2010 HPFP Failure, 17k Miles, run on B5

Failed on I-95 North about 70 miles from home on the way back from a roadtrip. Paid VW Roadside extra to have it towed to my dealership, VW of Langhorne PA (Great service dept). They gave me a loaner with no fuss and just got back to me that the failure was caused by metal shavings in the fuel system, likely culprit a failed HPFP. I am the second such failure they have ever seen. They are replacing the entire fuel system this week under warranty.

80% fillups were at my local station that dispenses B5. The other 20% were high volume stations along I-95 when on road trips.

Happy that it's covered under warranty, now I'm debating what are the odds of a repeat failure down the line. In the next year I was planning to buy an SUV for 7 passenger seating and cargo duties - it was going to be a nice supplement to the TDI but now I'm wondering if I should trade the TDI toward the SUV and cut my losses here.

Anyone have the link handy to report to NTSB?

Sorry about your HPFP failure. No link handy, but could you be more specific to your "USA" location? There are those that are tracking failures, and it would help to know which stretch of I95 you frequent for your fuel purchases.
Thanks.

Live in Philly PA. Filled at local Philly Sunoco station (B5), Delaware welcome station outside Wilmington (really nice high volume stop, also sunoco), and a Mr. Fuel high volume truck stop near bowling green VA. Those stations account for 99% of my fills. I filled once in Massachusetts along the mass pike for a trip to Boston, Mobile station.

If fixed % of hpfp will break up within the warranty period, and if the supply of the diesel fuel contain a fixed % batch of bad diesel, then it doesn't matter where and what brand of fuel you fill up with. High volume truck station will still receive batches of bad diesel.

Is it bad fuel that is causing this? Do they fail in Canada, Europe and other areas they are sold in? That would be an interesting comparison.

I'm just providing as much detail as I can for the benefit of the community. It is a widely held belief that poor lubricity causes failures. From reading lots of discussion on the HPFP analysis threads and the details that have surfaced regarding the delphi pump, I think we can safely say that bad lubricity is a contributing factor of failure, but not the only cause. We've had failures from members that live in states that mandate b5 (and they never left that state).

There could be many factors that could cause that piston to rotate inside the pump and shred itself.

hpfp failure

Absolute-sorry to hear about your issue. This is really a club that DOESN'T want any new members!

Just one more failure for the pile. It seems that the 2010's are not fairing any better than the 09's. From the reports here there is about a 2 to1 ratio which would indicate similar failure rates. Not enough data on the 11/12's yet.

The link is http://www.nhtsa.gov

I personally am looking at replacing my 2009. Just had the entire fuel system replaced, and ran into an issue again last week with a check engine light and derate situation.

Looking at 2010 Jetta Wolfsburg editions. Sure, it wont get the same mpg... but I love everything about my Jetta and the Wolfsburg improves on a lot (suspension, brakes, appearance, etc).

All comes down to what you want at the end of the day. Perhaps see how the car is after the fuel system replacement, and then make your decision. Or run it until it's time to buy the SUV then trade in. Your value shouldn't go down much in the next few months.

submitted to NTSB. Thanks everyone for support and advice.

I have approached the issue as a probable fuel filtration and lubricity issue from day one. Though I have had concerns about water removal capability, I never did anything about it.

A friend who is a foreman at a VW shop has lately seen two failures. In one the fuel was suspect. It looked pink or orange. I have never seen anything like it. The fuel sample results are not in yet, though the state initially shut down the station, they later said the fuel was ok. The owner has a thread about it on this site.

The second failure had two inches of water in the fuel filter.

Another friend owns a TDI Touareg, he had what the dealer said was "bad fuel" that caused an HPFP failure.

So I finally got off the dime and put in my water separator fuel filters, with Water in Fuel alarm to follow shortly.

Will it bulletproof my engines? Probably not. Will it help prevent water ingestion? Almost certainly. Will it help prevent smaller particles from entering my HPFP than the OEM filter? Yes.

Essentially I did what I could.

Improved fuel filtration and water separation.

Got the car back. Pump they used is part number 03L-130-755-A.

