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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW MKIII-A3/B4 TDIs

VW MKIII-A3/B4 TDIs This is a discussion about MKIII-A3/MkIII Jetta/Golf (<99.5) and B4 Passats (96,97) TDI's. Non TDI related postings will be moved or removed.

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Old February 23rd, 2013, 18:44   #1
MaxwellDreaver
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Default Nice Car's response to peterdaniels accusations

To all TDIClub members interested -


This is from Forrest Barlow, owner of Nice Cars in Bellingham, Washington. This is a report on how my dealership was the victim of fraud in the purchase of a 1996 White B4S-TDI we bought in Florida. Because we specialize in B4-TDIs we are always on the look for low miles southern cars. On March 2011 I saw a White 1996 Passat TDI Sedan advertised on Craigslist with 51k miles in Hialeah, Florida. I actually found it on a search engine that specializes in TDIs for sale throughout the US. The listings are 24 hours old so we figured it might be gone since a car with such low miles would be in demand. I called the Florida Company that had it for sale and asked a bunch of questions including the serial number. We looked up the serial number on AutoCheck and saw that there were no odometer reports higher that what was reported to be on the car at the time it was being offered for sale there in Florida.


Enacting due diligence we conducted an NCIC search and found it was not stolen and was registered in Florida. The Florida Department of Motor Vehicles confirmed that it had a current Florida title in the name of the company that had it for sale. That title showed no liens, no rebuilt or salvage status and no odometer problems, in essence a "clean" title. I then located a bodyshop in the Florida neighborhood where the car was for sale. I hired a local bodyman for $100 to go look at the car to get his professional opinion if this looked like a car that had those miles and asked him to check the VIN. His report to us was that it did have the correct VIN and that he believed it looked like a car that had those miles and that he believed that it had the original white paint. This opinion was from the owner of a body shop. I then bought the car, paid several thousand dollars as I believed my research showed it was all legit. I sent a cashier's check to the owner and arranged shipping. I paid almost $1000 to get the car shipped here from Florida. When it got here I was pleased to see that it was in the super clean condition described by the previous owner and the bodyman I hired to check it out.


We transferred the clean Florida title to a Washington title and our Washington title arrived with no brands, a clean title. Since white is my favorite car color and because it was such a clean original car I began driving it as my personal car. I also upgraded it with numerous mechanical and suspension parts, added some GLX driving lights and numerous other improvements. I personally drove this car around for over a year until it registered 66K miles. I finally decided to sell it as I had found another low mile B4-TDI for my personal driver.


The first person who looked at the white Passat Sedan was allowed to examine the car as thoroughly as he wished which included allowing him to dismantle the cowling fairing to get access to a body serial number. That serial number was different that the number on the dash and on the title we received with the car.


When we became aware of the number discrepancy we immediately took the car off the market, canceled the advertisements and put the car in storage. The same day we determined the car had different serial numbers we contacted the Washington Department of Motor Vehicles, Dealer Services division. We filed a report and asked for a DMV inspector to come and inspect the car. I then filed a complaint with the Washington Attorney General's Office. I contacted the company in Florida we bought the car from and was told they bought it from an auto auction. I called the auction company and they confirmed the car had the same serial number on it at the time it was sold to the company we bought it from. We asked how they check serial numbers and were told they check the dash number only. We asked who consigned the car and were told they were going to turn our request over to their Manager. We then filed a complaint with the Florida Department of Motor Vehicles, the Florida Attorney General's office, the Florida State Police and the Florida Better business Bureau. We sent an email to the Florida Auction company confirming our conversation and asked for information about the consignor who brought the car to the auction and we told them we filed a complaint with all the numerous Florida legal authorities.


Since the car had the same dash serial # when it was sold by the company in Florida and because it had the same serial dash serial number when sold by the auction company and the same number when it was transported from Florida to Washington, the culprit here is somebody either who brought it to the auction or somebody who had the car prior to the the person who consigned the car to the auction.
We have confidence that whoever that is will be found by the State Police and/or the Florida Department of Motor Vehicles. I am anxiously awaiting their report as I am out several thousand dollars in the purchase, transportation and thousands dollars of improvements.


