www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2016 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You




Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > TDI Conversions

TDI Conversions Discussions on converting non TDIs into TDIS. More general items can be answered better in other sections. This is ideal for issues that don't have an overlap and are very special to swaping engines.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old August 11th, 2016, 20:21   #1
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default Dodge Dakota Quad 4X4 ALH

My goal is to have a cheap quad cab truck with decent fuel mileage to haul the family. So after gathering parts and still scrounging for a few more its time to start a thread where I can nail down a few loose ends. My knowledge base is from the LSX and DSM world so TDI is a all new to me

I picked up a 2001 Dakota quad cab 5speed v8 I picked up a few months ago and I already fixed all the broken dodge stuff on it. EVguy is building an adapter to connect to the NV3500.

The donor is a 2001 bug auto that still drives after a poll smack to the right rear quarter it has around 160K miles on it.

I am leaning on doing a Mtdi swap as I picked up a 300TDI pump already but I could change my mind as I have been weighing the pros and cons for a while.

Next step is yanking the donor motor out. I post pics when I can figure out why I cant.

Ok so here is the quarter million mile Dakota.



And here is the donor TDI


Last edited by Motohead1; August 19th, 2016 at 19:43. Reason: pics
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 14th, 2016, 05:59   #2
Reddok
Veteran Member
 
Reddok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Fuel Economy: Jetta: 40.8 avg, 47.1 best. Jeep: 30 avg.
Default

You will definitely enjoy the increased fuel economy. I would say retain the ALH electronics. Have you thought of what you are going to do for gauges? Easiest would be to graft in the ALH cluster. Much more difficult to make the Dodge cluster work as it is CAN as well and won't talk to the ALH ECU. I am running the Mopar ECU in mine to drive the cluster - Dakota digital converter to spoof the crank signal to it. At least it requires no mods to get the fuel gauge and speedo to work. The glow plug and check engine lights required splicing some flywires into the cluster.

I would also recommend to add sound deadening while you have it apart. Lots of it.

Also plan on bigger injectors and a tune. A stock ALH will push a 4000lb truck around ok but hills are a bit of a struggle. With injectors and a tune, I can climb hills in 6th without downshifting (keep an eye on EGTs though)
__________________
2000 Jetta 01M: Ventectomy, Snowscreen removed, Injection timing advanced, EGR dialed back.
2002 Jeep Liberty TDI Project: 2002 ALH, 1749VA, NSG-370 6-spd, PP764's on T4's, 11mm pump, PD150 intake, custom tune, Cummins lift pump, 2.8 CRD intercooler, 2.5" DP/exhaust with Magnaflow cat and Walker Quietflow muffler.
Reddok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 14th, 2016, 07:24   #3
jimbote
 
jimbote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: spiral arm, milky way (aka central NC)
Fuel Economy: golf=38-43mpg...tacoma tdi=29-33mpg
Default

i'm with Reddok... keep the electronics... the e pump has better timing control that you will not have with the M setup... on top of that you can use your smartphone or tablet to monitor engine parameters via apps and wifi obd2 port adapters ... i'm running a tdi M rover pump on my westy now and can't wait to convert it to electronic ... also been running my tacoma for over 90k miles and six years with tdi E and zero e related failures ... just a few glow plugs replaced
__________________
'You know what? This is a business.' So, now, I just keep my mouth shut and pet my chihuahuas." Mickey Rourke
jimbote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 14th, 2016, 08:04   #4
vtpsd
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Vermont
Fuel Economy: 45mpg avg
Default

Another vote for electronics. They are easy to integrate and make the engine so much more daily driver friendly IMO.
__________________
current: 03 jetta wagon (pp520, malone stg3, straight pipe), ford tractor with saab turbo, Snarling Audi 90q AHU swap (holset he211w, 32psi, race 520's)
past:11 second audi 90 20vt monster, 20vt swapped audi 90 winter beater, 10vt swapped 4kq with efi and many many other 5 cylinder audis, and a few 1.8tq's
vtpsd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 14th, 2016, 20:12   #5
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reddok View Post
You will definitely enjoy the increased fuel economy. I would say retain the ALH electronics. Have you thought of what you are going to do for gauges? Easiest would be to graft in the ALH cluster. Much more difficult to make the Dodge cluster work as it is CAN as well and won't talk to the ALH ECU. I am running the Mopar ECU in mine to drive the cluster - Dakota digital converter to spoof the crank signal to it. At least it requires no mods to get the fuel gauge and speedo to work. The glow plug and check engine lights required splicing some flywires into the cluster.

