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Old July 18th, 2011, 16:59   #1501
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http://www.opti-lube.com/XPD.htm
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Old July 19th, 2011, 06:04   #1502
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Originally Posted by Curkkic View Post
Does anyone have the old failed highpressure pump available? I would be interested in examining it to make an improved pump. Pm me if so. ill pay for the shipping costs.
Have you followed the HPFP examination thread? Do you have any suggestions without having a pump in hand? Can you coat parts with high tech DLC, etc. ?

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Old July 19th, 2011, 21:07   #1503
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I'm going to look into additives, whats the recommendation... anyone?
VW sanctions biodiesel up to B5, and all you need is 1-2% to get adequate lubricity.

You can add a quart of B100 to one tank of USLD if you don't have B1-B5 in your area.
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Old July 20th, 2011, 12:03   #1504
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Acutally I havent, I have purposfully avoided it untill I can draw my own conclusions on how one pump fails, Later compare it to others. multiple uninfluenced investigations should yield more options to correct the pumps flaws, more importantly, openly identify them. all is in the air till i have one in my hands. Its a big project, as such it will take a considerable amount of time to fully evaluate. Then the testing of alternatives, further still is the fabrication of a functional replacement.



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Originally Posted by eddif View Post
Have you followed the HPFP examination thread? Do you have any suggestions without having a pump in hand? Can you coat parts with high tech DLC, etc. ?

eddif
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Old July 20th, 2011, 12:36   #1505
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Bosch sent with steel head and steel plungers on A3 and A4 chassis for the high pressure side, 4 rollers on a merry go round cam, and 10 or 11mm diameter plunger to get the pressure they had before.

Why would they go with a bigger piston/ plunger, at higher pressure, one roller, not 4, and try to run it with no rings, no motor oil, no nothing for lubrication except fuel, in an Aluminum bore?

Seems a stupid design to me, destined for failure.
Didn't Bosch learn anything from Chevrolet's Vega aluminum block/aluminum pistons in the early 1970's and what a failure that was? Asking aluminum to play nice with a steel piston with the lubricity of current diesel fuel, regardless of coating, seems like a folly to me.
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Old July 20th, 2011, 13:52   #1506
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Acutally I havent, I have purposfully avoided it untill I can draw my own conclusions on how one pump fails, Later compare it to others. multiple uninfluenced investigations should yield more options to correct the pumps flaws, more importantly, openly identify them. all is in the air till i have one in my hands. Its a big project, as such it will take a considerable amount of time to fully evaluate. Then the testing of alternatives, further still is the fabrication of a functional replacement.
The trick, in my opinion, is finding a pump that is just showing the very first early signs of failure. When you have a pump that is destroyed you can not really tell how the problem began. The only pump that had any photos and put back in service, just had the pump roller turn what looks like blue (dis-colored) from heat (?) and had a few scratches.

You can look, and go through developing your own thoughts. I would, however, respectfully submit: that the roller assembly and roller assembly slider bore is the place to start the investigation and planning of HPFP improvement. Just what the improvements should be --- I do not know.

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Old July 20th, 2011, 15:03   #1507
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eddif,

Why not supply Curkkic with your pump as your analysis has run its course?

I posted before and still content that only VW and Bosch will resolve this issue. I do however applaud all effort from independent investigation.
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Old July 20th, 2011, 16:28   #1508
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My friend who had a 2009 TDI sportwagen, just traded his at the dealer as a deposit for a new 2012 Passat TDI SEL. He had like 50k on his with nary a problem. That said however, I'd never buy a 2009 just because of the HPFP. It should prove interesting how his new ride will fare. I looked at a 2012 TDI SEL today. Of course it looks lovely and it is. But of course time will tell.
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Old July 20th, 2011, 18:11   #1509
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Originally Posted by CedarPark68 View Post
eddif,

Why not supply Curkkic with your pump as your analysis has run its course?

I posted before and still content that only VW and Bosch will resolve this issue. I do however applaud all effort from independent investigation.
I disagree. eddif isn't done yet. I say keep the pump he has. Failed pumps are hard to come by and even harder to come by now that VW is replacing ALL hpfps under warranty.(at least for now) So,this means there may not be any failed pumps available for awhile.VW keeps all failed warranty pumps. If you noticed since VW is now covering the pumps you have not seen any reports of failed pumps. Covered under warranty..............not a problem. Not worth talking about.