The serial number discrepancy was first discovered by a potential buyer who came here from California who is known on the TDI forum as Peterdaniel. We're not sure of his real name as he represented himself to us as Peter Mainwald. He was allowed to roam around for 3 hours most of that time unassisted and look at several of our B4-TDIs. He drove and examined my white Passat in great detail including the removal of the cowl fairing to get at the firewall serial number. Instead of telling us the number was different he quickly went to the TDI forum and reported what an elaborate "scam and fraud" we were conducting. I do appreciate that Peter said my "white Sedan was a beauty, the interior and dash was spotless, and not a rattle" Peter said he was "looking like mad to see if the car has been repainted". Everybody that has looked at this car has confirmed it is a factory white car including Peter Daniel/Mainwald. Peter has made a lot of personal acquisitions against Bob here, called him a "broken clock" (whatever that means), called him a "SOB", "comical liar", etc. The reality is that Bob here does not own this white car and was showing it because I was gone that day. I bought the car, I conducted the pre-purchase research, I paid for that bodyman to go look at it, I paid for the shipping, I personally did all he upgrades and I drove it about 15K miles since I bought it. Peter has taken great delight in accusing me of altering this car when in fact I bought this car with these numbers which can be confirmed through the Florida title, the company who sold it to me, the auction that sold it to the guy I got it from and the transport company that brought it here. Fortunately for me there is a definite paper trail with a consistent serial number through past owners including me. We certainly did not have anything to hide as we let Peter (or whoever he is) dig around in the car to his heart's content.


You will note that I have not disclosed the name of the owner or the name of the company in Florida I bought the car from as only the authorities investigation will prove if he is the guilty party. I don't wish to degrade his reputation if its proven he was not involved in this alteration. If its proven that he is in fact the one responsible I will, absolutely WILL report his name and the name of his company to this forum. To state his identity now based on suspension would be inappropriate and subject me to civil liability, something Peter apparently cares little about or is ignorant of. We will wait and give the guy we bought it from the benefit of doubt until its proven who is at fault. The self-appointed TDI Club detective has set himself up as judge and jury and has commended me for a felonious crime based on suspension and his urgent need for approval from other Club member even inviting them to email him as he states he is up up at night waiting for club member to email him


Most car dealers have some vehicles in their possession that are not currently for sale. This would be cars that need repair, cars that are sold, customer's repair jobs, trade-ins etc. The Washington Dept of Motor Vehicles has strict requirements how and where each Dealer store these cars. They need to be segregated somehow away from the cars that are for sale or have notations on the car that it is not for sale. The cars that I have that are not for sale are behind a 7' wood fence and they have a sign on them stating that they are not for sale. It is in fact illegal for us to take a retail customer into such a storage area. Peter (or whoever he is) asked to be able to go in that area. He was told there was nothing in there for sale. He made comments to our office manager how "strange" it was that was that we would have cars here that "were not for sale". It’s not strange its normal. Peter said there was a "blue TDI Sedan there with a missing tan interior" I assume by this he believes I replaced the interior in the white Sedan. The white sedan has the same interior it had when it arrived and NO I do not have a blue sedan here that Peter is telling you I got in North Carolina and switched numbers on. We do not have a closed shop here. Any visitors are able to take a tour through our shop and see the high quality work we do. I am in fact proud and anxious to show off what we do. Peter has attempted to poke ridicule at us for our belief that white B4-TDIs are a popular color. That is based on the requests we get for white B4s, especially in the south where we are told they are cooler. We have in fact now re-painted 8 or 9 B4V-TDIs white because the white B4Vs are rare. We have a black B4V here now going to Texas that is being repainted white.


There has also been comments made that we have totaled cars for sale and are hiding that. It’s legal for anybody to sell a "branded title" car, that is one that is salvage, rebuilt, flood damage, etc. IF they disclose that info to the seller. That disclosure is not necessary for us because we have no - I repeat NO, B4-TDIs for sale with any branded titles. Any and all of you TDI club members are invited to come here and look over our cars, examine the serial numbers and the titles. You can look at how we upgrade these unique TDIs. We'll show you original OEM B4-TDI parts that regular VW dealers don't have and can't get.


I will say that that no customer has ever sued Nice Cars and no governmental entity ever imposed any sanctions, fines or penalties against Nice Cars on behalf of any customer on any of the thousands of cars we have sold over the years.



Thanks,

Forrest Barlow

NICECARS
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 19:23   #2
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That's a whole lot of smoke.

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Old February 23rd, 2013, 19:40   #3
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*subscribed* <get's a bowl of popcorn ready for some real reality TV>

The truth is usually in the middle.... We'll see..
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 19:42   #4
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ibtl, and I'm getting some popcorn too...
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 19:46   #5
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 21:42   #6
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Mr Barlow, I am the person that was on the other end of the phone while Peter was at your shop. I have a few questions and a few statements.