I would also recommend to add sound deadening while you have it apart. Lots of it.

Also plan on bigger injectors and a tune. A stock ALH will push a 4000lb truck around ok but hills are a bit of a struggle. With injectors and a tune, I can climb hills in 6th without downshifting (keep an eye on EGTs though)
For gauges I would leave the Dodge cluster and snag the cank sensor much like you have done I would imagine. I was unaware that they CAN bused the cluster as I just fixed the fuel sender and the speedo is a normal hall effect in the rear ring gear. cruise is a vac can with a cable so thats easy. I had planned on a waste gated garret 2052 with normal intercooler and injectors to match. With a gov mod 300tdi pump from what I have seen that would put me in the 180+hp range and just as much torque as the v8 in it now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimbote View Post
i'm with Reddok... keep the electronics... the e pump has better timing control that you will not have with the M setup... on top of that you can use your smartphone or tablet to monitor engine parameters via apps and wifi obd2 port adapters ... i'm running a tdi M rover pump on my westy now and can't wait to convert it to electronic ... also been running my tacoma for over 90k miles and six years with tdi E and zero e related failures ... just a few glow plugs replaced
Your making me rethink going Mtdi. My main concern is I hate having to rely on somebody else to flash my ECU. How much does the timing really move around? can Etdi be that much more efficient? I mean after you delet the EGR ,Maff ect... Whats the advantage of the Etdi save for the VGV turbo? I like to hear your thoughts as you have experienced both.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vtpsd View Post
Another vote for electronics. They are easy to integrate and make the engine so much more daily driver friendly IMO.
So 3 votes off the bat for Etdi. Is there a write up on striping down the stock ecu harness for bare bones operation? I have a whole running car so as long as I can get this done on the cheap and delete all the crap ton of wiring I might do the Etdi.
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 15th, 2016, 16:42   #6
Reddok
Veteran Member
 
Reddok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Fuel Economy: Jetta: 40.8 avg, 47.1 best. Jeep: 30 avg.
Default

Not only the CAN issue, but the dodge ECU will not start sending ignition events until it sees a valid cam sensor pulse in the appropriate crank pulse. I ended up grafting the cam wheel and sensor from the 3.7 on to the camshaft of the TDI to get it to work. On the easier side of things, the electronic cruise works perfectly. I just tapped the appropriate wire from the VW ECU into the rear ring gear hall-effect sensor and I get a working speed signal to the VW ECU. Had to use a push-button for 'set speed' though as the steering wheel buttons for cruise in the Jeep are of a resistor ladder design.
__________________
2000 Jetta 01M: Ventectomy, Snowscreen removed, Injection timing advanced, EGR dialed back.
2002 Jeep Liberty TDI Project: 2002 ALH, 1749VA, NSG-370 6-spd, PP764's on T4's, 11mm pump, PD150 intake, custom tune, Cummins lift pump, 2.8 CRD intercooler, 2.5" DP/exhaust with Magnaflow cat and Walker Quietflow muffler.
Reddok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 16th, 2016, 19:49   #7
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default

Reddok I just read your build thread. very nice work. Did I read that right that not only does the dodge ecu need a cam signal pulse but also a crank sensor pulse? I have been reading the dakota FSM and I was under the impression I only needed a cam pulse for 3 seconds to make the ecu come alive.