Interestingly they gave me the old school fuel filter assembly with the water seperator/bleed valve. I used to have the "revised" type b filter but now I have the old style one. Coincidence or intential?

What I had:


What I have now:


Coincidence or intentional?

Absolute Diesel said:

Got the car back. Pump they used is part number 03L-130-755-A.

Interestingly they gave me the old school fuel filter assembly with the water seperator/bleed valve. I used to have the "revised" type b filter but now I have the old style one. Coincidence or intential?

What I had:

What I have now:

Coincidence or intentional?

Click to expand...

Probably just using up old stock.

Has anyone probed the connection between the type of fuel filter and the HPFP failure?

original 2009 and first run of 2010's have that second picture (two hole olympic ring filter) Filters. Later 2010s up to current 2012's have the first pic (single hole filter).

So that's an odd one!

my 2010 came back from HPFP fuel system replacement with the bleed valve filter too....before the failure I had the #1 canister with no bleeder....
wonder if it is using old stock because they are running low on fuel system parts?? or did they find out this filter is better for some reason?

Do I remember correctly that the 2-hole filter is taller, with a space at the bottom for water collection? Perhaps the thinking is, if there's water in the fuel (which seems to be rare around here...on this site, I mean), it would settle out in the filter housing and not be sucked into the system...unless the fuel is saturated with water...

this is their 4th fuel system modification, latest and greatests and it's a million times better than ever and won't ever cause you issues!!!!

tdiatlast said:

Do I remember correctly that the 2-hole filter is taller, with a space at the bottom for water collection? Perhaps the thinking is, if there's water in the fuel (which seems to be rare around here...on this site, I mean), it would settle out in the filter housing and not be sucked into the system...unless the fuel is saturated with water...

Click to expand...

Yes,the two hole filter does have a water/sediment space at the bottom. Its weak point is the olympic o-ring and the filter element hanging up on the center post when changing. The one hole filter is simpiler to change,but has no space at the bottom.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=3629155
CR-ONE HOLE and TWO HOLE FUEL FILTER DIFFERENCES/PICS
In this thread I will point out the differences between the one and two hole fuel filter elements and filter canisters.The first obvious difference is the one hole canister measures approx.6-5/8ths inches deep as compared to the two hole filter that measures approx. 7-1/4 inches deep. Both canisters are the same diameter. The fuel connections on the outside of the lid are same,but the canister lids are different on the inside and outside rims. One hole has a single black o-ring that seals the lid to the canister. Two hole has a wide green o- ring that seals the lid to the canister plus a blue Olympic shaped o-ring that seals the lid/fuel passages at the center column. Some two hole canister lids have a water removal port built into the canister lid. If you look at the two hole filter canister lid you will see the stubbed up metal tube with a torx screw and washer. To remove water from the bottom of the fuel canister you remove this torx screw and attach a line for suction. This port is connected to a fuel passage that runs to the bottom of the plastic center column. Remove approx. 3.4 oz. of fuel with a suction pump.
Both canisters have identical mounting brackets,bolts and lid attachment torx screws.

Below pic: shows the one hole filter canister on the left and the two hole filter canister on the right.


Below pic: shows the fuel canisters as compared to their fuel filter elements. The one hole filter element on the left and the two hole filter element on the right. The primary differences are the one hole element only has one green o-ring to seal the filter where it pushes onto the thermo tee tube. The two hole filter has two green o-rings.One top on bottom that seal the filter at the center column. Less chance for a bad o-ring on the one hole style. The one hole filter installs a little easier than the two hole filter. I also like the way the one hole lid indexes on the canister for proper orientation. The one hole uses two metal tabs made onto the lid,whereas the two hole filter relies on two small bumps on the center column to line up with two small indentations on the canister lid for proper orientation of the lid to canister.
The two hole filter lid has two dimples on the inside of the canister lid that line up with two matching bumps on the center column. These dimples and bumps help line up the canister lid in the correct position.