First, I would like to commend you for taking the car in question off the market and the appropriate steps to find the truth about it. Based on numerous stories about cars previously sold from Nice Cars, and you are welcome to do some research and find out for yourself the experiences people have had, an issue of this magnitude seemed plausible. Many of us have no preconceived notions of your business, but when repeated stories have similar themes, a general image takes shape. If you are as interested in improving your reputation as your post indicates, perhaps you should contact previous owners and address their concerns, they are numerous. Based on the aforementioned accounts, it was assumed the error would be covered up and not addressed, as has happened in the past with other incidences. That assessment was obviously in error in this case, but you have to admit it was plausible. Peter and I discussed what to do with this information at length, and the consensus was not to play detective, but to turn over the information to the Washington Department of Motor Vehicles: that Nice Cars was in possession of a vehicle for sale with two vehicle identification numbers (VIN’s). When, how, and to what degree they proceeded was up to them, our responsibility is to simply make them aware of it and let them perform any investigation. It was discussed that perhaps you obtained the vehicle unknowingly, but when I saw your extensive restoration operation, I had my doubts.


Second, Peter did his homework prior to going there. He ran the same Autocheck you did, but also purchased a CarFax, which shows different information from Autocheck. The VIN given checked out when he ran it. When he looked the car over, he called me no less than three times to marvel at how clean it was. He spent HIS considerable money and HIS time going there to look at the cars because he truly believed you had a 66,000 mile B4 for sale, and he was prepared to pay your asking price for it, which I am sure was not cheap. Despite all the stories, he was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt and this is evidenced by the backlash board members gave him when he mentioned he was going there to possibly purchase one. He explained that ‘even a blind squirrel finds a nut once and awhile’, which means it’s possible you really did have a car of that caliber and he needed to see for himself. So he did not go there trying to ‘discover’ anything fraudulent. We discussed his trip to Nice Cars on the phone, and my recommendation was to simply verify. If the verification checked out, then he was willing to purchase right then and there. I was afraid he wouldn’t listen to me and not check the car over thoroughly, but after some coaxing, he did his best.


My name is not Abacus, that is my screen name. My real name is Mark Courtenay. Peterdaniel obviously is his screen name, and Peter Mainwald is his real name, at least that’s the one that shows up not only on my caller-id, but his return e-mail, so I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. Along the same lines, your screen name is MaxwellDreaver, yet you say your name is Forrest Barlow. I’m sure you can see the pattern now, so that should end your patronizing part about his authenticity.


Peter said he was given the freedom to go anywhere and look at anything regarding your operation, from Bob. When he started verifying if the car was indeed authentic, this privilege was revoked, which raised suspicions.


Third, if your company is so good at rebuilding, restoring, and upgrading the B4 platform, how is it possible someone who has never owned a B4 can, within a few hours while it’s raining, the car not on a lift, and without even the simplest tools like a screwdriver, determine the car you have owned, upgraded, and personally driven for over a year is not what it appears. You claim to be experts in that you have access to “original OEM B4-TDI parts that regular VW dealers don't have and can't get” and obviously work on them constantly. I saw pictures of the cars in various states of restoration and am very impressed, and I say that with all honesty. I would love to have those parts you probably throw away. Not only was Peter able to determine two areas of the car were repainted, but other telltale signs it was not original, without even going through several checks I recommended. According to our conversation, he was given free rein to inspect the car as he saw fit, once again, from Bob. To find the VIN discrepancy, he did not ‘remove the cowl fairing’ to look at the VIN, it can be seen with simply partly peeling back the weather stripping, which does not even need to come off. I was with him on the phone at the time and directed him to do this, so I know this firsthand this is what he did. But what you do not know is why I told him to do this. He did it because he mentioned the absence of the door sticker with the build date on it. This sticker is required by most states and raised MY suspicion, so I then directed him to look in the trunk for the sticker there, and this was also absent. That was when I told him to look under the hood for the one engraved in the body. That this was completely missed by everyone prior strains credulity. Another simple analysis, one he did not perform even though I mentioned it, was to check for the red security paint covering the screws holding the odometer in place. This would require the removal of only 3 phillips head screws, but he did not feel comfortable doing this, so he declined. I’m willing to bet that paint is missing on those screws, indicating the cluster may not be original.


