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General VW Discussion This is a place for General VW topics (the company, not your vehicle). General topics about a specific vehicle should be posted in the General TDI Dicussion Forum sections for that vehicle platform. A4, A3 & B4, B5, etc.

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Old May 16th, 2012, 05:57   #1
blackvw99
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Default Which is the best year/model VW Tdi made?

I currently own a 1999 New Beetle Tdi and was curious/interested in purchasing another Tdi with more room. I love my Bug but it would be nice to have a little more room. Currently I've been getting around 49-51 mpg what could I expect with a larger car?
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Old May 16th, 2012, 18:47   #2
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2003 is the Holy Grail or "12V Cummins" to the VW market.
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Old May 16th, 2012, 18:48   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackvw99 View Post
... Currently I've been getting around 49-51 mpg what could I expect with a larger car?
Less!

Because:
  1. larger cars always get less mileage than smaller cars most other things being equal, and
  2. more modern cars have more anti-pollution controls which seem to almost always reduce mileage
My impression is that the best mileage cars were the early 2000s, but don't know enough to explain why. The modern CR cars get in the low 40's for mileage.

Perhaps someone else who knows more can add to this.
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Old May 17th, 2012, 03:56   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westro View Post
2003 is the Holy Grail or "12V Cummins" to the VW market.
I had one of these, but the handling is not as great as my 06 or 11 JSW. I like the total package, so I prefer the Mark V up chassis. My wife says that as soon as I drive her car it drops 4MPG. She routinely gets 45mpg out of the JSW. I will get 38mpg out of the 06, but I have to drive it hard during my lunch break running errands. She could drive it 42mpg....me 38mpg. But that 03 would get 45MPG about any day of the week and I haven't changed driving style. It just depends on what you want.
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Old May 17th, 2012, 08:09   #5
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Quote:
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2003 is the Holy Grail or "12V Cummins" to the VW market.
2003 TDI GLS wagon (silver with black cloth interior). That's my holy grail.

Jack Frost don't forget that the Beetle is less aerodynamic than the Golf or Jetta and therefore is less fuel efficient, especially on the highway.

There are pros and cons in each generation. Like vdubdezl said the handling is much better on the mk5 and newer. What sets the MK4 apart I think, is its interior quality, and amazing fuel economy. It's why I like mine so much.
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Old May 18th, 2012, 05:34   #6
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The best year for a Jetta MKIV is 2003 5 speed.The MkV 06 with package 2.If you want a CR MKV 2010 with a 6 speed is the way to go, also include Sport wagon.They put a little taller 6th gear in 2010 so you get a little better MPG.


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Old May 18th, 2012, 05:43   #7
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2003 Jetta Wagon with a manual is widely considered the best, but later ones have some advantages that the older ones don't, especially if you modify. Engine code is ALH, same as what you have now.

While the 2004-2006 Golf/New Beetle/2004-2005.0 Jetta TDIs do get slightly worse mileage stock, and are not tolerant of incorrect oils, they have higher injection pressure, IIRC are more tolerant of crap US fuel, and when modified can perform fantastically. Engine code is BEW.

The 2004-2005 Passats have the same issues with incorrect oils, plus a failure-prone balance shaft module that's expensive to replace (but there is a fixed design, at least), and expensive to rebuild front suspension. Oh, and a failure-prone mandatory automatic. Worse mileage than a Golf/Jetta, because it's a bigger car with a bigger engine. Very nice cars once you dump $10k into them. (OK, that estimate might be a bit high. But, it's not THAT high.) Engine code is BHW.

The 2005.5-2006 Jetta TDIs are bigger cars, with better suspension. Worse mileage, more size, better handling. You win some, you lose some. Engine code is BRM.

The 2009-2010 Jetta, 2009-2013 Sportwagen, 2009-2012 Audi A3, and 2010-2013 Golf are all the same basic chassis as the 2005.5-2006 Jettas, although with updated electronics in 2010+ cars, a stiffer chassis in Golfs, and updated styling in 2010+ Sportwagens/Golfs. The engine is an inherently more efficient design, but choked by craploads of emissions controls that hurt fuel economy and power, and reduce reliability (look at intercooler icing). Also, the high pressure fuel pumps seem to not be very tolerant of US fuel.

