Tranny fluid 04 passat tdi

Dealer said 330$ for tranny service. Whats typical cost for you guys out there? ALSO what exact fluid does this beast take just to make sure TRICOUNTY in oregon puts the right stuff in?

Pentosin ATF-1 is what we use. It is NOT a 'regular' ATF.

I typically flush these transmissions, and that lately has been free due to the balance shaft upgrade procedure making it easy to do (just hook the machine up).

The ATF cost on the flush is about $220 alone. This reflects 12 L.

???

Thanks oilhammer, I just wish you were closer. I talk to the guys down there and they say they work on these all the time so they use the right stuff. He could not give me the name of the fluid because they order in bulk.... I know it sounds iffy but this place was recommended by fix-um-rich at fix-um-house. It just seems like I want to know everything that is going on with MY car because Im with this baby for the long run. AM I being to anal bout this or what?

BTW he called it a hyper synthetic almost a mineral oil... if that helps.

They should use this (see new container below).

That seems fair to me, if they're using all VW parts including Filters and the Pentosin. I recently had mine done and was charged 2 hours labour plus VW parts. What with the $$ exchange rate, you're deal is better. I don't think my dealer "flushed" it with 12L like OilHammer, just drained and replaced.

b5r said:

AM I being to anal bout this or what?

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NO! You're not. You have an expectation of quality work so you have a right to know what they'll do and what kind of parts they do it with.

My $.02,

I should note to anyone reading that Tony's pic is of the old style Pentosin bottle. The new one is taller and more squarish, and has a pic of an autobox gear selector on the front. Same fluid inside however.

oilhammer said:

I should note to anyone reading that Tony's pic is of the old style Pentosin bottle. The new one is taller and more squarish, and has a pic of an autobox gear selector on the front. Same fluid inside however.

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Brian, Thanks! I have not seen that new bottle! I'll have to change my pic when I can get one of the new container!

New container added to above post!

you can do an ATF fluid and filter change yourself, probably better than the dealer http://www.taligentx.com/passat/maintenance/atfchange/ for less than 1/2 their charge. the ATF filter kits for B5.5 are available from lots of places for ~$40.

I like the idea of myself of servicing it... someday, right now I do not have equipment or tools nesscary and leaving in a week to fight fires for rest of summer, the wife will then once again take over car for right now its the only one we have.

thanks for all the help guys

What is the Pentosin FFL-2 Fluid for?? Which models??? Thx

SUNRG said:

The ATF filter kits for B5.5 are available from lots of places for ~$40.

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The OEM VW filter kits are quite a bit higher in price. Even at places like World Impex they were only discounted by maybe 10% from list when I looked them up using the VW part #'s.

So the question becomes do you want OEM VW parts and fluids? I asked that in this forum earlier, and most people said to stick to VW parts.

But I'm not sure if that's because the cheaper filters are known to be bad, or just that nobody is willing to risk trying them because they're almost certainly Chinese.

blaz said:

The OEM VW filter kits are quite a bit higher in price. Even at places like World Impex they were only discounted by maybe 10% from list when I looked them up using the VW part #'s.

So the question becomes do you want OEM VW parts and fluids? I asked that in this forum earlier, and most people said to stick to VW parts.

But I'm not sure if that's because the cheaper filters are known to be bad, or just that nobody is willing to risk trying them because they're almost certainly Chinese.

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there are items where OEM = significant quality difference, and there are lots of items where aftermarket offerings are as good if not better than OEM.

AT fluid filters are relatively low-tech. Visually there was no difference between the OEM AT filters i removed from my Passat and my Mercedes and the aftermarket filters i used to replace them. both are super-common filters and transmissions. i picked up my Passat filter here LINK and my Mercedes filter from Advanced Auto Parts.

i chose to "drop my AT pan, clean it and change the filter and fluid" over an "AT flush where the old filter is unchanged". if the OEM and aftermarket filters were visually different in any way i would have returned the aftermarket and picked up an OEM. I plan to drop my pan, clean it and change the fluid and filter every other year (regardless of mileage) using an aftermarket AT filter kit and Pentosin ATF-1.

My suggestion: If the transmission is still working properly, shifting properly and you are interested in prolonging the "lifetime" of it, is to drop the pan, replace the filter, and do a partial fluid exchange.
If you are having issues such as no longer shifting as it used to, then have a complete flush and also a filter change.

Do as I say, not as I do.
I had a flush but not a filter. My cold fluid related MIL (occurs on the 2-3 shift) has again returned. I'm suspecting that at 150k miles it is dirty and restrictive enough to reduce the flow capacity with cold (<100F) fluid.

Lug_Nut said:

My suggestion: If the transmission is still working properly, shifting properly and you are interested in prolonging the "lifetime" of it, is to drop the pan, replace the filter, and do a partial fluid exchange.
If you are having issues such as no longer shifting as it used to, then have a complete flush and also a filter change.

