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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+)

VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+) Discussion area for the 2012+ Passat TDI (North American and rest of world versions versions). The North American model was previously codenamed NMS (New Midsize Sedan) and the version the rest of the world gets is sometimes referred to as B7.

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Old September 20th, 2012, 11:42   #1
ChadS99SVT
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Default Winter and Fuel Gelling

I did some searching and didn't really find anything specific to the new Passats. I'm sure it's all fairly similar but I'm pretty nervous about the gelling and I don't want to be left stranded.

Some questions...

At what temperature does the Gelling start to Occur? I know this is dependent on the blend as we are transitioning to winter so that brings me to another question, Is there a way to tell if a station is pumping the winter Blend?

Once on the Winter blend what temp is the raw fuel safe from gelling?

I am planning on taking my car up to the mountains for skiing fairly often where temps can be sub zero at times but generally near zero to 15 degrees at the coldest. Will I need to be sure to treat my fuel in this sitaution?

When using the fuel addititve is the VW brand (or stuff parts sells) the best? Is it harmful at all to our fuel system if used often?

how much Fuel additive needs to be used? Not sure how it's sold or sizes :shrug:
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Old September 20th, 2012, 11:45   #2
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The VW stuff (Stanadyne) is fine, but I'm not sure it prevents gelling. The easiest stuff to get that prevents gelling is the DK Power Service in the white bottle. You can get just about anywhere. The instructions on how much to use are on the bottle. No, it won't hurt your fuel system. It will actually help it. There are a million threads on additives. Do a search and you will find tons of reading.
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Old September 20th, 2012, 11:52   #3
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+1 to the DK stuff. They have a few different formulations of it depending on your needs. it is usually readily available at walmart, auto parts stores or any gas station. They also have a summer formulation if i remember correctly. Sorry, im rusty, havent bought any since my last TDI met a bitter end.

This page below has some interesting info that i wasnt aware of pertaining to the new ULSD. My last TDI was back in the HSD/LSD days. (hmmm please dont take that the wrong way!)
http://www.enertechlabs.com/ULSD_Col...n_09032007.htm

Im going to do some more research myself. Fortunately i am in memphis and our lowest temps are ususally mid 20s MAYBE in the teens a few times. Plus my car is garaged so it shouldnt be an issue although i will certainly put in some kind of anti gelling additive to be sure. nothing worse than a stranded wife calling me!
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Old September 20th, 2012, 11:56   #4
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How will we be able to get it into the tank with the new 2013 mis-fuel prevention flap?
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Old September 20th, 2012, 12:14   #5
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Is this really a big issue? I mean I leave in the NorthEast and this was the furthest thing from my mind...
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Old September 20th, 2012, 12:20   #6
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Ive also read that the wind chill doesnt affect gelling at all, it is just the actual temp.

rmd0311, idk if it is a big issue or not. Ive always put an additive in and never had an issue so i really dont know but just like water freezes at 32, diesel does gel at a certain temp too. Maybe your stations put plenty of anti gel additive in since you are so far north?
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Old September 20th, 2012, 12:28   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Papachristou View Post
Ive also read that the wind chill doesnt affect gelling at all, it is just the actual temp.

rmd0311, idk if it is a big issue or not. Ive always put an additive in and never had an issue so i really dont know but just like water freezes at 32, diesel does gel at a certain temp too. Maybe your stations put plenty of anti gel additive in since you are so far north?
so you put additive in each and every tank of diesel? how much is this stuff?
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Old September 20th, 2012, 12:43   #8
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i used to when i had my jetta from 03-04 but just got the passat a few months ago. It wont get cold here in memphis till december or so. Ill probably put some in on my first fillup around that time since the tanks last so long!

i dont remember the cost, probably $5-8 for a 16oz bottle.
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Old September 20th, 2012, 12:51   #9
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I live in Butler Pa,(very windy here where I live) have a Ford Power Stroke and VW TDI. I can say I have never wasted money on these additives. I have never had any gelling problems in 14 years.
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Old September 20th, 2012, 18:58   #10
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You'll notice when the winter blends show up because your mileage will drop a couple MPG.

As for problems with gelling, you're going to be ok. I'm at 250K on my 02 Jetta. I have added Power Service(and still do occasionally) when I know it's going below zero and/or I want to dry out the fuel system.

