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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)

Upgrades (non TDI Engine related) The place of handling, lighting and other upgrades that do not relate to the performance or economy of the TDI engine. In other words upgrades to your TDI that don't fit into TDI Fuel Economy & TDI Engine Enhancements.Please note the Performance Disclaimer

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Old September 22nd, 2010, 10:51   #16
DJGonzo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compu_85 View Post
It took me so long to get my MFA working because I didn't read the wiring diagrams properly

Remember, 99.5s use CAN bus too. That's how ASR works, how the CCM talks to the door slave modules, etc.

One of these days I want to get a CAN packet sniffer and see what's going out over the wire...

-Jason
Are the CAN wires going to the cluster or not?
Maybe some modules aren't talking on the CAN line. Immo2/3 clusters do get a Tach/speed signal when they are on my 99.5, and that must mean that that there is some CAN action going on.
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Last edited by DJGonzo; September 22nd, 2010 at 10:54.
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 12:03   #17
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99.5 use CAN for ABS, and some signals are transmitted over CAN in the 99.5 models, you have to be a bit lucky though. I installed one the other day on one of the latest Bora's 1999 (MSA15 ecu), and everything worked fine, except the airbag light. But we made that work by installing a newer airbag controller.
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 12:13   #18
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99.5 use CAN for ABS, and some signals are transmitted over CAN in the 99.5 models, you have to be a bit lucky though. I installed one the other day on one of the latest Bora's 1999 (MSA15 ecu), and everything worked fine, except the airbag light. But we made that work by installing a newer airbag controller.
New airbag controller eh?
I think just a simple adaptation might fix it though. Most modules are CAN capable, I think.
Thats one problem down though. If replacing the controller does the rick, then its a simple fix and only have a few other kinks to work out.
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 13:09   #19
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My car has CAN wiring going to the cluster, but it's VERY late production. I've seen 2000s made the same month.

-J
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Maybe I should pay MYSELF to do bad work on my car!
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 17:40   #20
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I recently swapped an immo2 cluster into my early (11/98) 99.5 Golf. (needed to be able to change the pulses per mile value for my 6-speed swap)

on the true 99.5 cluster, the CEL, GP light, and Air Bag light are all controlled directly from their respective control units. for the 2001 immo2 cluster, everything comes in through the can bus. if you open the cluster and are competent with electronics, its a simple matter to rewire the cluster to work properly.

the last two things i have left to take care of are the odometer and the immo light. I have access to a VAGDASHCOM for the odo, and there are two ways to fix the immo. first, you could add an immo coil and program a key to it. second, pull the LED. because the is no coil at all, the cluster will not beep at you on start up, it will simply flash the LED.

Originally, I was going to take the first option, but have since decided upon the second. I believe I still have the schematics I came up with in the trunk of my car. I will upload them if anyone is interested.

EDIT: also, vehicles have used a CAN system for ECU to IC communication for many years, it was only recently (2001 for our VW's) that the CAN system was used as a full vehicle system.
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 19:07   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unpimpZauto View Post
I recently swapped an immo2 cluster into my early (11/98) 99.5 Golf. (needed to be able to change the pulses per mile value for my 6-speed swap)

on the true 99.5 cluster, the CEL, GP light, and Air Bag light are all controlled directly from their respective control units. for the 2001 immo2 cluster, everything comes in through the can bus. if you open the cluster and are competent with electronics, its a simple matter to rewire the cluster to work properly.

the last two things i have left to take care of are the odometer and the immo light. I have access to a VAGDASHCOM for the odo, and there are two ways to fix the immo. first, you could add an immo coil and program a key to it. second, pull the LED. because the is no coil at all, the cluster will not beep at you on start up, it will simply flash the LED.

Originally, I was going to take the first option, but have since decided upon the second. I believe I still have the schematics I came up with in the trunk of my car. I will upload them if anyone is interested.

EDIT: also, vehicles have used a CAN system for ECU to IC communication for many years, it was only recently (2001 for our VW's) that the CAN system was used as a full vehicle system.
I think I qualify as "competent" with electronics. I flash all kinds of hardware.
Would you mind sharing what needs to be changed on the cluster?
I will be playing with some Immo2 clusters (junk yards give em away for 20 bucks ) on my car tomorrow before I buy a Sport MFA cluster.
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Old September 22nd, 2010, 21:01   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unpimpZauto View Post
I recently swapped an immo2 cluster into my early (11/98) 99.5 Golf. (needed to be able to change the pulses per mile value for my 6-speed swap)

on the true 99.5 cluster, the CEL, GP light, and Air Bag light are all controlled directly from their respective control units. for the 2001 immo2 cluster, everything comes in through the can bus. if you open the cluster and are competent with electronics, its a simple matter to rewire the cluster to work properly.

the last two things i have left to take care of are the odometer and the immo light. I have access to a VAGDASHCOM for the odo, and there are two ways to fix the immo. first, you could add an immo coil and program a key to it. second, pull the LED. because the is no coil at all, the cluster will not beep at you on start up, it will simply flash the LED.

Originally, I was going to take the first option, but have since decided upon the second. I believe I still have the schematics I came up with in the trunk of my car. I will upload them if anyone is interested.