Also a satisfied customer is less apt to report to the NHTSA if the failure is taken care of under warranty without a fuss.
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Old July 20th, 2011, 20:44   #1510
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@Oxford_Guy- Hi- I assume you're up at Miami U? I have a 2011 TDI, 6M. Have about 1300 miles on it thus far and have filled up twice without adding any additive. Do you know where I can buy some B100? I'm down here in West Chester. Also, what year is your TDi? Miles? Any issues or concerns besides the HPFP? Glad to hear that VW is now covering the issue via warranty. Would love to see photo. Thanks! PS- my wife is a Miami Grad!
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Old July 21st, 2011, 01:12   #1511
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Originally Posted by oxford_guy View Post
VW sanctions biodiesel up to B5, and all you need is 1-2% to get adequate lubricity.

You can add a quart of B100 to one tank of USLD if you don't have B1-B5 in your area.
I feel guilty every time I post on this thread, because it is a NHTSA investigation thread. Let me see if I can post so it fits the thread.

The failures seem to occur if just a quart of gasoline gets in a tank of diesel fuel. At that point the car dies on the interstate or goes into limp mode. And if you have just pulled out in traffic and limp mode hits suddenly and unexpectedly you are a safety hazzard big time (without limp mode you can zoom out of danger).

To cover that 32 oz of gasoline you would need ????. 16:1 ratio of 2-stroke oil? Plus some extra Bio or oil? This would have to be pre mixed with the gasoline? How do you plan for such a disaster?

You can't with any forethought that I can come up with.

That 32oz could enter the diesel fuel in all sorts of ways. Fuel transport, emergency gas can filled with diesel?

Worse yet. Say you get 2 gallons of gasoline or other contaminant that enters the fuel pickup almost raw (turpentine, water,etc). At 16:1 you would need 16 oz (?) of 2-stroke oil and 16 oz (?) of bio pre-mixed just to drive the car up on a trailer for transport to a dealer for draining and filter change.

See how stupid all this is. There needs to be the old-fashioned over built pump that will take a little abuse. There is no Mercy built into the existing HPFP. And even then accidental contaminates would run the risk of killing even a super pump.

And! I have not even mentioned the $8,000 USD part.

Dweisel is correct. Warranty makes problems go away. When warranty ends we will hear of a lot more disasters (both monetary and physical). Right now we are living in fantasy land. When warranty and insurance is gone and folks are trying to drive to work with a failing HPFP, how many traffic accidents will occur?

I suggest everyone get to an appropriate thread and work on the problems. Regretfully I am probably the most negligent person here. I actually believe an added filtering system would help a huge amount. Two simple adapters should allow an added filter, that could make a failure cost $2,000 USD, rather than $8,000 USD, and I am not presently working on the CRs. Right now I am trying to save the PDs (since I own one that is facing eminent failure). I need more dedication and production.

A fuel water sensor and drain is desperately needed for that 1:1,000 chance of water in fuel.

A pump / system purge system would be great too.


The Mississippi shade tree jerk who wants to improve

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Last edited by eddif; July 21st, 2011 at 01:19. Reason: did a double post without noticing added one comment
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Old July 21st, 2011, 08:21   #1512
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See how stupid all this is. There needs to be the old-fashioned over built pump that will take a little abuse. There is no Mercy built into the existing HPFP. And even then accidental contaminates would run the risk of killing even a super pump.

And! I have not even mentioned the $8,000 USD part.

Dweisel is correct. Warranty makes problems go away. When warranty ends we will hear of a lot more disasters (both monetary and physical). Right now we are living in fantasy land. When warranty and insurance is gone and folks are trying to drive to work with a failing HPFP, how many traffic accidents will occur?
The above part of eddif's post is pretty much what I have been preaching since inception.

Everything else is most likely pure speculation unless forensic and engineering data can be produced to back such claims.

I also agree that this issue is totally on the shoulders of Bosch and VWAG and a viable resolution should come from them, however, I also believe the NHTSA has the duty to act the moment they are convinced via their investigation that this could be a safety hazard and should do so sooner rather than later. The part regarding the unconscionable cost of such a repair that is not covered or happens out of warranty should eventually catch up with those who are not sheep by refusing to be an owner of their products. Later!
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Old July 21st, 2011, 10:16   #1513
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The above part of eddif's post is pretty much what I have been preaching since inception.

