Wobbly driveshaft, steering wheel vibration (vid included) 2010 JSW - Help!

Hi everyone!
I've been chasing this problem for about 2 months now and I'm just really frustrated.
I bought a 2010 JSW TDI with DSG with 40,000 miles on it. As of this post it has about 46,000 miles.
Problem:

• I didn't notice the problem on the test drive or for a few weeks after I bought the car.
• vibration that can be felt through the steering wheel
• vibrates the arm rest and the seats, even if the steering wheel isn't vibrating.
• occurs from about 65-75 MPH
• problem is intermittent
• usually starts when engine is under load, and then it will keep on happening until it stops. It does get worse under load and lessens when not under load...and sometimes it stops!

What's been done:

• I took it to Dealer A. This dealer balanced and rotated the tires/wheels.
• That didn't fix it, so they did it again when I came back.
• I thought it might be the tires, so I replaced the no-name tires that were on it with brand new Michelin Primacy MXM4s.
• problem not resolved, so Dealer A replaced both front drive shafts
• problem not resolved, so Dealer A rebalanced the tires again
• problem not resolved, so I took it back to the dealer. They said that no problem could be found. I requested a tech to go on a drive with me. He felt the vibration. They performed an alignment. The tech said the vibration was still there and said it needed a rebalancing. It was the end of the day so I took the car back from them.
• I have a friend with a lift. We put the car up and had the car in gear. The driver's side driveshaft appeared to be wobbling. Here's a video we took: http://youtu.be/p5TbwoJQTTg?hd=1
• Frustrated with Dealer A, I took the car to Dealer B. They had a tech go out with me and the tech felt the vibration. Since it was a new problem they wanted to start from the beginning and they rebalanced the tires and checked for bent rims. They said they rebalanced the wheel/tires, didn't find any bent rims, and that the issue was resolved.
• problem not resolved. Called Dealer B back and they wanted me to talk to their service manager. I took service manager out for a drive and he acknowledged the issue. He said he'd call VW and open a case.
• Dealer B service manager called last week and said he test drove another JSW TDI and it had the same problem.
• Dealer B service manager called today and said they had a 2010 JSW in for service, so while on the lift they looked at the axles. They say it has the SAME wobbly axle on the driver's side.
• Dealer B service manager said they don't know what to do now, but it seems to be normal.

This JSW is the 6th VW in my garage since 2002. We've had two MkIVs and four MkVs (I'm lumping the JSW in there). The MkIVs have been TDIs and two of the MkVs have been TDIs. I've never experienced a problem like this on any of my other cars.
I've also had a number of loaners while the JSW has been at the dealers. They were all perfect.
I find it hard to believe that the wobbly shaft and the vibration is normal for the JSW TDI.
Any ideas??

That is strange. The symptoms you describe point towards a bad inner CV joint. If you get under the car, can you feel any movement close to the inner joint on either side? I know you said they replaced the axles, so Im at a bit of a loss.

Have a compression test done.

Cars that slightly hydrolock water get a vibration similar to yours. Bent rod.

I saw the video, and there is nothing normal about rotating machinery with than kind of wobble. I had a halfshaft pop out of the transaxle on a Dodge colt quite a few years ago which resulted in vibration that would come and go. Is it possible that something is awry with the transaxle that prevented the old (and new) driveshaft from being properly retained?

With a vibration like that, I would not be suprised if the car has been in an accident. Start looking very carefully for other evidence of that.

--Nate

I'm gonna say there's nothing wrong with the CV joint, and when the car's hanging free like that the joint it approaching the extremes of it's capabilities.

jasonTDI said:

Have a compression test done.

Cars that slightly hydrolock water get a vibration similar to yours. Bent rod.

Click to expand...

If it were a bent rod, I would think the vibration frequency should correlate with engine RPM while under load and not wheel RPM in a given gear.


Questions for the OP:

• Does the steering wheel vibration correllate with wheel RPM?
• Are power and MPGs normal? I would expect a bent rod to kill fuel economy and power.
• Has the car been doing higher than normal active regenerations of the DPF? I would expect a bent rod to cause smokey as h*ll emissions and sooting the DPF up faster.
• Has the car ever had problems in winter months with water/ice buildup in the intercooler? Refer to the "another iced up intercooler" thread for more information.

Just throwing out some ideas here.

Good luck.

Thanks everyone for taking a look.
n1das...regarding your questions:

1. No, the vibration is speed dependent. If I put the car into a lower gear at speed, or pop into neutral, the vibration is still there.
2. Power and MPG are good. I've a lifetime average (only about 8,000 miles for me) nearing 38 MPG and the last few tanks have been over 40 now that I don't use the AC. I also have the Stage 1 APR tune and the car pulls very strongly.
3. I've not noticed anything unusual about the regenerations. I don't notice them when I am driving. I have occasionally interrupted a regen, and that has been the only way I've know that the process has been happening.
4. I haven't had the car through the winter yet...I bought it in July. Given the weather in Phoenix I think that this would occur very rarely. The previous owner also lived in Phoenix.

As far as accidents go, the Carfax did not show any reported accidents. The only note of interest on the Carfax was that the transmission had been removed from the car. I confirmed this with the dealer as they had replaced the mechatronic unit at about 25,000 miles.

n1das said:

Questions for the OP:

• Does the steering wheel vibration correllate with wheel RPM?
• Are power and MPGs normal? I would expect a bent rod to kill fuel economy and power.
• Has the car been doing higher than normal active regenerations of the DPF? I would expect a bent rod to cause smokey as h*ll emissions and sooting the DPF up faster.
• Has the car ever had problems in winter months with water/ice buildup in the intercooler? Refer to the "another iced up intercooler" thread for more information.

