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Old October 20th, 2012, 05:59   #1
dschultz
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Default Replacing PD Camshaft Position Sensor

What is the procedure for replacing the camshaft position sensor on the PD?
I have a 2005 Jetta; Timing belt and water pump replaced 20,000 miles ago.

Can the sensor be accessed without removing the engine mounts and raising up the engine?

Also, is there a way to test the sensor with a meter? VCDS is reporting a camshaft position implausible signal - intermittent.

Dave
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Old October 20th, 2012, 07:01   #2
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Other than VCDS reporting this code, is there any other reason that you want to replace this sensor? The only thing that the ECU uses this sensor for is when starting the engine to determine which cylinder is going into compression so it can inject that cylinder 1st. Are you having any issues other than the code being in.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 07:41   #3
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If what you say is true, prusink, I've got a problem. We have a customer that came in yesterday whose car has an intermittent cam position sensor code 'open or short to ground circuit' for a BEW. The VCDS/ Engine module/ Block 4 reading for the cam position is set at +.5. However, when the code pops up, the cam position sensor defaults to 0.0.

If the cam sensor means nothing after the car starts, try unplugging the cam sensor while the car is running... car dies.edit correction...if the CRANK SENSOR is unplugged, the engine won't start.

I believe the cam position sensor is CONSTANTLY reading the cam position, just like it's reading the injector balance; from idle clear through maximum rpm. If your cam sensor is giving a 'no read', I am sure you will be losing substantial fuel economy.

As for removing the sensor, first be aware that the 'no read' may have to do with a Service Bulletin that concerns the ground wire for the cam sensor. The wire may not be grounding correctly. The fix is to cut the ground wire and attach it to an access point close to the plug-in. There is a bolt that we attach the wire to that holds the water pipe across the front of the block.

If you choose to remove the sensor, you have to remove the timing belt, pulley, and some screws that hold the timing belt backing plate to the cylinder head. It's very close to remove the cam sensor, but it's doable. Make sure the sensor is bad before you bother taking it out. They don't often fail. editas oldpoopie points out in later post, the sensor can be removed w/o removing the timing belt.

The other thing to check is that the 'fingers' of the cam sensor wheel are not bent. If you have erratic distances between the cam sensor and the fingers, you can get a bad read.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 11:06   #4
dschultz
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The economy is OK.

The issue has been long crank times when warm. (10-25 seconds!)

I had a Guru look at it with VCDS and we noticed the Camshaft position sensor intermittent.

Can you post or send me the service bulletin that reference the ground wire?

Think there are three wires going to the sensor; what one is ground?

Should I remove the battery and tray and check the grounds under there?
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Old October 20th, 2012, 11:20   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dschultz View Post
The economy is OK.
The issue has been long crank times when warm. (10-25 seconds!)
I had a Guru look at it with VCDS and we noticed the Camshaft position sensor intermittent.
Can you post or send me the service bulletin that reference the ground wire?
Think there are three wires going to the sensor; what one is ground?
Should I remove the battery and tray and check the grounds under there?
I have a similar issue with my BRM. Long cranks on hot starts, normally 3-5 seconds to get it to fire and rpms are over 200 on the tach. I have found my engine harness to be worn in several places through the wire insulation. I have read that the cam sensor has fixed the long crank issue. But I want to replace the damaged harness first to see if that may be contributing to the issue. If not the new cam sensor will be installed in the future as well. My vehicle does not show any faults for cam position sensor though. Doubt anything I just said will help you, but you may want to check out the harness just to be on the safe side.
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Old October 20th, 2012, 15:47   #6
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The wiring could be bad, the camshaft position sensor could be bad, or its plug not seated. "Implausible signal" simply means its not being read and "intermittent" means just that, its sporatic. Try unplugging the sensor connector and plugging it in again. If that does not fix it, you're next step is either to replace the camshaft position sensor (if its not too expensive and fairly easy), or check for continuity from the sensor plug to the ECU, bearing in mind that even if the wiring shows continuity, there still could be a break. Wiggle the wirring while doing the continuity check to make sure its not intermittent.

--Nate
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Old October 20th, 2012, 16:08   #7
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If the cam timing is off, it will throw cam sensor codes and be really hard to start.
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Old October 21st, 2012, 00:22   #8
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Unplugging a sensor completely is rather different to getting an unusual signal from it, Frank. Especially when it's a 3-wire device where the supply is being monitored...
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Old January 6th, 2013, 22:01   #9
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What was the outcome of your diag/assessment?? I'm having a similar issue... Intermittent/ no CPS signal... Although it recorded ~160 rpm during cranking.... Hmmm
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Old January 7th, 2013, 00:24   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franko6 View Post
If you choose to remove the sensor, you have to remove the timing belt, pulley, and some screws that hold the timing belt backing plate to the cylinder head. It's very close to remove the cam sensor, but it's doable. Make sure the sensor is bad before you bother taking it out. They don't often fail.