You mentioned having a body shop in Florida go over the car. Apparently they also missed the repainted front quarter panel. It was glaringly obvious to me 3,300 miles away in the cellphone picture he e-mailed me. The panel is not only slightly askew, but the original sealant was broken where it mates to the body, indicating the panel was at one time separated from the body. A reputable repair facility would have performed the repair properly reusing the body sealant. This also would have been completely visible from the underside, like when the suspension is replaced, because the two body bolts are covered by the sealant when original. To find them not would have been cause for looking closer since these cars are almost never found with mileage that low. THAT alone should cause anyone to verify to determine the truth.


So that is the history of the incident as it happened and why it happened. I am sure most of us here are very curious as to your findings in this matter of how the two VIN’s came to be on the same car, and the final dispensation. But the fact remains that had Nice Cars not had the reputation it earned over the years through previous sales, their integrity would never have been questioned in the first place. Even Bob’s name has reached this coast (Atlantic), which means his reputation precedes him. What that reputation consists of is entirely of his own making.
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Last edited by Abacus; February 23rd, 2013 at 21:45.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 21:50   #7
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Forrest, You never even bothered to call me with the information you found out. You yourself were too busy making me out to be the bad guy.

Frankly its ME you should be apologizing to. I spent 500 dollars and a day of my time to come and see your place because I could not believe all the bad things that were said about your company. I even told Bob I would defend him to the death if what I saw went against all that has been said.

You had this car for how long? 1.5 years? The car fax shows you had this car since August of 2012.
Why was I looking like mad to see if it had been repainted? Because the supposed VIN of the car showed that in 2007 it was noted as Blue.
No odometer problems? Of course not. After a certain time most states make mileage exempt from reporting.

I did not "dismantle" anything. I simply lifted a cover to view a VIN. I was extremely saddened and very surprised that the VIN did not match. But then again, the VIN sticker in both places ( door a pillar and the trunk) was missing. These stickers rarely go missing. You should know this given your expertise in this field. I did, how come you didn't?

You say that the cars you don't have for sale are segmented away. Bob said that all of the wagons I was interested in weren't for sale, Yet they were in the same area that all of the other cars were. Right in the front.

I've called a million times. How come I have never spoken to you?

Your white car drove beautifully. I was very impressed and said so. You managed to get that part correct.
How come I was able to see three body panels that were repainted, ill fitting interior parts, missing VERY obvious VIN tags and finally non matching VIN tags AND YOU, THE EXPERT WHO HAVE RESTORED OVER 150 OF THESE..... didn't?

I never accused you of actually changing VIN's. Many people encouraged me to turn you in to the police, the DA etc.. but I didn't. I could have.

I never said there was any blue TDi with a missing tan interior. I merely said that I wouldn't be surprised if there was one.

I never made ridicule of your belief that white TDis are popular. I myself want one. Thats why I spent the 500 dollars to come and see your place. I didnt have to. I didn't do it for fun.. I could have just believed what countless others have complained about your business.

I HAD CASH IN HAND and was ready to buy. But for some reason, nothing I saw ( that Bob said was actually for sale) showed me what you can really do and promise for your $16K asking price( wagon) or $12K for the sedans.

I had spoken with several people who have bought cars from you over the years. Only one said you sold them a very good vehicle and that you delivered on what you promised. Others have received vehicles that were salvaged and not told about it. These are people from all over the United States. Surely they cant all be against you in some sort of conspiracy. IF YOU TRULY DO SUCH OUTSTANDING WORK IN "RESTORING" THESE FINE CARS, THEN THE ISSUES, COMPLAINTS, STORIES AND ANGER DIRECTED AT YOU SHOULD BE THE EXCEPTION.... instead it would seem, its the rule.

I spoke with the previous owner of the 97 white wagon that you have in your shop. Bob says it needed a front fender and a dent under the taillight. The report I got was that the windshield was broken, the hood and both front fenders as well as the grill, headlights were all smashed. The airbags were also deployed. Bob stated to me that the title was clean and that the airbags never deployed. Of course it was clean, it was never reported to the insurance company by Mr. Alicki. ( name sound familiar??) so it was sold to you with a clean title for about $1700.00 ( pretty cheap I would say for a 97 with such "light damage" eh?) You register it in Washington, fix everything and Voila! A clean titled rare 1997 White wagon., Creme de la Creme of the crop. I asked Mr Alicki about the white wagon he had for sale about three months ago and he told me it was in a crash and all the damage it had. I asked him why, if he was in the Tdi business of reselling these fine cars, he wouldn't just fix it being that its such a rare car. He said it was way too much damage.
He had no idea I knew that the car was now at Nice Cars.