Do as I say, not as I do.
I had a flush but not a filter. My cold fluid related MIL (occurs on the 2-3 shift) has again returned. I'm suspecting that at 150k miles it is dirty and restrictive enough to reduce the flow capacity with cold (<100F) fluid.

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4 or 5 years and 150k on a ATF filter is a lot. when i pulled mine i thought of all the people that're just getting flushes. running all that expensive new fluid through a dirty old filter... while i'm sure it's better than doing nothing, doesn't seem ideal.

flush combined with filter change IMHO = ideal
filter and partial fluid change IMHO = 2nd choice
flush while leaving old filter in place, while very clean and easy to do, IMHO = distant 3rd choice

just my opinion.

Have you ever cut open a filter on the 01V? There is nothing in there. Even after 200k miles, they are clean as a whistle inside. The teeny bit of particles in them is only about 5% of the flow. Those filters are WAY oversized. This ZF unit is also used (in a modified form of course) in many BMWs as well.

I'll find out what condition mine is in when I change it.
It may be a wild goose chase and a waste of the cost of a filter and some fluid, but at least then I can be certain.

oilhammer said:

Have you ever cut open a filter on the 01V? There is nothing in there. Even after 200k miles, they are clean as a whistle inside. The teeny bit of particles in them is only about 5% of the flow. Those filters are WAY oversized. This ZF unit is also used (in a modified form of course) in many BMWs as well.

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i know it's a great AT and i'm not expecting the filter to be loaded down with anything.

my oil filters never have anything in them either, i cut them open every time i do an oil change, and they probably are OK for continued use - but if given the choice to have new ATF flow through a new filter or new ATF flow thru a black as night old filter that's been used for 80,000+ miles, i personally would and did opt for the former.

i have no ZF evidence to support my choice, i'm going to change my tranny fluid and filter every other year, and i'll stay in touch and let you know how my tranny holds up over the next 100-300k .

soooo

so just got back from tricounty and.... ugh. They took off the pan and found that it was filled with a grey metallic soup....

basically the magnets on the pan were covered with alumunim
they say its from the torque converter and estimates at around 2200 to 3200$ right now.


They put the pan back on with the same nasty fluid and said I should have it done soon. SAID no reason to put new stuff in with 30+ years changing tranny s under their belt... it could only cause havic down the road.

Im just in a state of hate right now with this car and its our only one.
I would rather not talk about it now as well but i can tell you that the oonwer there was super nice and discussed the whole situation with and showed me exact parts from others trannys that have recently just been done

Im at 106000 miles right now and was optimisticlly thinking this car would easily see 150000 if not 1800000 before i had to bee concerned about the tranny.

FOR some reason after seeing alll the posts on here I figured that i would get in for some MX that could help prolong........


Its all ready to the end.....
Mostly all highway miles and commuting.
yes I like to accelrate from time to time and I know its not a porche


really im just posting this to let others know how things go once you crest the magic 100000 miles if you have not been properly doing your mx that is not in the regularly schedule mx from VW



Love to hear your comments on this one

b5r - how does the tranny shift?

the tranny is shifting nice to me. before we dropped the pan we took for a test drive and he stop the car several times and then accelarated at a normal fuel saving rate. then just once he got on it up to 3rd gear.. then slowed down with tiptronic down shift. then sped up with tip. concluded that it was very normal with no problems.

2 reasons i had this done and was going to have a PARTIAL fluid change per what was advised at shop was that

1. from what I had heard here and

2. I have noticed in the morning when pulling out and still cold that 1 to 2 is a harder than normal shift and almost same can be said for 2 to 3 but not as much at all.

So there was concern for me since i had seen here that people were actually change fluids back at 40000 miles... wow i dont know where I stand on that now but i wish i had more of a sense to follow this forum rather than the owners manual...

If I had a gernade launcher and money didnt matter i would blow this car to shreds and go buy a new one..... with a warranty at least


Yes I just got it off my chest



now what

HA HA!!!

if it were my TDI, and its ZF tranny was still shifting "nice", i would do an fluid / filter change and a transmission flush, then keep driving. maybe start putting money away for a new tranny down the road. if you're lucky, the ZF will hang in there for quite a few more miles, maybe even years. if not, worst case scenario is that you've lost $300 or so. these trannies generally are super tough. my oil and filter were black at 80k when i changed them, but the pan and magnets were fine / normal. since the ZF is such a brute, maybe a little TLC now will breath some life into it.

i don't know anything about the place that you took your TDI too, but if it's a tranny shop, well ... they make their living on replacing transmissions.

b5r said:

the tranny is shifting nice to me. before we dropped the pan we took for a test drive and he stop the car several times and then accelarated at a normal fuel saving rate. then just once he got on it up to 3rd gear.. then slowed down with tiptronic down shift. then sped up with tip. concluded that it was very normal with no problems.