The other thing to check is that the 'fingers' of the cam sensor wheel are not bent. If you have erratic distances between the cam sensor and the fingers, you can get a bad read.
Not true, cam sensor is replaceable without disturbing the timing belt, cam pulley, or belt backing plate. I did one today....
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Old January 7th, 2013, 17:57   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PDJetta View Post
The wiring could be bad, the camshaft position sensor could be bad, or its plug not seated. "Implausible signal" simply means its not being read and "intermittent" means just that, its sporatic. Try unplugging the sensor connector and plugging it in again. If that does not fix it, you're next step is either to replace the camshaft position sensor (if its not too expensive and fairly easy), or check for continuity from the sensor plug to the ECU, bearing in mind that even if the wiring shows continuity, there still could be a break. Wiggle the wirring while doing the continuity check to make sure its not intermittent.

--Nate
Nate- (or all...)

What are the values we are supposed to be seeing??

And how to check/where is the sensor/plug?

I don't want to hi-jack the thread from the OP, yet, this might be some valuable info:

Member Ghaniba (MANY THANKS!!! Dave!!) Stopped by yesterday, and we took a peek as to why I have a MIL... appears to be a GP code (new plugs, dealer-destroyed GP ends on harness ) and a CPS code...

VCDS reads:


19463 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40)
P3007 - 000 - No Signal
Freeze Frame:
RPM: 189 /min
Torque: 210.0 Nm
Speed: 0.0 km/h
Load: 0.0 %
Voltage: 8.51 V
Bin. Bits: 00001100
Idle Stabilization: 0.0°KW
(no units): 32.0


so, it seems that it sees Cranking, but? Maybe some of this discussion will help our OP..?


Quote:
Originally Posted by oldpoopie View Post
Not true, cam sensor is replaceable without disturbing the timing belt, cam pulley, or belt backing plate. I did one today....
how do we get to this guy if it's mounted to the cyl head... ? where is the connector?

thx J
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Old January 7th, 2013, 19:16   #12
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It has been a while since I replaced mine. It was difficult. I'm lucky I have long thin fingers. I believe I removed the timing belt cover and found the little black sensor. There is a little black oval plug I popped out to slip the sensor and wires through and popped back in place once complete. There was one little screw holding it in place that was hard to get to with the belt there, but I did it. My biggest problem was I was cheap. Instead of buying the OEM for $200.00, I bought a new aftermarket from RockAuto for $20.00. The old sensor wires came out the back at a 45 degree angle away from the engine nicely. The aftermarket sensor wires came out the back at a 45 degree angle towards the motor leaving zero clearance and barely possible to mount correctly. I ended up bending the wires as they came out to make it fit.
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Old January 7th, 2013, 19:56   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GR40RCapri View Post
how do we get to this guy if it's mounted to the cyl head... ? where is the connector?

thx J

Remove timing belt cover, look slightly below and to the right of the cam pulley. Remove the one bolt fastening the sensor in place. Pop out the rubber plug in the backing plate, unclip the wire from the harness holder and disconnect the plug. Fish the sensor wire and plug thru the hole in the backing plate.

Fwiw the rubber plug can become dried out, brittle and break. Order a new one to be safe, part # is 1e0971904
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Old January 16th, 2013, 18:15   #14
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that's what it looked to me, having an intermittent error with my camashaft sensor too. I did find out that if you clean the surface of it , the error goes away
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Old April 13th, 2013, 02:17   #15
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I just ran my first VCDS and got the same Implausible Signal - Intermittent Cam code as a mechanic who ran codes last month right after I bought the car. The car starts in 4 or 5 cranks with a substandard or under powered battery, no smoking and runs pretty good, but only gets 36.25 MPG (mostly hgwy).
This is the fault code that comes up:
1 Fault Found: 16725 - Camshaft Position Sensor (G40)
P0341 - 000 - Implausible Signal - Intermittent
Freeze Frame:
RPM: 2268 /min
Torque: 0.0 Nm
Speed: 102.0 km/h
Load: 0.0 %
Voltage: 13.60 V
Bin. Bits: 00001000
Idle Stabilization: 0.5°KW
(no units): 48.0
Readiness: 0 0 1 0 0
The mechanic wants to "set the timing" and install the roller/tensioner that wasn't changed when the belt was installed just before it was sold to me. As a newbie to TDI's I'm not sure what to make of the data in the error message. I don't have any cam or TB tools as of yet. Does the data imply anything meaningful to any of the experienced folks in here?
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