www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2016 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You




Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > TDI News/Tech

TDI News/Tech This Forum is for the posting of TDI news related items.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 8th, 2008, 13:55   #1
TDIMeister
Phd of TDIClub Enthusiast
Moderator at Large
 
TDIMeister's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Canada
TDI(s): TDI
Default WSJ: Bosch's Johannes-Joerg Rueger On Why Diesel Engines Are Hip

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121633031942163481.html
TDIMeister is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2008, 15:30   #2
eb2143
Veteran Member
 
eb2143's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Rhode Island
TDI(s): None
Default

Good Interview, Dr. Rueger is straight forward and knowledgeable. My interest was definitely peaked by this question.
WSJ: The use of biodiesel is growing in the U.S. though the fuel typically sold as biodiesel is a mixture of petroleum diesel and biodiesel. What are the issues with biodiesel in terms of affecting performance and fuel economy?

Dr. Rueger: There's aren't really any issues with it regarding fuel economy and performance. But biofuels tend to age. You have to take care of using it in the right way and typically those who are using biofuels now are aware and know how to use it.

Maybe a better question would have been:
WSJ: The use of biodiesel is growing in the U.S. though the fuel typically sold as biodiesel is a mixture of petroleum diesel and biodiesel. What are the issues with biodiesel?


?
__________________
SOLD MY BABY: 2001 Jetta TDI 5mt, Bosio Sprint 520s, Koni FSDs, VW HD Springs, 10mm spacer, Audi TT LCA bushings, 034 motorsports strut mounts, E-code lights, Audi TT "short"-shifter, IDparts rear sway bar, DG Panzer plate, Caterpillar 2m fuel filter, Frostheater, GLI Recaros, GTI 3-spoke steering wheel, Audi S3 shifter, R-line stainless pedals[/URL]
eb2143 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2008, 17:22   #3
bluengreen
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hauppauge NY
Default

Norbert Krause Director of VW Engineering & Environmental Office at the Press Launch 2 weeks ago in Santa Monica CA:
Why only B5?
VW: Quality and uniformity in quantity of BioD isnt there yet. Soy based 1st Gen Esthered Bio D is not chemically similar enough to meet the Clean Diesel demands.
Acids are too high in 1st gen B20 and can dilute engine lubricants and cause engine damage. Regen for Nox/DPF system requires post inject burning of the fuel and if it is B20 it will get into the crankcase and dilute the oil that lubes the engine (along with the acid (Lye) used in gen 1 bioD).
However several producers are working on 2nd gen bio fuels like hydro treated vegetable oil (HVO) hydro treated vegetable fuels are very chemically similar to ULSD, go through the same refining process and will not pose a problem and would permit up to B40 blends. VW wants 2nd gen ASAP and is partnering to get it b/c it does not have farm impacts. Neste Oil in Finland started research in Europe for this, Conoco-Philips is working on it as are Shell BP and others. 2nd gen Bio D is also desirable because it is pipeline deliverable (unlike Ethanol) and can share the infrastructure already in place to distribute it.
Allan Schaeffer -Diesel Technology Forum www.dieselforum.org also spoke indicating Diesel supply should be on the upswing.
7 Increased ULSD supplies coming online:
Marathon USA Garyville LA 180k/Bbl/day 1.2 Bil/Bbl/Yr
Shell USA Port Arthur LA 600k/Bbl/day (up from 52K Bbl/day )
Valero USA Port Arthur St. Charles LA 103k/Bbl/day (2010)
NuStar DE $300M in new refining equip (2011)
Tesoro CA (LA) Product shift 7-8k/Bbl/day
Saudi Aramco Saudi Arabia 4000k/Bbl/day ULSD Focused (2012)
Saudi Aramco Saudi Arabia 400k/Bbl/day ULS Products (2013)

Last edited by bluengreen; October 8th, 2008 at 19:54.
bluengreen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2008, 19:09   #4
eb2143
Veteran Member
 
eb2143's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Rhode Island
TDI(s): None
Default

Good info!
__________________
SOLD MY BABY: 2001 Jetta TDI 5mt, Bosio Sprint 520s, Koni FSDs, VW HD Springs, 10mm spacer, Audi TT LCA bushings, 034 motorsports strut mounts, E-code lights, Audi TT "short"-shifter, IDparts rear sway bar, DG Panzer plate, Caterpillar 2m fuel filter, Frostheater, GLI Recaros, GTI 3-spoke steering wheel, Audi S3 shifter, R-line stainless pedals[/URL]
eb2143 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 8th, 2008, 21:19   #5
fnj2
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Wellfleet, Massachusetts, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluengreen
Regen for Nox/DPF system requires post inject burning of the fuel and if it is B20 it will get into the crankcase and dilute the oil that lubes the engine (along with the acid (Lye) used in gen 1 bioD).
Lye is the opposite of acid. It is alkaline.
__________________
Mutter at idle, growl at full throttle
fnj2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 9th, 2008, 06:30   #6
CentralFloridaTDIguy
Veteran Member
 
CentralFloridaTDIguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Orlando
TDI(s): none yet
Cool awesome refining news

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluengreen
However several producers are working on 2nd gen bio fuels like hydro treated vegetable oil (HVO) hydro treated vegetable fuels are very chemically similar to ULSD, go through the same refining process and will not pose a problem and would permit up to B40 blends. VW wants 2nd gen ASAP and is partnering to get it b/c it does not have farm impacts. Neste Oil in Finland started research in Europe for this, Conoco-Philips is working on it as are Shell BP and others. 2nd gen Bio D is also desirable because it is pipeline deliverable (unlike Ethanol) and can share the infrastructure already in place to distribute it.
Allan Schaeffer -Diesel Technology Forum www.dieselforum.org also spoke indicating Diesel supply should be on the upswing.
7 Increased ULSD supplies coming online:
Marathon USA Garyville LA 180k/Bbl/day 1.2 Bil/Bbl/Yr
Shell USA Port Arthur LA 600k/Bbl/day (up from 52K Bbl/day )
Valero USA Port Arthur St. Charles LA 103k/Bbl/day (2010)
NuStar DE $300M in new refining equip (2011)
Tesoro CA (LA) Product shift 7-8k/Bbl/day
Saudi Aramco Saudi Arabia 4000k/Bbl/day ULSD Focused (2012)
Saudi Aramco Saudi Arabia 400k/Bbl/day ULS Products (2013)
makes one hopeful that the price of ULSD will be parity with RUG nationwide in the near future
CentralFloridaTDIguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 9th, 2008, 14:39   #7
bluengreen
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hauppauge NY
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fnj2
Lye is the opposite of acid. It is alkaline.
I think Krause meant acidity not acid. Either way it sheads light on why VW is skittish on Gen 1 BioDiesel and it suggests that a 2009 TDI may happily ingest BioD in Gen 2 at a far higher %, perhaps up to B40.
bluengreen is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:27.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2017
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
1996 - 2017, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.15568 seconds with 9 queries
[Output: 80.10 Kb. compressed to 69.37 Kb. by saving 10.73 Kb. (13.39%)]