The 2011-2013 Jetta is a chassis loosely based on the previous chassis, but with suspension components from the 1999.5-2005.0 Jetta (and the Golf/New Beetle relatives) up front, and a solid rear beam. So, the suspension's worse. Interior trim is significantly cheapened. Engine is the same as the other 2009+ cars I've already mentioned, so all the same benefits and problems are there.

The 2013 New Beetle is basically a Golf with a weird body, and with Jetta rear suspension. So, that pretty much says it all.

Engine codes on all of the above 2009-2013 cars are either CBEA (for 2009s and for Audis) or CJAA (for 2010+ VWs).

The 2012-2013 Passat is based on the outgoing 2006-2011 Passat (and the current CC), which is in turn based on the previous Jetta and the Rabbit. Similar powertrain to the current Jetta, Sportwagen, Golf, A3, and New Beetle, but with modified fuel injection, and a different emissions system. The jury's still out on whether the fuel injection is actually tolerant of US fuel, but the new emissions system seems to work far better, reducing fuel consumption - Passats are able to compete with Golf/Jetta/A3/NBs on fuel economy. Engine code is CKRA.

So, the best of the newer ones... depends on what you want, really. But, I'd say that if you want a Mk4 still, it could go either way, ALH or BEW. If you want a Mk5/Mk6, I'll go with the BRM but say that the CBEA/CJAA may be better if you don't mind violating federal law, as well as only fueling from high quality stations and using lubricity additive. If you want a Passat, either go older (1997) or 2012-2013.

Oh, and any of those cars will have more rear seat and cargo room than your Beetle, except for maybe Mk4 Jetta sedans. Front seat, all of those will have less room, the 1998-2010 New Beetle has a ridiculous amount of front seat room.
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Old May 18th, 2012, 06:26   #8
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I like both my cars. The 2001 Golf with ALH (or VE) engine gets slightly better mileage, but the 2005 Wagon with BEW/PD engine has slightly more "spirit" at the expense of slightly lower mileage. Overall preference for the Mark IV in Golf or Wagon. Mk V for Jetta sedan based on family experience. Four doors is definitely the way to go, but passenger room is about the same between Golf and Wagon.

Hope that helps.

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Old May 18th, 2012, 06:49   #9
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If you are going to put people in the back seats, or carry more stuff, newer is better.

If not, keep your car, chip it, put a new suspension under it, and enjoy the cheaper driving!
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Old May 18th, 2012, 18:07   #10
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Where's the love for the B4s? more rear seat room, more FRONT seat room, bigger fuel tank, simpler turbo control, and 50+ average (not highway, AVERAGE) MPG.
There are issues with door bonk in the winter, power window regulators, rear window switches in the center dash, and a few other silly things, but get a B4 wagon TDI and you'll wonder what's wrong when you DON'T get at least 1000 miles per tank.
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Old May 18th, 2012, 18:10   #11
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Hey, I said, if you want a Passat, 1997 or 2012+!

The issue is that the 1Z engine isn't quite as strong as the later engines. Then again, that can be fixed - after all, I know of at least one ALH B4V...
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Quote:
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The really cool ToofTek made "Emperor's Clothes" injector fork risers only worked until someone pointed out that there wasn't any thing there.
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Old May 19th, 2012, 14:10   #12
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What makes a 2003 better than a 2000-2002?
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Old May 19th, 2012, 14:33   #13
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Mainly the bugs being worked out that previous years had, along with the newest electronics.

2000 has an older generation ECU that isn't quite as good.

Some 2002s had camshaft metallurgy issues.

Actually, can't think of any real problems that 2001s had, that 2003s don't.
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Quote:
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The really cool ToofTek made "Emperor's Clothes" injector fork risers only worked until someone pointed out that there wasn't any thing there.
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Old May 20th, 2012, 11:40   #14
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Quote:
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What makes a 2003 better than a 2000-2002?
It's newer.
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Old May 21st, 2012, 05:09   #15
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'03 have a bigger rear bumper on the wagons, and Stability Control available, got different rims too.
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