Everything else is most likely pure speculation unless forensic and engineering data can be produced to back such claims.

I also agree that this issue is totally on the shoulders of Bosch and VWAG and a viable resolution should come from them, however, I also believe the NHTSA has the duty to act the moment they are convinced via their investigation that this could be a safety hazard and should do so sooner rather than later. The part regarding the unconscionable cost of such a repair that is not covered or happens out of warranty should eventually catch up with those who are not sheep by refusing to be an owner of their products. Later!
Ouch
I think I got pretty much lashed. However I really understand how the last PDs and CRs have stopped the ability of Harvieux and others to deal with diesel VWs. All of us are suffering and some are cautious enough to make judgements on how we buy, sell and use the cars.

"Everything else is most likely pure speculation unless forensic and engineering data can be produced to back such claims."

As a shadetree feller from Mississippi:
When you see all the trash trying to go through a clogged up pressure bypass valve screen (ask Dweisel) that is pretty much forensic.

When you trace down the flow in the HPFP and find a clogged by-pass valve will raise the pressure in the pump housing and thus raise the internal HPFP casing pressure. That is some sort of Mississippi information.

And when the cars set pressure codes I would think that is getting close to engineering data.

I am fighting with no one, I am not irritated with anyone. We just have a history of having to do a lot of the work ourselves. I have put High Volume oil pumps in air-cooled VWs. Bored magnesium blocks for oversized main bearings. Replaced pulled head studs (The first repair can be heli-coils or inserts with smaller studs, etc). Read of blow-by baffels for 1.6 VW Diesels to stop run-away. Modified cam bearings in PDs (I got another 65,000 extra miles ---In my mind, but maybe not in others thoughts.)

There have been probably thousands of dropped exhaust valves in air-cooled VWs. Sure a safety hazard on the road.

I have met folks trying to limp home in an air cooled VW that the insulation had pulled off the engine compartment and was up against the cooling fan intake. The car must have pulled almost every head stud. I just helped them pull out the insulation panel and watched them limp home (another safety hazard). etc. etc.

Ain't hit a mess? LOL

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Old July 21st, 2011, 11:21   #1514
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Ouch
I think I got pretty much lashed. However I really understand how the last PDs and CRs have stopped the ability of Harvieux and others to deal with diesel VWs. All of us are suffering and some are cautious enough to make judgements on how we buy, sell and use the cars.

"Everything else is most likely pure speculation unless forensic and engineering data can be produced to back such claims."

As a shadetree feller from Mississippi:
When you see all the trash trying to go through a clogged up pressure bypass valve screen (ask Dweisel) that is pretty much forensic.

When you trace down the flow in the HPFP and find a clogged by-pass valve will raise the pressure in the pump housing and thus raise the internal HPFP casing pressure. That is some sort of Mississippi information.

And when the cars set pressure codes I would think that is getting close to engineering data.

I am fighting with no one, I am not irritated with anyone. We just have a history of having to do a lot of the work ourselves. I have put High Volume oil pumps in air-cooled VWs. Bored magnesium blocks for oversized main bearings. Replaced pulled head studs (The first repair can be heli-coils or inserts with smaller studs, etc). Read of blow-by baffels for 1.6 VW Diesels to stop run-away. Modified cam bearings in PDs (I got another 65,000 extra miles ---In my mind, but maybe not in others thoughts.)

There have been probably thousands of dropped exhaust valves in air-cooled VWs. Sure a safety hazard on the road.

I have met folks trying to limp home in an air cooled VW that the insulation had pulled off the engine compartment and was up against the cooling fan intake. The car must have pulled almost every head stud. I just helped them pull out the insulation panel and watched them limp home (another safety hazard). etc. etc.

Ain't hit a mess? LOL

eddif
My post was not meant in any way, shape, or form to lash you. I was mainly referring to such claims as 32 oz. of gas claim along with fact that no one, TTBOMK, other than "possibly" VW or Bosch knows exactly why these pumps are failing. Later!
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Old July 21st, 2011, 11:30   #1515
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If I was a test engineer at Bosch, I would currently be dumping different substances (gasoline, additives, water, etc) into D2 to do bench test runs on the HPFP for root cause failure analysis....... Hey, that should have been done prior to 2009!.
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