Just throwing out some ideas here.
Good luck.

Click to expand...

Your issue sounds similar to what this guy is experiencing:

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/forum/...vibration-shaking-14546/index5.html#post79179

None of these occur with every car.

Mild bend. if it is the issue. I've seen more than a few of these. ALL of the clients knew when it happened. Not that all would, they are just very observant.

n1das said:

If it were a bent rod, I would think the vibration frequency should correlate with engine RPM while under load and not wheel RPM in a given gear.



Questions for the OP:

• Does the steering wheel vibration correlate with wheel RPM?
• Are power and MPGs normal? I would expect a bent rod to kill fuel economy and power.
• Has the car been doing higher than normal active regenerations of the DPF? I would expect a bent rod to cause smokey as h*ll emissions and sooting the DPF up faster.
• Has the car ever had problems in winter months with water/ice buildup in the intercooler? Refer to the "another iced up intercooler" thread for more information.

Just throwing out some ideas here.

Good luck.

Click to expand...

The "vibration" from fuel starvation will happen at any speed at larger throttle openings. I didn't read all the posts over there though...don't have that kind of time.

Dude, ditto on all those symptoms, dealer interactions and repairs. I'm the guy whiplash willy linked to above (http://www.myturbodiesel.com/forum/f...html#post79179). I'd be very curious to see what you think in comparison to my post (it's long, I know, but I've been trying to nail this down for months).

Like DPM said, don't trust that drive shaft wobble when the suspension geometry isn't under the car weight. I carefully put the lower control arms on jack stands as close to the wheel as possible when I took the video's of my drive axles.

As in my post on the other forum, the only thing that hasn't been changed is the transmission, clutch, or flywheel. In neutral, at 0 mph, I can rev the engine to 3k rpm with no vibrations. But, just like you, I can be rolling down a hill maintaining 70 mph, put it into neutral and the vibration stays.

One thing, do you know the part number on your driver side shaft? One of the things (out of 100) that I've thought could be wrong was that the wrong length shaft got installed at some point. I don't think it's the issue anymore, but it would be good to cross reference.

Also, do you have a strange noise that goes along with the vibration/shimmy? (I do) Any change when it's cold/hot outside? (I do).

jasonTDI said:

The "vibration" from fuel starvation will happen at any speed at larger throttle openings. I didn't read all the posts over there though...don't have that kind of time.

Click to expand...

Jason, I changed my fuel filter at the suggestion of several others that had similar vibrations and it didn't help my issue. I'm wondering, what is the best way with Vag-Com to figure out if the injector pressures or fuel delivery system is working correctly? I've seen timing tools for the previous generation diesels but the common rail engines don't need this.

I will get you those part numbers on Tuesday...I left the paperwork with them at work

I don't get any noises with the vibration. The only noise I will hear if there is something loose in the car that'll make noise, like change in the cup holders or the metal buckles on my son's carseat.

So far, I haven't noticed any temperature changes, but we are just leaving the hot season in Phoenix for the not-so-hot season. It'll be much cooler this weekend so I'll watch for any changes.

Hopefully both of us can get our problem resolved!

Type_TDi said:

One thing, do you know the part number on your driver side shaft? One of the things (out of 100) that I've thought could be wrong was that the wrong length shaft got installed at some point. I don't think it's the issue anymore, but it would be good to cross reference.

Also, do you have a strange noise that goes along with the vibration/shimmy? (I do) Any change when it's cold/hot outside? (I do).

Click to expand...

Here's the part numbers for the driveshafts that were replaced.

1K0-407-454-HX Right side
1K0-407-451-QX Left side

azbioguy said:

Here's the part numbers for the driveshafts that were replaced.

1K0-407-454-HX Right side
1K0-407-451-QX Left side

Click to expand...

I totally forgot about this post and finally noticed it in a search.

Did you ever get the vibration fixed? (I'm still living with mine)

Could be there is a manufacturing defect with a batch of half shafts. Has anyone had the balance of the half shaft checked independently?

Hi Type_TDi. After going through the winter I can now answer your question regarding temperature.

I'm still have the problem. When it got "cold" here in Phoenix (50s and 60s during the day), the vibration lessened quite a bit. Now that the temperature is quickly rising, the vibration is getting worse.

Type_TDi said:

Also, do you have a strange noise that goes along with the vibration/shimmy? (I do) Any change when it's cold/hot outside? (I do).

Click to expand...

Powder,

I had the same thought, but the time between when my car was manufactured and when the shafts were replaced was over two years.

VW dealers replace the factory drive shafts with VW branded remanufactured shafts.

I guess we just need to take the shafts out and get someone to tow the car at highway speeds.

I still suspect the shafts because they are the only thing spinning all the time besides the wheel/brake assemblies.

Azbioguy,

Yeah, I've concluded it's just the rubber bushings and mounts loosening up, letting the engine/transmission mass move around more.

I'm tempted to put in a couple raxles brand drive shafts but would hate to waste the money...

I'm having the same exact vibration on my 2010 Golf 4dr 6MT. I first attributed it to the fact that I was burning off my snow tires. But, I just had (4) brand new tires installed, Continental PureContacts...and the vibration is still there. It's ever so slight, and begins at around 62-65 mph. Half of my commute is on the highway so it's quite annoying. I notice that on the flats and going straight it is barely noticeable, but under load on hills and in a corner it's much more pronounced. It's really getting to be annoying...

Well, I went through another summer of vibration at 70, and now that it's getting "cold" in Phoenix the vibration is lessening. Maybe I'll check into one of the upgraded motor mounts and see if that helps at all.

Replace the front lower control arm bushings Inboard, rear.
Fixed mine.