My trick for adding is to mark a Dawn dish soap bottle(the clear one, not the cloudy one) every 6oz. It's my rough guide on how much to add per tank. I've had the same 3 bottles in my trunk for 10plus years and never had a issue with the plastic breaking down.

I'll be checking to see how this flapper thingy works on my 2013(picking it up tomorrow night). If it doesn't work, I'll figure something out....
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Old September 21st, 2012, 04:33   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadS99SVT View Post
I did some searching and didn't really find anything specific to the new Passats. I'm sure it's all fairly similar but I'm pretty nervous about the gelling and I don't want to be left stranded.

Some questions...

At what temperature does the Gelling start to Occur? I know this is dependent on the blend as we are transitioning to winter so that brings me to another question, Is there a way to tell if a station is pumping the winter Blend?

Once on the Winter blend what temp is the raw fuel safe from gelling?
According to Wikipedia the fuel will be gelled around 5 degrees, with the first indications starting above that. I don't know of a good way to tell if a station is pumping winter blend unless it is posted or you ask, but as whitecloud1 said there is usually a mileage drop of a couple MPG.

Personally I used to run Stanadyne all the time, but have stopped being sol religious the last couple of years. I still use it in my truck because it sits a lot but I haven't run it in either of my Passats for the last couple years. I have never had a problem with gelling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadS99SVT View Post
I am planning on taking my car up to the mountains for skiing fairly often where temps can be sub zero at times but generally near zero to 15 degrees at the coldest. Will I need to be sure to treat my fuel in this sitaution?
Personally I wouldn't worry about doing anything special. I suspect that the fuel treated near where you live will work just fine in the mountains. If your really worried then don't fill before leaving and top off in the mountains. But I suspect there won't be much difference in the winter blend between the two.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChadS99SVT View Post
When using the fuel addititve is the VW brand (or stuff parts sells) the best? Is it harmful at all to our fuel system if used often?

how much Fuel additive needs to be used? Not sure how it's sold or sizes :shrug:
I personally use the Stanadyne Performance Formula. You can get this in several sizes I used to get it by the case in pints. The pint's had markings on the side for how much to use to treat 15 gal. So I would add that much every fill up.

How much is used is up to which additive you purchase. I would follow the directions and use the recommended amount.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 05:04   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Papachristou View Post
Ive also read that the wind chill doesnt affect gelling at all, it is just the actual temp.

True:

Ive always put an additive in and never had an issue so i really dont know but just like water freezes at 32, diesel does gel at a certain temp too. Maybe your stations put plenty of anti gel additive in since you are so far north?
I can remember only one time when a friend of mine ran into a problem. The only reason he had that problem is he had a second fuel tank. He drove all the way from Florida back to Ohio where the his Florida blended fuel was not quite enough for the Ohio temperatures. Ohio blended fuel would not have been a problem.

I have driven from Ohio to north of the border and never had a problem I can remember a cold morning (20F below) in Canada, where I still had my Ohio fuel as I had not filled up yet. I was able to pay my bill and the Motel and hop in my car and drive away with out a problem. Drove rather slow for a while Lots of other cars were trying to start, but none were making any progress.

Frankly it is not really a problem unless you have fuel in your tank that was bought in summer or very early fall or if there was a sudden significant. drop in temperature.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 06:12   #13
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0 - +15 degrees Fahrenheit? You'll be fine as long as you are running a winter blended fuel. I've had my diesels start in Michigan at -20F with no additives - even the 1991 Mk2, although it took a little persuasion.
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Old September 21st, 2012, 06:24   #14
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I was a bit confused trying to figure out how the OP could have done so much searching and didn't find anything, then I noticed this:

Quote:
I did some searching and didn't really find anything specific to the new Passats.
The only issue with the new Passats, is as someone mentioned about getting anything in past the anti-gas flappy thing. Otherwise, all of the threads about fuel gelling and what additive to use and damage to the fuel system is all covered in the past threads and is the same for your Passat. Fuel is fuel after all regardless of what it's in.

As a side note, I believe that this is the first misunderstanding of windchill this fall. yeay
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Old September 21st, 2012, 06:32   #15
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Generic windchill and fuel gelling threads will be moved to either Fuels & Lubricants or TDI 101. There really is nothing specific to the Passat in this regard.

This thread will remain, but the future 50 threads that I anticipate seeing will be moved (and possibly merged/combined).
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