EDIT: also, vehicles have used a CAN system for ECU to IC communication for many years, it was only recently (2001 for our VW's) that the CAN system was used as a full vehicle system.
That is very good news.
Do you think Immo3 cluster can be done same way on 99.5?
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 04:10   #23
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yes. the immo3 should be able to be overcome like the immo2 cluster. without first looking at the cluster, i can't guarantee what circuitry is used, but i should at least be similar to the immo2, as both use a micro-controller to trigger the lights. I am currently thinking about getting a non-mfa sport cluster, which will be able to go in.

not having looked into it, the only thing i would be leery of would be the MFA/FIS clusters, as they require a full can-bus.
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 09:37   #24
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Ignore the ABS light, my ABS sensor is shot. The middle light is brake pad wear sensor which I need to code off. Tach works and seems accurate (need to plug in VCDS to double check but I think so). Speedometer works although im not sure if its accurate but it can be adjusted.
Immo light can be covered up. Airbag could possibly be fixed with proper coding. The consumption write has to be connected and sport fis cluster is a go!
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 16:04   #25
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Huh, who would have thought it would work straight off. Still have to see if the MFA cluster works. That will be the big question.

As for the brake pad light, it's a simple coding change with vag-com.

As for the immo light, I would de-solder the LED from the board and remove it. Save it and put it in the rear fog area like I did with my cluster.
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 16:36   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJGonzo View Post
Ignore the ABS light, my ABS sensor is shot. The middle light is brake pad wear sensor which I need to code off. Tach works and seems accurate (need to plug in VCDS to double check but I think so). Speedometer works although im not sure if its accurate but it can be adjusted.
Immo light can be covered up. Airbag could possibly be fixed with proper coding. The consumption write has to be connected and sport fis cluster is a go!
You just don't want to listen to people.
MFA/FIS cluster will need full can-bus.It is only way to work.Also millage to empty, MPG is reported by ECU witch 99.5 ECU don't have it same way as Immo3 ECU has.

Speedo , RPM-s, Temperature , fuel gauge will work with no problem. Even I plugged Bettle cluster in my 99.5 and all this thing will work .

You will find lot of info by reading this tread posted long time by Nihilator:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3568883
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 17:11   #27
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I believe there is a wire in the ECU labeled"fuel consumption data". I remember reading compu85's thread on it and he had to hook it up to the cluster and then it worked.
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 17:19   #28
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I believe there is a wire in the ECU labeled"fuel consumption data". I remember reading compu85's thread on it and he had to hook it up to the cluster and then it worked.
There is but I don't think it will work with MFA/FIS Immo3 cluster.
Immo3 cluster gets this info via CAN-BUS.
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 17:27   #29
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Originally Posted by jetta ,97 View Post
You just don't want to listen to people.
MFA/FIS cluster will need full can-bus.It is only way to work.Also millage to empty, MPG is reported by ECU witch 99.5 ECU don't have it same way as Immo3 ECU has.

Speedo , RPM-s, Temperature , fuel gauge will work with no problem. Even I plugged Bettle cluster in my 99.5 and all this thing will work .

You will find lot of info by reading this tread posted long time by Nihilator:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3568883

I WILL have it my way. If I have to buy an adapter, I will. However I think I can pull this off without it. I already know which adapter and where I can buy it. Prob will cost me 150 with shipping.

I love how you are saying its not possible.
People that say its not possible are the ones that make me push myself really hard to prove them wrong.
I have a perfectly good brain, Google Translator, spare clusters, and enough free time to spare. I have Winols and I have tools to read and write clusters. I think I can pull it off.

Also, I doubt anyone on Vortex or here has had as much experience doing these things as the forums over in Germany and other European sites where I am getting my info from. People say its not possible because its not plug and play and don't have the crazy electronic inclination I have (or madness and stubbornness??)

Edit: I have read that Vortex thread over a million times and there is a LOT of info left out.
Have you ever even played with a Tacho or ECU dump?
Why are you jumping on the gun and saying it won't work?
People in Europe got these new sport clusters working on 96 and 97 year model VAG cars.
Read up, get informed, or just silently watch my thread unless you can help me out.

Not trying to attack you or sound hostile. If this post seems that way to you, my apologies.
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1983 MK1 Rabbit 1.6D - Under the knife - Plans: ALH + GTB2260VK with custom billet wheel upgrade - Rods - Chemical intercooling and 6k RPM's
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Last edited by DJGonzo; September 23rd, 2010 at 17:33.
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Old September 23rd, 2010, 17:37   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJGonzo View Post
I WILL have it my way. If I have to buy an adapter, I will. However I think I can pull this off without it. I already know which adapter and where I can buy it. Prob will cost me 150 with shipping.

I love how you are saying its not possible.
People that say its not possible are the ones that make me push myself really hard to prove them wrong.
I have a perfectly good brain, Google Translator, spare clusters, and enough free time to spare. I have Winols and I have tools to read and write clusters. I think I can pull it off.

Also, I doubt anyone on Vortex or here has had as much experience doing these things as the forums over in Germany and other European sites where I am getting my info from. People say its not possible because its not plug and play and don't have the crazy electronic inclination I have (or madness and stubbornness??)

Edit: I have read that Vortex thread over a million times and there is a LOT of info left out.
Have you ever even played with a Tacho or ECU dump?
Why are you jumping on the gun and saying it won't work?
People in Europe got these new sport clusters working on 96 and 97 year model VAG cars.
Read up, get informed, or just silently watch my thread unless you can help me out.

Not trying to attack you or sound hostile. If this post seems that way to you, my apologies.
Most of the Info people getting overhere is from same German sites where you going .
It is been going on over 5 years.
But hey good luck to you.
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