Seriously, why do people keep a diesel running...?

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so your just killing the engine and the enviroment and showing how STUPID AND RETARDED you are.. and making everyone around HATE diesels.. they are loud, stinky and polute...

so TURN IT OFF!!!!!!



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Turn it on!

I may be stupid and a mooron

But hey fellow TDIER

No real offense intended to you. ( but your post is somewhat in bad taste here)

But LISTEN HERE- he says this soo well.

http://www.nonstick.com/sounds/Evil_Scientist/ltes_001.wav

Oh i hope this works!!!!! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

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SoTxBill said:
so your just killing the engine and the enviroment and showing how STUPID AND RETARDED you are.. and making everyone around HATE diesels.. they are loud, stinky and polute...

so TURN IT OFF!!!!!!



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The original question of the post asks why people leave it idling at places for quick stops. Gassers do that too! I see them, many people run in and get cigs or whatever and run out. It doesn't ask to leave it on for at least 5 minutes or whatever. I guess that he wanted to know if there is any difference on leaving it idling for quick stops. Answer so is no. What if you are stuck on a highway for 5 minutes, do you leave the engine running? Same difference. Or even a long red light.

So I leave it running, just like the gassers do. Anything different, I will shut it off and take the keys.

I guess I am a moron.

Oh. Quick stops. Didn't see that.

There is no good reason to keep it running.

Other than you know it won't restart due to a flat battery.

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LWB053 said:
errr, jasonTDI, a loss form for auto theft specifically asks if the key was inside the car. If you answer "yes", well, that's the "out" the insurance needs. Don't believe it? Take your car up to Chicago, and leave it parked with the key in it, and see if your policy takes care of you. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Been there, done that, had the T-shirt but it was in the car that was stolen..............

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Maybe in FLA. Depends on how the state dept of insurance has set up the laws. You have a HORRENDOUS theft problem in FLA. Also insurance fraud, the highest in the nation. But not here with a 1st tier carrier. I had an agency with close to 3500 clients. I KNOW the insurance business.

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SoTxBill said:most people who leave diesels idling are complete idiots.. moorons...

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- So does insulting classify you as a flamer or a troll? I forget my forum terminology as (fortunately) I haven't hadn't to use it here... /images/graemlins/smirk.gif

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SoTxBill said:and the red hot turbo is NO WHERE NEAR HOT!!!!

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- Soooo, the "red hot turbo" is no where near hot huh? No, I suppose spinning at about 100,000+ rpm and ramming air along at nearly the speed of sound wouldn't generate much in the way of heat. /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif

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SoTxBill said:so your just killing the engine and the enviroment and showing how STUPID AND RETARDED you are.. and making everyone around HATE diesels.. they are loud, stinky and polute...

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- This one is especially good.
i. How's it causing damage? Because please, if I'm actually doing damage by sitting in my driveway for less time than I sit at the average stoplight, man, I need to shutdown my car at more stoplights to help save my engine.

ii. See above flamer/troll comment

iii. I don't know what you're driving, but my TDI doesn't sounds much (if any depending on what rice-rocket I'm sitting near) louder than any other car around me, doesn't stink (smells different than a gasser sure, but hardly stinks), and certainly doesn't pollute (any worse than an average gasser - as I understand it) or churn-out black smoke.

iv. Nearly everyone I know likes my car - granted, they're probably sick of "I read <fill in the blank> on TDIClub recently" ... but that's not the point. What can we say, ~$35 to go over 1000km, who wouldn't like it! /images/graemlins/grin.gif

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SoTxBill said:... pull you head out of your ^%)^(&..

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- Doesn't fit. Does yours?

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SoTxBill said:jsut like the young boys have to have big tires and loud mufflers... yea.. i know.. the chrome wheels and valve stem lights makes it run better..

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- What correlation does idling have with blingifying a rice-rocket?


I love this forum, there's tons of good information and (generally) people are pretty cool. If you don't agree with someone that's fine. If you have a good reason and/or some good info we'd all like to hear new insights into things. But to sit and call people stupid and retarded is hardly productive - keep it to yourself.


-- Obviously a 'stupid' and 'retarded' 'mooron'

Did you know that the new Maybach is designed to shut the engine off when idling at stoplights, and instantaneously start it the moment you put your foot on the gas. This feature could make it into other Mercedes engines in the future.

Hmmm, I wonder why anyone would go through such extremes? /images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif Hmmm, I wonder why anyone would want to spend billions on EV technology?

Unless they thought that there was a real detriment to something....or someone.

Erm . . incidentally, the VOLKSWAGEN Lupo 1.3L TDI also shuts off completely when coming to a stop (after 4 secs) and restarts on pull-away /images/graemlins/smile.gif This is partly responsible for it being able to achive 3l/100km consumption. It also "Neutrals" the tranny when coasting- no engine braking- then rehooks when you give some go-pedal. (AFAIK)

Obviously - these engines were designed to do it. My car does not shut off, so, after some driving AT LOAD I always baby the turbo and let her cool down a bit for a couple of seconds before I shut down.

/images/graemlins/blush.gif)

-Michael
[edited to correct some info after some more research]

I didn’t say they wouldn’t pay. I said that they are refusing to pay - A big difference. She has already filed with the state insurance commissioner’s office and has retained a lawyer.

Her reality is, the insurance company is going to run her through every ringer they can before paying out on 5 (hers and 4 others) totaled vehicles, and related medical and personal expenses. There has already been 2 civil cases filed against her and there may be more.

I am sure the insurance company WILL pay in the end. The question is will she be bankrupt before that time comes, and of course how much is she going to get reamed for new coverage when her current policy expires.