2 reasons i had this done and was going to have a PARTIAL fluid change per what was advised at shop was that

1. from what I had heard here and

2. I have noticed in the morning when pulling out and still cold that 1 to 2 is a harder than normal shift and almost same can be said for 2 to 3 but not as much at all.

So there was concern for me since i had seen here that people were actually change fluids back at 40000 miles... wow i dont know where I stand on that now but i wish i had more of a sense to follow this forum rather than the owners manual...

If I had a gernade launcher and money didnt matter i would blow this car to shreds and go buy a new one..... with a warrenty at least


Yes I just got it off my chest



now what

HA HA!!!

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FWIW, there is ALWAYS some gray material stuck to the magnets, and if it has never been apart before, my bet is that most of what you are seeing was there from transmission break-in.

If you do end up needing to replace the unit, they are actually less money than the 01Ms, so that is not so bad. I have only ever replaced 2 of these, neither were in a TDI B5. I have seen a couple of the original green pan gaskets split open, however.

b5r said:

I have noticed in the morning when pulling out and still cold that 1 to 2 is a harder than normal shift and almost same can be said for 2 to 3 but not as much at all.

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The 1-2 shift is hydraulic, just like the 'good old days' before electronics took over much of the chore. The harder (I call it 'crisper' shift) into 2nd is more viscerally pleasing to me. I wish all the gear changes were like that...
Anyway, when I detect a more 'crisp' than usual 1-2 shift, I use that as a notice of mine producing an engine control unit fault code at the 2-3 shift. Sort of an opposite of Pavlov's dog, but instead of a food reward following a cue, I get an ECU fault code penalty.
I can avoid the fault by pushing the selector over into tip mode to hold 2nd for a while longer as the fluid warms just a bit more. From that point onward all is well and full auto, sans fault, is possible.

No faults from there. Does anyone else second this stuff or have an opinion on my tranny at the moment.. drove today about 20 miles and there is nothing noticably wrong from when I first noticed this and then took it in... At this point I dont think the guys I had this done at will do a full flush do to what they saw inside and they think we should just move ahead with torque converter and see waht else might be on its last legs in there or at least getting close.... AS for now I did not talk with them today and I am 30 hours from departure for most the summer...

to me it is still shifting nicely

SUNRG and lug nut thank you for your replies, you have been a great help

IMO go to a different shop....FAST! Don't believe a word they said. If they know so much... then they should have known to change the gasket at least!!!! We have had reports of failed gaskets on this list, that caused leaking fluid that led to catastrophic failure! Sounds like the dealers here on L.I. who had no idea what 505.01 spec oil was, but they serviced pumpe duse TDI's with non spec VW diesel motor oil and were ready to argue the point even when I stuck the owners manual in their face My tranny oil looked horrible @50,000 Analysis showed it was time to change, tranny shifted fine and still does. I'll be doing a second change in another 5,000mi and another analysis. There have been others who have done 100K+ trans fluid changes on this list. It may be late but it's better than never

It is absolute BS that a passive drain, change and fill will cause problems. I even doubt the stories about power flushing knocking crap lose and plugging a valve or galley

If it were me I'd "GIT R Done" and send some fluid off to analysis to see just how bad things might be.

Stay away from those bandits that want to replace a working TC Find an Indy that works on VW's. Book rate is like 3 hours for a T-fluid change + parts, I paid my Indy $150 to do the work and had the parts delivered to my door for $125. Stay away from any Indy that wants to charge book. This is, at best, a .75-1.0 hr job. BTW the steeler wanted full book + parts mark-up and said I was wasting my money changing the fluid. Lifetime fluid = the lifetime of the warranty

How do they know the torque convertor is bad? The goop in the fluid is normal. The tranny seems to shift normally (although it's hard to diagnose over the internet). You didn't think there was a problem before going to the shop.

Was there any other evidence shown to you?

Are you sure they're not just trying to drum up business?

First thanks loneli,

the only evidence was the bottom of the pan and they said they know exactly whats going on.

they also showed me parts from same tranny and showed me where I will most likly have a fail first.

they say its the torque convertor because they could tell the mess they were looking at was aluminum???? I dont see how without a full analysis

B5r,
How many miles have you got on your car? edit- 106K

FWIW, I had my pan dropped and a fluid and filter change (only the fluid in the pan) @ 97K. I suspect that if you don't have access to an OilHammer that will clean out his tranny flushing machine so he can flush your tranny with the good stuff, that dropping the pan and changing the fluid and filter should be sufficient and not too much 'shock to the system' that would cause slipping problems.

I also find it hard to believe that the tranny shop has seen enough of these to really know that your TC is in the crapper. If it's shifting right, tell them to take their $3000 repair and shove it! If they don't want to do what you ask them, find a good independant VW shop who will do the work for you.

Just my $.02,