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TDI Conversions Discussions on converting non TDIs into TDIS. More general items can be answered better in other sections. This is ideal for issues that don't have an overlap and are very special to swaping engines.

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Old January 6th, 2011, 13:54   #1
chaloux
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Default ALH from 98 bug into 96 Audi S6

*SWAP COMPLETED on PAGE 10*



Well, I've decided that it's been long enough going without Quattro and an adult-sized rear seat, not to mention the limited room in the engine bay. Throughout high school and to this day my parents owned four URS cars as well as a TDI bug (at various times). I now own my own bug, and my dad has two S6s, one a 1996 and one a 1997. The 1996 has been off the road for over a year after my little sister crashed it. My dad has all the replacement parts, but we're both tied up building a stroker motor for his 1997.

Anyway, I'm taking the 96 shell and putting my 400+km ALH in it and then going on a road trip. The bug will be parted afterwards. Below are the details I've covered so far - I know there is a lot involved with swap projects, but I am too attached to diesel and Quattro to be daunted by how much work it is

Details covered:

1) transmission - the 01E bolts right up the to ALH, no adapters needed
1a) a 6 speed conversion from advancedautomotion.com with a .56 6th gear will be used. 5 speed 02J ratios/speeds vs 6 speed 01E ratios/speeds

2) the cluster will work, there is no immobilizer as the bug is a 98 and the S6 is a 1996 - this is a relatively simple swap.

3) the exhaust will need to be custom made, as the stock UR exhaust won't fit the TDI, and the TDI exhaust won't fit the C4 chassis. My plan is for a full stainless 2.5" straight exhaust using the AR25 resonator I already own. I think $500 would do it, am I off in this?

4) the donor car needs some (body and other) work, yes, which will be completed before the engine swap.

5) the TDI will be fully serviced while out - TB kit, all seals, gaskets etc..

My timeline is to be done sometime in May. This might be optimistic, but that's just my nature . I am in my last year of school at YorkU in Toronto, and I finish in mid April.

That's it for now, I'll have to update again when I have more details about the swap. Pix coming soon of the two cars involved!

To Do List: Completed


- remove AAN from S6
- put 6th gear in 01E
- remove ALH from bug, test placement in S6
- do all belts/seals/gaskets etc.
- determine if I'm going to do a power steering pump swap (for brakes) OR perform vacuum assist mod in the S6
- mount engine/tranny in car
- figure out mounting for ALH as best as I can
- complete mounting
- install fuel pressure regulator going with H fuel line system
- figure out fuel lines
- swap go-pedal from the bug
- figure out intake tract
- coolant lines
- swap engine harness/wiring/cluster/ECU/MAF
- exhaust
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button

Last edited by chaloux; December 31st, 2012 at 08:17.
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Old January 6th, 2011, 15:59   #2
jjordan11
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Nice, should be a good car when finished with it. Let me know if you run into any snags once you get further along. I know you already have the 98's ECM and harness, but I personally would go with the later ECM for tuning ease in the future. I'm thinking about converting my ahu's ECM/harness to the later alh in my vanagon.
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Old January 7th, 2011, 08:06   #3
chaloux
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That is a good bit of advice. Thankfully it's already been socketed by Rocketchip, so I am good to go in that regard. Every time I drive the bug now I just think, "imagine what that S is going to be like "
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old January 8th, 2011, 14:32   #4
chaloux
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In keeping with the planning, I've been talking with Scott@advancedautomotion a lot (thanks again!) and have been consulting ETKA - it looks like the engine mounting will have to be completely custom because the TDI that the A6 used was the AHU, which has entirely different mounting bosses vs. the ALH. I may be able to use the hydro mounts in the S6 and fab some brackets myself, or it may be better to use some of the mounts from the bug. It's hard to say right now because I don't have both engines out. This is one element that will have to be tackled when I get there.
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old January 8th, 2011, 17:17   #5
G60ING
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look into a B6 A4 for mounting brackets that might work. Otherwise it might be a b5.5 tdi's brackets
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Old January 17th, 2011, 13:13   #6
fastscirocco
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Just when I was getting ready to post a link of this conversion on Quattroworld
I noticed the poster's name!

Now get to work and post pics!
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Old January 18th, 2011, 18:24   #7
chaloux
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I'm pretty sure the MORE planning I do, the smoother it will go

I think the most challenging thing for this build is going to be mounting the engine. I'm not sure what exists on the "sides" of the block in terms of places for me to either tap or just bolt into. Time to look for pics of bare blocks I guess...

There's also another guy on here who started a swap and then ended up just buying an A6 TDI. I've talked with him a bit and it's good to have his input.
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old January 19th, 2011, 13:54   #8
Tdi Kick
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Hey there!

Met you and your "LDL BGR" at Brandon's Rocketchip GTG... At least I'm pretty sure thats you...

Now THIS is a hot swap. I'd drive that car in a HEARTBEAT...always liked the looks of it. Go For it man!