I even stated that I wanted to believe what Bob and your company represents. But come on... if it was all legitimate, it should have been easy to prove and show correct? I should have gone up there and seen gorgeous B4's that you were selling with all the goodies you say you do. But instead I get a car with mixed up VIN, changed out interior and three mis matched painted panels. Seriously??

I stand by what I saw.. But I also hope that this has all been a terrible misunderstanding and you truly are in the clear. I shudder to think what would have happened if I did buy that white car. California would have never allowed me to register the car and it might have even been impounded.

I am also willing to buy a B4V from you as long as what you state you have done, you have in fact... done. With a price tag of 16K there should be NO excuses, no issues, no problems. With all of your skills and resources, you should be the premier place to go and buy a B4 from. It truly breaks my heart that it seems so hard to trust you.

And Forrest, Im still waiting for a call from you...
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:26   #8
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Does anyone check VINs anymore, (or have industry professionals chucked the term "VIN" for the more automobile-specific "serial number") ? This soap opera actually inspired me to rise from my chair, get a flashlight, and look for the VIN on my own B4. Within 2 minutes, I found a sticker on the B pillar, a metal tag riveted to the dash (the hardest one to find -- i had to wipe fog off the windshield), and after popping the hood, found a 3rd one visible through a clear plastic window near the ECU. No tools were required to perform this check. And bytheway, I did the same search when I bought the car, even though "several thousand dollars" were not at stake, and I had no reason to doubt the seller's honesty or niceness.

I can't keep track of how many dealers and auctioneers passed this hot potato around, with none of them catching the VIN mismatch. But anyone who thinks "the police" are going to open an investigation and burn one powdered donut hole's calories to catch the criminal mastermind behind this scam, is smoking something recently decriminalized in his State.


I was also surprised to see this story played out this far, as I thought Peter had earlier posted his decision to -not- travel to Bellingham, or even try to find a B4.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:39   #9
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I just looked at an 06 Jetta package 2 in Fort Worth this week that had 140K on the odometer and 170K recorded in the ECU (through a VCDS scan check). Story was full of lies and holes. Yeah, they are out in force these days.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:45   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbodieseldyke View Post
Does anyone check VINs anymore, (or have industry professionals chucked the term "VIN" for the more automobile-specific "serial number") ? This soap opera actually inspired me to rise from my chair, get a flashlight, and look for the VIN on my own B4. Within 2 minutes, I found a sticker on the B pillar, a metal tag riveted to the dash (the hardest one to find -- i had to wipe fog off the windshield), and after popping the hood, found a 3rd one visible through a clear plastic window near the ECU. No tools were required to perform this check. And bytheway, I did the same search when I bought the car, even though "several thousand dollars" were not at stake, and I had no reason to doubt the seller's honesty or niceness.

I can't keep track of how many dealers and auctioneers passed this hot potato around, with none of them catching the VIN mismatch. But anyone who thinks "the police" are going to open an investigation and burn one powdered donut hole's calories to catch the criminal mastermind behind this scam, is smoking something recently decriminalized in his State.


I was also surprised to see this story played out this far, as I thought Peter had earlier posted his decision to -not- travel to Bellingham, or even try to find a B4.
I had changed my mind due to some circumstances one of which my son being sick with the flu. But I couldn't just not go and see what this place was all about. I truly wanted it to end happily.. I still do want a B4 and am willing to even pay Nice cars prices but it has to be worthy of that price. Checking VIN's is one of the first lessons in buying a car 101.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:51   #11
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Check out the last two owners

This is the VIN that was given to me before I went up to Bellingham

This is also the same VIN I saw on the dash plate


VIN: WVWGG83A3TE072430

Follow CARFAX:


For Personal Use Only

Vehicle Information:
1996 VOLKSWAGEN PASSAT TDI
VIN: WVWGG83A3TE072430
SEDAN 4 DR
1.9L L4 FI
FRONT WHEEL DRIVE
Standard Equipment | Safety Options
Search for other 1996 VOLKSWAGEN PASSAT vehicles in Campbell, CA


Branded Title: Not Actual Mileage

No accident / damage reported to CARFAX

5Previous owners

3Service records available

Types of owners: Personal, Lease

$2,370 Below retail book value

This CARFAX Vehicle History Report is based only on information supplied to CARFAX and available as of 2/24/13 at 1:47:56 AM (EST). Other information about this vehicle, including problems, may not have been reported to CARFAX. Use this report as one important tool, along with a vehicle inspection and test drive, to make a better decision about your next used car.
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Ownership History
The number of owners is estimated Owners 1-3 Owner 4 Owner 5