Last edited by Motohead1; August 16th, 2016 at 21:13.
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 18th, 2016, 16:32   #8
Reddok
Veteran Member
 
Reddok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Hamilton, Ontario
Fuel Economy: Jetta: 40.8 avg, 47.1 best. Jeep: 30 avg.
Default

It doesn't require a cam signal for long. Less than a second. Originally I had a pushbutton connected to the cam signal line and would just randomly tap it 4-5 times and the tach would then start working and keep working until the engine was shut off.
__________________
2000 Jetta 01M: Ventectomy, Snowscreen removed, Injection timing advanced, EGR dialed back.
2002 Jeep Liberty TDI Project: 2002 ALH, 1749VA, NSG-370 6-spd, PP764's on T4's, 11mm pump, PD150 intake, custom tune, Cummins lift pump, 2.8 CRD intercooler, 2.5" DP/exhaust with Magnaflow cat and Walker Quietflow muffler.
Reddok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 18th, 2016, 21:24   #9
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default

Ok that makes more sense. The way they wrote it in the FSM sounded like if it didnt see the signal within 3 seconds of starting it wouldn't work.


So after much deliberation Im 99% sure I am going to go Etdi. Just wish there was a tuning interface like HPtuners or ECMlink.
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 20th, 2016, 11:07   #10
xjjeeper
Newbie
 
xjjeeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Chilliwack BC
Default

Good luck with the build! I'm at the same place you are now with my xj swap. Just stripping the harness out of my donor car then removing the alh. You already have the 11mm injection pump so that is definitely a bonus for power making!
__________________
1999.5 alh soon to be installed in a 1999 jeep xj
xjjeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 20th, 2016, 18:52   #11
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default

Well made some progress today. Fired it up with lines run to a jug. Took about 5 tries to get the air out of the line. Something was blocked up in the stock feed line. Got it up in the air and started ripping it apart and draining fluids.


Anyone know if I can just unbolt the axle flanges from the trans to pull it all out or will I need to yank the axles?
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2016, 13:09   #12
xjjeeper
Newbie
 
xjjeeper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Chilliwack BC
Default

I'm pretty sure you can just un bolt the cv s from the transmission and pull the engine and tranny straight out the front. At least that's how I'm going to attempt it
__________________
1999.5 alh soon to be installed in a 1999 jeep xj
xjjeeper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 23rd, 2016, 09:36   #13
greengeeker
 
greengeeker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cambridge, MN
Fuel Economy: 42.2/50.0/58.1
Default

unbolt the axles at the transmission and it will come right out the front.

Scene looks familiar

__________________
- Nick -
02 Jetta TDI 308k (42.2/50.3/59.4 MPG) // 01 Eurovan 24V (18 MPG) // 00 TDI Ranger (39MPG)
How to Post Pics - How to Search
TDIclub trusted mechanic in Minnesota - PM me
greengeeker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 26th, 2016, 20:35   #14
Motohead1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: charlotte
Default

Well its out. Tomorrow I hope to get the harness, gas pedal, brake switches and anything else I might need removed.


Im still amazed at these clogged intakes from the EGR.
Motohead1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old August 31st, 2016, 22:23   #15
Halfbrit
Newbie
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: OR
Default Me too!

I'll be starting my 2002 quad cab dakota Automatic ALH swap this fall. I just bought my third ALH today. First Jetta was too nice to dismantle so my son and I have been driving it to long distance bids. Then I bought just an ALH engine to rebuild. Now I found an ALH Jetta basket case with an ALH rebuild kit in the trunk. So I'm flush with TDIs. I just need the fall/winter to slow down so I'll have time. I will definitely be following your build.
Halfbrit is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2000 dodge dakota quad cab 4x4 with tdi jetmoto3 Private TDI Items for Sale/Wanted 6 October 26th, 2015 12:36
FS: Dodge Dakota 2.5L Bellhousing Kriesel Private TDI Items for Sale/Wanted 1 April 12th, 2010 11:05
WTT: My 99 Dodge Dakota for a TDI. Smola67 TDI Cars for Sale/Wanted 1 June 13th, 2007 03:25
1999 Dodge Ram 3500 Quad Cab SLT, Cummins Diesel Dieselworld TDI Cars for Sale/Wanted 2 March 23rd, 2005 20:31
1998 Dodge Ram 2500 24v Cummins Turbo Diesel Quad Dieselworld TDI Cars for Sale/Wanted 10 March 7th, 2005 11:22


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 17:38.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2017
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
1996 - 2017, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.19449 seconds with 10 queries
[Output: 132.76 Kb. compressed to 111.37 Kb. by saving 21.40 Kb. (16.12%)]