country is too far these days to provide goods...and soon it will be services


[/ QUOTE ]

Unloading services offshore is already here. Computer programmers in India were the "first wave". Now customer service call centers are moving overseas. Saab just did this with its IT support... if someone in Atlanta at Saab corporate has a problem with his computer, he has to call Spain for support instead of a guy on the other side of the building.

Actually, during the years of US sanctions against South Africa in the 70's and 80's, West Germany was a suburb of Jo'burg, on the East Rand near Boksburg.
That's so they could manufcature stuff there that was shipped out, "Made in West Germany"

One of my pet peeves is lack of information on where products are made. Outright dishonesty about the country of origin is unacceptable. These folks should be regulated into compliance if they want to sell into our markets.

As I recall from Economics 101, the efficient functioning of capitalist markets requires that consumers have enough information on which to make their choices. Maybe this is one area in which better regulatory intervention by government is needed...apparently these jokers are not "self-regulating".

A robot can make a part for my VW or my Harley equally well in the U.S., Mexico, China or wherever. What I really want to know is where wealth is being transferred to, as a result of my (and other consumers) purchases? Personally, I prefer to buy products sourced in North America or the EU. It's getting harder and more expensive and I don't want to hear that I'm being duped by dishonest labelling. /images/graemlins/mad.gif

I just had some Chinese food that was made in the US. Also, on my last trip to Germany, I had Chinese food. German Chinese food? US Chinese food? What is this world coming to? Next, there will be Italian food made in the US (or has is been done already).

Where I used to work, I headed up a project that was transferring the manufacturing of Aqua Fresh from Japan to the US. The Aqua Fresh is for the Japanese market but it is now made in the US. Can you believe it? Why did it happen? US manufacturing is cheaper and the quality is better. Now that's weird.

BTW: Bosch has made spark plugs and points in India for as long as I can remember.

The box for my glow plug has a sticker that was added with the part number that also says "Made in France". The sticker also says distributed by Robert Bosch Corp., Broadview, IL 60153.

To further complicate matters, the Bosch box itself has "glow plug" written on it in 5 different languages. English, German, French, Spanish, and an Asian language (i.e., Chinese, Japanese, or Korean). /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

Let's face it, whether you agree with it or not ... the unfortunate reality is that as long as other countries can do equivalent work of Americans for a small fraction of the cost, international commerce is here to stay.

It's economics but it's ethics as well. Do US companies outsource to 3rd world countries to keep their pricing competitive -or- do they do it because they CAN and labor pricing is ridiculously low. Is it competitive pricing -or- bottom line that motivates companies to reduce their operating costs? It always raises an eyebrow when I see a complex electronic component coming from a country that, just a few years ago, couldn't even feed itself adequately. With a few well placed 'key' personnel and some sophisticted state of the art equipment, just about anybody can produce bleeding edge products. The difference is the cost of labor. The question remains, are those savings being passed on to the customer or is it just being used to fatten up the companies 'bottom line'. Stepping deeper, are those increased profits being passed on to employees in the form of bonuses, or is it used for capital investment, or maybe just to fatten up the salaries of a few executives. After Enron, who knows...

I'm sure those countries are glad for the jobs. Is that fact leveraged to the max by large corporations by offering jobs, yes, but at rock minimum wages? It's also politics. Mix in a healthy dose of social mores as well. Global economy and politics certainly sleep together turning black and white to a very muddy gray...