Year purchased 1996 2007 2012
Type of owner Personal Personal Lease
Estimated length of ownership 11 yrs. 6 mo. 4 yrs. 10 mo. 6 months
Owned in the following states/provinces Florida, New York Florida Washington
Estimated miles driven per year See Details --- ---
Last reported odometer reading 49,804 --- ---
Title History
CARFAX guarantees the information in this section Owners 1-3 Owner 4 Owner 5

Salvage | Junk | Rebuilt | Fire | Flood | Hail | Lemon No Problem No Problem No Problem
Not Actual Mileage | Exceeds Mechanical Limits Alert!
Problem Found No Additional Problems No Additional Problems
Alert! Severe problems were reported by a state Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV). This vehicle does not qualify for the CARFAX Buyback Guarantee.
Additional History
Not all accidents / issues are reported to CARFAX Owners 1-3 Owner 4 Owner 5

Total Loss
No total loss reported to CARFAX.

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported
Structural Damage
No structural damage reported to CARFAX.

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported
Airbag Deployment
No airbag deployment reported to CARFAX.

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported
Odometer Check
DMV title problems reported.

Odometer Problem
No New Issues Indicated
No New Issues Indicated
Accident / Damage
No accidents or damage reported to CARFAX.

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported

No Issues Reported
Manufacturer Recall
Check with an authorized Volkswagen dealer for any open recalls.
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Dealer
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Dealer
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Dealer
Basic Warranty
Original warranty estimated to have expired. Interested in an extended warranty?
Warranty
Expired
Warranty
Expired
Warranty
Expired
Tell us what you know about this vehicle
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Glossary
Detailed History


Owner 1
Purchased: 1996
Type: Personal
Where: Florida
Est. miles/year: 918/yr
Est. length owned: 2/15/96 - 2/23/00
(4 years)


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
Not Reported NICB Vehicle manufactured
and shipped to original dealer
02/15/1996 Florida
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Port Charlotte, FL Registered as
personal vehicle
02/20/1996 116 Florida
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Port Charlotte, FL Odometer reading reported
03/15/1996 Florida
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Port Charlotte, FL
Title #70194995 Title issued or updated
First owner reported
Loan or lien reported
02/23/2000 3,696 Auto Auction
Midwest Region Listed as a dealer vehicle
Sold at auction
02/28/2000 3,699 Service Facility Pre-delivery inspection completed
Oil and filter changed
Fluids checked
Tire condition and pressure checked
Two wheel alignment performed
Front brake pads replaced
03/14/2000 Dealer Inventory
Louisville, KY Vehicle offered for sale
05/08/2000 3,700 Service Facility Fuel system checked
Engine/powertrain computer/module checked
Engine checked
State safety inspection completed
05/30/2000 3,765 Dealer Inventory
Louisville, KY Vehicle offered for sale


Owner 2
Purchased: 2001
Type: Personal
Where: New York
Est. length owned: 6/30/01 - 3/23/05
(3 yrs. 8 mo.)


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
06/30/2001 4,957 New York
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Marcellus, NY New owner reported
NOT ACTUAL MILEAGE TITLE ISSUED
Loan or lien reported
CARFAX Advisor™
A NAM title is issued when the owner discloses to a DMV mileage fraud, a broken odometer or that the actual mileage of this vehicle is unknown.

Mileage reported after this reading is potentially unreliable.
02/06/2003 Romano Ford VW
Fayetteville, NY
315-637-4491
romanocars.com Vehicle serviced
08/01/2003 30,223 New York
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Cicero, NY NOT ACTUAL MILEAGE TITLE ISSUED
Registered as
personal vehicle
Passed safety inspection
03/23/2005 49,804 New York
Inspection Station Emissions inspection performed
Dealer had vehicle inspected to
prepare it for sale
Passed safety inspection
View what was inspected


Owner 3
Purchased: 2005
Type: Personal
Where: New York
Est. length owned: 3/23/05 - 9/12/07
(2 yrs. 5 mo.)


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
03/23/2005 New York
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Utica, NY New owner reported
NOT ACTUAL MILEAGE TITLE ISSUED
Registered as
personal vehicle
Passed safety inspection


Owner 4
Purchased: 2007
Type: Personal
Where: Florida
Est. length owned: 9/12/07 - 8/9/12
(4 yrs. 10 mo.)