My input: THis car did come with the AHU-style engine,as stated, therefore stock engine mounts exsist, perhaps even just the ones already in the car. If its allowable, depending on your plans/goals, perhaps consider selling/trading/dealing the Bug or its parts for an AHU. I really think you'd come out on top in terms of money and time; ALH's tend to go for more than AHU's, at least where I look.

I do realize that the ALH has some advantages, yet consider:

1. VNT swap onto an AHU has been accomplished many times successfully
2. An AHU with ALH wiring IS possible as well.

I do beleive that either of these may save you a LOT of headache in terms of fabbing, mounting and NVH.

I hope this is helpful

Cheers!
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Old January 23rd, 2011, 08:55   #9
Pat Dolan
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Another option is to use just the AHU block and load it with ALH head, etc. to facilitate bolt-in. Check with Issam (INA Engineering...he will be in the vendors section) up in Ottawa, he often has blocks (less crank) and has a pretty good idea of what is interchangeable.
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Old January 23rd, 2011, 11:04   #10
G60ING
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THE alh head won't bolt onto the AHU block. Go to Germanautoparts.com and compare the head gaskets to see how different they are.
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Old January 23rd, 2011, 19:32   #11
chaloux
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I am not too worried about mounting the engine. While I do think it'll be the biggest headache, I'm able to weld onto the block if need be (thanks to modern tech welding cast is not as scary as it used to be). I think that I will end up drilling and tapping some bosses and making a custom bracket for the //S mounts to bolt up to.

The nice thing is that I get to take the engine out, do all of the maintenance it needs, clean it up, and then sell off the rest of the car, recouping my costs. The ONLY things in this swap that should cost money (aside from full TB kit, gaskets, seals) are the custom 2.5" exhaust and the $1200 6 speed conversion. I think the swap SHOULD be able to be done for around $2k - but maybe I am just terribly optimistic/naive

A couple of other things on my mind are:

oil pan - not sure how this is going to work exactly (in terms of the transmission), I'll have a better idea when I get in there.

intake paths should be interesting but not too difficult really. I may end up picking up a $100 intercooler piping kit off fleabay and cutting it up to make it work. Once again, we'll see.

ripping the wiring out is going to be fun (as in terrible).

fuel pump - in the S6 it's in the tank. Have to do some research about what to do with it - keep it, make/get a cap, or what.
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old February 4th, 2011, 14:54   #12
chaloux
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So I've been thinking... if I am going to do this, I may as well do it "right" :P

I'll have a 2.5" exhaust, custom made. So, I thought, why not go v-band for another $100? Well, that'd be one funky adapter to go from the VNT-15 outlet to v-band. So then I thought, well why don't I just get a new turbo? Well... that's a pain, because the VNT-15 is attached to the manfiold.

So I have two options then: separate them and weld a new flange on, or buy a $100-200 manifold from various places online. Either way, I'll be using an internally wastegated turbo with a T3 inlet and v-band hotside outlet. Oh... how beautiful that would be! The only extra thing would be tuning it, which could be done with a custom Malone tune for $450, not bad really.

I really don't want to lose any response, and I figure by going with a billet compressor wheel, ball bearing turbo, that might be possible, and I may even gain a few ponies.

Looking at this turbo so far... Comp Turbo CT2-46.
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old February 4th, 2011, 16:25   #13
oilhammer
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The BHW's engine support brackets:

8D0-199-305-A
8D0-199-306-AA

The BHW's engine mounts:

8D0-199-379-AR
8D0-199-382-AR

The AWM's oil pan (the late B5's 1.8t engine):

06B-103-601-P

That should take care of getting the engine mounted in the car and bolted to the transmission, as I do not think any of the B or C segment cars with longitudinal-mounted engines ever changed the mounting tabs of the engine mounts in the subframe, whether they used the EA827 family of engines (AHU, ABA, etc) or EA113 family of engines (ALH, AEG, AWM, etc.). In any case, even if they did, it would probably be far easier to mod your existing subframe, OR find a later B5 subframe to mod into the car. The actual subframe mounts may bolt right up to your Audi's body, not sure.

If you can get some subframe measurements I can compare them to a Passat if you like.

Hope that helps.
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Last edited by oilhammer; February 4th, 2011 at 16:28.
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Old February 4th, 2011, 17:04   #14
chaloux
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Thank you! Saw your post in the other thread, this clarifies it quite a bit.
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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Old February 5th, 2011, 17:10   #15
chaloux
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Well, the project just got real - order to Scott @ Advanced Automotion went in today. 6 speed conversion will be shipped Monday!
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Current: 04 Jetta Wagon TDI - DC stage I clutch/14lb fw - 01 Audi Allroad 6MT
- RIP 96 Audi A6 TDI Quattro - RocketChip tuned
- RIP 1996 Audi S6 mit ALH
- RIP 98 Beetle (LDL BGR)
EGR delete - Manual glow-plug button
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