----------------PU936/1 or PU936/1X------------------ PU936 or PU936/2X------------------------


Here are the major differences between the one hole and two hole filter canisters.
Since the one hole filter canister has less depth the fuel filter element sits almost on the bottom of the canister when installed. There is little or no space in the bottom of the canister for water or sediment.

The two hole filter has almost a full 2 inches of space at the bottom of the canister to hold water/sediment.

I'm not sure why VW switched to the one hole filter design? Just my opinion,but being old school diesel. I want an area in the fuel filter canister to separate out any water or sediment.


Below pic: shows the differences between the actual filters and how they mount within the fuel filter cansiter.
The one hole filter simply slides onto a plastic tube that is built right onto the fuel canister lid. This plastic part is attached to the lid and acts just like the old thermo tee. It controls the return fuel flow thru the filter canister to allow fuel in the canister to heat up during cold weather and help prevent fuel gelling.
The two hole filter has a similar thermo device that is built into the center column and serves the same purpose in controlling the return fuel flow for heating fuel within the cansiter during cold weather.

Note: think of the cardboard as the bottom of the fuel canister. The one hole would sit on or very near the bottom of the fuel canister. The two hole filter has nearly 2 inches between the bottom of the canister and the bottom of the fuel filter element.

When getting my keys back at the dealer the tech said something to the effect of "they went with an older design that was tried and true" - I didn't think much of this statement as anything more than her trying to make me feel better, knowing full well their aren't "old school" HPFP's we could use on our CR's.

Maybe I misunderstood and she was talking about this old school fuel filter design. Didn't pop the hood until I was all done inside and about to drive away. Either way, it still doesn't explain pre mid 2010 failures where the old school filter design was OEM.

EDIT: One more interesting thing she said - "the HPFP got going too fast and shred itself" I'm assuming the dealer is just guessing as to why it failed, but the previous day I did drive someone to the emergency room. Needless to say I was accelerating and cruising fast. I never told the dealership this fact. Coincidence?

My '09 had the two-hole filter and that space at the bottom was where all the rust-looking sediment would collect. The occasional piece of metal would wind up on top of the filter.

Absolute Diesel said:

submitted to NTSB. Thanks everyone for support and advice.

Click to expand...

Make sure you look up your report on safercar.gov in a few days. It will probably be mis-filed as a "Fuel System:Gasoline" complaint.

An e-mail to dataquality@dot.gov with your ODI number asking that they mark it as "Fuel System: Diesel" will clear this up. When filing a complaint online they only allow you to choose "Fuel System" and they seem to default to Gasoline.

ODI 10432978 here, welcome to the club.

-speedeep

Absolute Diesel said:

EDIT: One more interesting thing she said - "the HPFP got going too fast and shred itself" I'm assuming the dealer is just guessing as to why it failed, but the previous day I did drive someone to the emergency room. Needless to say I was accelerating and cruising fast. I never told the dealership this fact. Coincidence?

Click to expand...

If fast driving or acceleration was the root cause, I'd think the Germans would have tons of failures (autobahn driving).

Did you ever get a good read on whether you had contaminated fuel? I've been running nothing but B2-B5 since my car has been new. Had hoped that would innoculate me from this. Keeping my fingers crossed.

Absolute Diesel said:

When getting my keys back at the dealer the tech said something to the effect of desi"they went with an older gn that was tried and true" - I didn't think much of this statement as anything more than her trying to make me feel better, knowing full well their aren't "old school" HPFP's we could use on our CR's.

Maybe I misunderstood and she was talking about this old school fuel filter design. Didn't pop the hood until I was all done inside and about to drive away. Either way, it still doesn't explain pre mid 2010 failures where the old school filter design was OEM.

EDIT: One more interesting thing she said - "the HPFP got going too fast and shred itself" I'm assuming the dealer is just guessing as to why it failed, but the previous day I did drive someone to the emergency room. Needless to say I was accelerating and cruising fast. I never told the dealership this fact. Coincidence?

Click to expand...

It is horrifying that a person responsible for maintaining, diagnosing and repairing automobiles would say those two things. I am so glad I have been doing all my own work for 40 years and have access to a shop with a lift. I do not ever, ever, ever want to leave my car at a dealership.