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
09/12/2007 Florida
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Hialeah, FL
Title #0070194995 Title issued or updated
New owner reported
Exempt from odometer reporting
Vehicle color noted as Blue


Owner 5
Purchased: 2012
Type: Lease
Where: Washington
Est. length owned: 8/9/12 - present
(6 months)


Date: Mileage: Source: Comments:
08/09/2012 Washington
Motor Vehicle Dept.
Bellingham, WA Title issued or updated
New owner reported
Exempt from odometer reporting
Registered as lease vehicle
Vehicle color noted as White
Print this CARFAX Report and take it to your pre-purchase inspection

Tell us what you know about this vehicle

Last edited by peterdaniel; February 23rd, 2013 at 22:53.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:58   #12
peterdaniel
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Location: Campbell, CA
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Now heres Autochecks version of the same VIN



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AutoCheck Vehicle History Report
1996 Volkswagen Passat
Report Run Date: 2013-02-24 01:56:25.925 EST
Report Summary


Class: Mid Range Car - Premium
Engine: 1.9L I4 DI / MPI
Country of Assembly: Germany
Vehicle Age: 17 year(s)
Calculated Owners: 6
VIN: WVWGG83A3TE072430
Year : 1996
Make : Volkswagen
Model: Passat
Style/Body: Sedan 4D
This Vehicle's AutoCheck Score




The AutoCheck Score is a summary of your vehicle's history. It lets you compare similar vehicles with ease.
About the AutoCheck Score
This vehicle does not qualify for Buyback Protection


Unfortunately, this vehicle does not qualify for our Buyback Protection program.
About Buyback Protection

AccidentCheck
Reported accidents: 0

Title and ProblemCheck
Major title or other problem(s) reported

OdometerCheck
Your vehicle checks out!
Last Reported Odometer: 49,804

Vehicle Use and EventCheck
Specific vehicle use(s) or events reported
View Full History

AccidentCheck
Not all accidents / issues are reported to AutoCheck

Your vehicle checks out! There have been no accidents reported to AutoCheck for this 1996 Volkswagen Passat (WVWGG83A3TE072430). AutoCheck receives its accident data from government sources and independent agencies, and based on the information available to us, we have found that no accidents have been reported on this vehicle. Not all accidents or damage events are reported to AutoCheck.


Title and ProblemCheck
Problem Reported! AutoCheck's database for this 1996 Volkswagen Passat (WVWGG83A3TE072430) shows a negative title(s) or other problems. When reported to AutoCheck, these events can indicate serious past damage or other significant problems, and disqualifies the vehicle for AutoCheck Buyback Protection. Check the Vehicle Use and EventCheck for reported accidents.

1 Problem(s) Reported: 15 Title/Problem areas checked:
No abandoned title record
No damaged title or major damage incident record
No fire damaged title record
No grey market title record
No hail damage title record
No insurance loss title or probable total loss record
No junk or scrapped title record
No manufacturer buyback/lemon title record
Odometer problem title record(s)
No rebuilt/rebuildable title record
No salvage title or salvage auction record
No water damaged title record
No NHTSA crash test record
No frame/unibody damage record
No recycling facility record

OdometerCheck
Your vehicle checks out! AutoCheck examined the reported odometer readings reported to AutoCheck for this 1996 Volkswagen Passat (WVWGG83A3TE072430) and no indication of an odometer rollback or tampering was found. AutoCheck uses business rules to determine if reported odometer readings are significantly less than previously reported values. Not all reported odometer readings are used. Title and auction events also report odometer tampering or breakage.

0 Problem(s) Reported: Mileage Date Reported
116 03/12/1996
3,696 02/23/2000
4,265 10/20/2000
4,957 06/30/2001
30,223 09/05/2003
49,363 02/09/2005
49,804 03/23/2005
49,804 04/20/2005

Vehicle Use and EventCheck
Information Reported! AutoCheck shows additional vehicle uses or events reported to AutoCheck for this 1996 Volkswagen Passat (WVWGG83A3TE072430). This includes reported vehicle uses such as rental or lease, and events such as whether the vehicle has been reported to have had a loan/lien or duplicate title issued. Other events show if the vehicle has a reported accident and how many calculated accidents or if it has been reported stolen or repossessed. It is recommended to have pre-owned vehicles inspected by a third party prior to purchase.