BTW: The insurance company is a top 5 carrier in the USA.

about this woman...

TDIheater /images/graemlins/wink.gif or any coolant/oil heater is what ya need. The city of lansing recently made it illegal to leave a car unattened when idling.

As for running. Starting and stopping the engine WILL result in significantly increased wear. Leaving the car running if it is convienent to will NOT cause any problems to the car.

As for people's impressions of a diesel? Well they are all used to seeing trucks idle for days at a time.

The TDI uses about 1/2 a liter of fuel an hour. Yes, roughly 1/2 a quart of fuel when idling. So if you leave it running for 15 minutes how much fuel is that? The benefit of one less start (starter motor wear, battery wear, cam/crank/piston ring/cylinder wall wear) is far in the favor of leaving it running - as long as the vehicle can be attended (or secured in a garage or other). Even with an overly thick 15W-40, leaving it running will be better for the engine/battery/oil/whatever.

I turn the car off in general fueling, but if i'm waiting in teh car and my wife has to run into the store and I know it'll be less than 15 minutes I always leave the car running when I'm in it. No big deal. Summer time you can run into the heat soak issue and decrease performance, so sometimes turning it off is a better choice for some folks.

Bottom line. Each person needs to have enough information to make their own choice without someone like SoTxBill telling them they are retarded. Gather your own data as for your own conditions. Weigh the benefits of turning it off with leaving it idle and make the choice at each time. Obviously if you are in a high risk area or one that you thought was low risk but isn't - don't leave it running unattended...

Pretty simple. Its not a black or white issue. Very grey - lots of things to consider.

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GeWilli said:
The benefit of one less start (starter motor wear, battery wear, cam/crank/piston ring/cylinder wall wear) is far in the favor of leaving it running - as long as the vehicle can be attended (or secured in a garage or other). Even with an overly thick 15W-40, leaving it running will be better for the engine/battery/oil/whatever.


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Exactly. I will leave my car running if it will only be a short stop, for this very reason. You hear over and over again how 90% of the wear on an engine occurs when the engine is started. I guess wear may not be much of an issue on the tdi, but why take the chance? I'll leave it running usually, depending on location.


As some people have said, there are a couple cars that will shut down at stop lights... so what?! The vw manual also says you should upshift to 5th gear at some ridiculously low number like 28mph(not exactly, I don't remember). So lugging is now recommended by vw? As well as fubar-ing your turbo and intake with soot and the like? The point of the 3L Lupo is to save fuel. Shut it down, save fuel, save oil, limit pollution. That doesn't mean it's better for your car.


Oh, and I would leave a gasser running just the same. It has nothing to do really with diesel.

My thoughts,
-Nick

You guys talk as though a 15 minute lapse of turning a running engine off results in a "cold start" scenario all over again. Drive to your destination for 10 minutes or more and turn the car off. Come back in 15 minutes and feel the engine.....hmmm... still quite warm.

Yes, warm block, warm oil, warm everything. Starting it from this condition will not produce anything close to the wear you get from cold starts. There will still be much warm lubricant in the bearing surfaces and joints. So really, what's the damage in turning the car off and on a few minutes later? Even the starter won't need to work as hard.

YOu guys must live/work in nice neighborhoods.

Around here if you leave your car running outside the 7-11, it will be gone when you come out.

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chetacer said:
So really, what's the damage in turning the car off and on a few minutes later? Even the starter won't need to work as hard.

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the damage is MORE than would be if the car was left running...

like i said its not a clear cut but sort of fuzzy area - benefits might not be enough BUT most of us here are pretty extreme in the level of attention we pay to the engine - for the excessively compuslive TDI drive they'd have a serious delima turning it off while waiting for someone for any period of time...

its not as bad to start and stop a warm car, relative to a cold car, but relative to not starting its definatly and unquestionably more damaging than leaving it running. HOW damaging is the question. And there isn't a good enough answer to satisfy the folks that get all bent out of shape seeing a diesel running that is only burning one half of a liter of fuel an hour idling.

Damaging to your baby's environment. How's that for an answer. /images/graemlins/blush.gif <shushing up now>

well i'll trump ya there too...

cold or cool engines are WAY WAY more polluting than warm engines... the grams of pollution from a warm TDI is much better than a cold one ... even a warm but not warmed up one will pollute much more...

I'm not talking about leaving it running for hours... personally 15 minutes is my comfort level... unless its extra warm or cold out and my daughter and I are sitting in the car waiting together (or i'm waiting, she's sleeping and my wife is shopping ...

(got anything else ya wanna stump me on /images/graemlins/wink.gif /images/graemlins/laugh.gif )

Well, ummmmmmmmmm....no.

/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

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weedeater said:
On a diesel, EGR is not active at idle.

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Now that is a very important thing to know....

Any doubts I've had about whether all the idling I do could be causing a buildup of deposits have been erased.

I still plan to have the EGR mod, but for other reasons not related to extended idling.

Don't know about that. On my Peugeot engine, EGR is most definitely applied at idle. Block the vacuum line and it sounds like a tractor idling... /images/graemlins/eek.gif

The EGR is programmed to shut off after some pre-defined period of idle. I can't remember how long it is... something on the order of a minute or more.

If the accelerator is blipped the EGR kicks back in and the clock is reset.

I don't usually, such as when I am going to be gone for more than a few minutes. But if I'm running in to get my mail, it takes 30 seconds and in my small town (yes, it is VERY small) in the middles of the night there is no traffic and no danger of theft. But the real reason is: have you priced a VW TDI starter motor? Do so and then let me know what you think.