Car won't start troubleshooting - Page 11

dukku · February 5th, 2009, 21:48

You were right ! I pulled out the coolant temperature sensor's harness connector and the glow plugs indicator kept lighting for 10 secods and the engine started quicker and smoother than yesterday . (today the air temp was about 3 degrees celsius and the other day was about 5 ).
What do you suggest next? Replace the sensor?
The other sensor's body was black-colloured and this one is green ...does it matters? Is it a kind of collour-code?

I am waiting for you to tach me what to do .Thank you for your advices!!
Regards ,Radu.

l_c · February 6th, 2009, 02:14

Radu, that is highly interesting!
The green CTS is considered to be an improved version of the device.
However, that's not really the culprit.
We know now that the problem as you've described is basically a pre-glow issue.
There's a way to modify the pre-glow parameters, adaptation settings in VCDS (VAG-COM)

I'm not an expert in that, but i can post back later w/ a topic link (am on mobile now)
Thx; larry

DanG144 · February 6th, 2009, 02:50

Larry,
I am watching with interest. I was under the impression that the glow plug adaptation was not possible for PD's.
Dukku's PD is different than mine, but it appears that he has some of the same measuring blocks; I suspect that he has the same adaptation limits as on North American PDs.
Dan

dukku · February 6th, 2009, 08:05

I have extended the pre-glow time in december . I think that was on engine group , channel 12 , the default value was 32768 and i set it to 32700 then test it and save it.
I have also set the vag-com to output test mode and tested the glow-plug relay and I pulled one glow's conector and I have measured the presence of electricity betwen the wire and ground chassis.
I think this is because the cam-lifters I changed. Will post on youtube a video shot while engine were runing in the first seconds after starting in the morning , I hear a rythmic noise like "tac..tac...tac." for 10-15 sec.

l_c · February 6th, 2009, 10:15

Radu, I noticed these chaps (also with PD engines) were asking similar questions (and looking at glow period), see here -- http://uk-mkivs.net/forums/p/232096/...9.aspx#1519329

I shouldn't say that the glow is "the problem" in your car; but I think that we're finding your start-up difficulty (at -5 or -10 deg C) to be "sensitive" to glow period. Good luck ... Larry.

dukku · February 13th, 2009, 05:56

These days the temperature was betwen 0 and 7 degrees celsius. Even at 7 degrees in the morning I got blue smoke and variable idle speed for few seconds. At +1 degrees I cranked for 3-4 secconds .
OffTopic:
I bought a new tandem pump and I want to replace the old one(hope to find a tutorial somewhere) and another camplifter set (maybe the last ones i used wasn't good). Does anybody have a tutorial regading these 2 problems? I found only this :
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread...haft+replacing
I hope to get a better startup .

whitedog · February 13th, 2009, 07:14

Dukku, the car is starting now, it just has problems once running, correct? Maybe you could start another thread about hose problems? That would probably get some more people looking at your situation.

ahaus · February 14th, 2009, 11:02

Hello Everyone,

I was contemplating starting my own thread but after seeing the invite to reply in an earlier post, I will just post here.

I took my 02 TDi out yesterday evening, came home and parked it in the garage as normal. This morning as I'm heading out to run errands, I hop in turn the key to run (no glow time due to warm garage), everything lights up and beeps as normal but when I turn the key to start I got nothing. This is the first time this has occurred so I tried again and with the same results. Immediately I start to troubleshoot. I checked the battery voltage (12.6) and turned the key to to run with the door open and hood up listening for relays. Everything sounded relatively normal as far as my untrained ear can tell.

So naturally the next step I take is to search this forum. I came upon this thread and attempted everything in step 4 except tracing through the wiring. I do know that my starter/solenoid is good because I made a switchable jumper to test it. I also tried this with the key in the run position and it fired right up. I checked the control wire going to the solenoid and it saw 12.6 V when I held the key in the start position so long as I had the clutch pedal to the floor.

This leads me to believe that my CPP switch is good, the starter is good (it started with the jumper), and that the ECM is getting power as well (also because it ran).

I am at a loss right now because I don't know what else could be causing this issue. If anything that I wrote doesn't make sense please let me know and I'll do my best to clear it up. Any help will be greatly appreciated; thank you in advance!

Alex

rdkern · February 14th, 2009, 11:08

The gp light comes on for a moment? Not that a 109 would cause this.

You did not have any turning of the engine initially, right? You did get it to start with the jumper to the solenoid. I'd review the connections and wire going to the solenoid.

ahaus · February 14th, 2009, 11:12

Yes, the GP light comes on for a short amount of time and then flicks off. It's near 60 in the garage right now.

ahaus · February 14th, 2009, 11:19

Thank you for the quick replies. You are correct that the engine did NOT turn over initially. Only with the jump wire to the solenoid did I get that to happen.

Wouldn't the car starting with a jump to the solenoid show that the high power connections are OK? I did check the small control wire with my multi-meter; it showed 12.6 V as long as the clutch was depressed. With that kind of voltage why wouldn't it act the same as when the jump wire was attached and activate the starter? That is what has me perplexed.

DanG144 · February 14th, 2009, 11:54

An intermittent problem like this is troublesome to nail down.

Did the solenoid hang up?

Did the switch not work several times in a row, and then start working?

Probably one or the other.

You might not find out for a while.

If it happens again, try to check the voltage at the solenoid before doing anything else. If you can find the voltage good, but no response from the solenoid, then you know where the problem is.

Keep your test start switch and something to tap on the solenoid with in the car at all times, until you find it.

Good luck.

Dan

whitedog · February 14th, 2009, 12:06

So right now, it won't start with the key switch everytime?

ahaus · February 14th, 2009, 12:38

I believe that I have narrowed down the problem to the anti-theft starter lock relay in position 3 on the relay panel. I pulled off the steering column lower trim and put my hand on the relays while putting the key in the start position. The relay I mentioned made a continuous clicking noise and didn't seem to act as the others. I pulled it out and the 30 and 87 terminals (this is a 4 pin relay numbered 53) had burn marks near their bases. I called the local parts store and it is listed in their system as a dealer only part. It looks like I'll be waiting until Monday to see if my prediction is correct.

To answer the above question, no the car will not start with the ignition switch alone. In order to make it run, I put the key in the run position and then activate the starter solenoid with a switched jumper wire from the positive battery terminal.

ahaus · February 14th, 2009, 14:36

I in fact did have the problem narrowed down, but it wasn't the relay that was faulty. Instead it was the connection of the relay into it's connector that was bad. I figured this out after I bought a new relay from autozone; it turns out that they don't carry the anti-theft starter lock relay but they do carry the fog light relay which in my case was the same per the Bentley. I installed the new relay and turned the key to the start postion only to have the relay do the same quick on-off almost buzzing as the old one did. Being slightly perturbed I wiggled the relay while still holding the key in the start position and sure enough the car started right up. Given this I reinstalled my old relay and sure enough it started right up with the key. I guess the darkened terminals were no indication of a faulty relay to begin with. Next up is to fix the relay connections so that I don't have to pull my dash apart to get my car to start with the key!

Thank you all for the replies. I hope that what I've discovered can help someone else along the way.