0 Event(s) Reported: 6 Vehicle uses checked:
No fleet, rental and/or lease use record
No taxi use record
No police use record
No government use record
No livery use record
No driver education record
2 Event(s) Reported: 9 Vehicle events checked:
No accident record reported through accident data sources
No corrected title record
No duplicate title record
Emission/safety inspection record(s)
Loan/Lien record(s)
No fire damage incident record
No repossessed record
No theft record
No storm area registration/title record
Full History
Below are the historical events for this vehicle listed in chronological order. Any discrepancies will be in bold text.

Report Run Date: 2013-02-24 01:56:25.925 EST

Vehicle: 1996 Volkswagen Passat (WVWGG83A3TE072430)

Event Date Event Location Odometer Reading Data Source Event Detail
02/20/1996

Independent Source VEHICLE MANUFACTURED AND SHIPPED TO DEALER
03/12/1996 PORT CHARLOTTE, FL
116
Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE (Title #:70194995) (Lien Reported)
03/12/1996 PORT CHARLOTTE, FL

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
08/02/1996 PORT CHARLOTTE, FL

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
08/12/1997 PORT CHARLOTTE, FL

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
08/12/1998 PORT CHARLOTTE, FL

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
02/23/2000 MIDWEST REGION
3,696
Auto Auction REPORTED AT AUTO AUCTION
03/14/2000 LOUISVILLE, KY

Independent Source VEHICLE IN DEALER INVENTORY
10/20/2000 EASTERN REGION
4,265
Auto Auction REPORTED AT AUTO AUCTION
05/23/2001 MARCELLUS, NY

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
06/30/2001 NY
4,957
Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE (Lien Reported)
NOT ACTUAL MILES
08/01/2003 CICERO, NY

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
09/05/2003 NY
30,223
Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE
NOT ACTUAL MILES
02/09/2005 NY
49,363
Auto Auction REPORTED AT AUTO AUCTION
03/23/2005 UTICA, NY

Motor Vehicle Dept. REGISTRATION EVENT/RENEWAL
03/23/2005 NY
49,804
State Agency EMISSION INSPECTION
PASSED SAFETY INSPECTION
04/20/2005 NY
49,804
Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE
NOT ACTUAL MILES
09/12/2007 HIALEAH, FL

Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE (Title #:0070194995)
EXCLUDED/EXEMPT
08/09/2012 BELLINGHAM, WA

Motor Vehicle Dept. TITLE
EXCLUDED/EXEMPT
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 22:59   #13
TDIDaveNH
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: North Conway, NH
TDI(s): 1997 Passat
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Peterdaniel,

Keep in mind if you want to give NiceCars another chance and from the tail end of your last post it sadly sounds like that is the case...do bear witness-NiceCars has had their timing belt license revoked:

Quote:
Originally Posted by BleachedBora View Post
Sold a head yesterday to an 80-year old guy that was fixing a B4 that had a TB go and trash the head 10 minutes after buying from Nice Cars. I seem to remember he said it was about $17k. They were told that since it was driven off the lot they owned it, so tough luck.

I was pretty flabbergasted over the whole thing...
-BB
I would have sued them.....after I got released from jail, but that is getting off the subject.

It's important to not be blinded by what it is your are seeking. A pristine white B4V that NiceCars has not gotten their grubby little hands on will eventually pop up, just not in the 1-2 week window you'd like it to arrive in.
I know how it goes...you're a bit antsy with the LB9A fever and cash is burning a hole in your pocket. Breathe in deeply through the nose, hold., and out through the mouth.

If you are prepared to spend close to 12K for a sedan or 16K for a wagon
to be quite honest with you, it would be wiser to commission a build by someone from here who has proven Whitbreadian skill that can make it happen.

Nothing wrong with a dream build even if it's a Concours d'Elegance restoration

Besides, original paint is a liability on a B4- you're better off upgrading the clear coat and while you're at it...
__________________
Per cogo, non per mico (By compression, not by spark)
305K miles; plus suspension and some other goodies.

Last edited by TDIDaveNH; February 23rd, 2013 at 23:04.
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 23:00   #14
turbodieseldyke
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TDI(s): 98 jetta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterdaniel View Post
I had changed my mind due to some circumstances one of which my son being sick with the flu.
Wait, you're a nurse, and your instinct is to fly out of state when your son gets sick? (just busting your chops)
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Old February 23rd, 2013, 23:05   #15
peterdaniel
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Campbell, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbodieseldyke View Post
Wait, you're a nurse, and your instinct is to fly out of state when your son gets sick? (just busting your chops)
HAHAH Smart ass! lol.. No, I actually cancelled my flight that week and rescheduled it two weeks later. I have a heart!!
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