TDI Heater problems ... ?

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SuburbanTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2004
Location
Midwest
TDI
Beetle TDI, and two Jetta TDI
I had my TDI heater installed recently and now I get a coolant error light after most, but not all, engine starts.

This error, by the book, requires an immediate engine shutdown and dealer diagnostic.

Has anyone else encountered new problems after a TDIHeater install?

I do seem to be able to pause and restart and get around the initial failure - but still I would be more comfortable without the failure and idiot light in the first place.
 
johnnloki

johnnloki

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 24, 2007
Location
bowmanville ON
TDI
04 Golf TDI
Coolant error means one of three things- the level is too low, the coolant is too hot, or both.

First thing to check is your coolant levels (somewhat obvious, I guess).

Maybe you've installed the heater too close to the temperature sensor, so it's showing as overheating for a brief few seconds, but then the coolant runs through the system after the startup and normalizes temps? Just a theory, but that seems to fit with your circumstances.

If you take the car to the stealer, though. they'll take the heater out, claim the TDIHeater is defective and is the source of your troubles and offer you theirs for 7 or 8 or so hundred installed.
 
LNXGUY

LNXGUY

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 10, 2004
Location
Barrie, Ont, Canada
TDI
'05 Jetta TDI Wagon
With the extra volume of the heater, you might have just lower the level enough for the dummy light to go off.

You can run the car without the cap on the overflow bottle in order to purge air in the system if there is any.
 
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SuburbanTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2004
Location
Midwest
TDI
Beetle TDI, and two Jetta TDI
Light goes on within a second or two after startup - and I'm not using the heater yet.

The light then will go off after turning the car off and on a couple of times, and will stay off.

As to low level, the level looks good and was topped off after installation.
 
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gern_blanston

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 3, 2002
Location
PNW
TDI
Golf, '03, Silver
You might try running it for a few minutes with the cap off the reservoir, just to make sure.
 
2

251

TDI Owner/Operator
Joined
May 11, 2002
Location
NW IN
TDI
2015 Passat TDI SEL
SuburbanTDI said:
Light goes on within a second or two after startup - and I'm not using the heater yet.

As to low level, the level looks good and was topped off after installation.
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You mean you didn't even test run the heater? :confused: :eek: Hope you remember to check the coolant level once in awhile during winter as the heater does use a small amount of coolant. By the time spring comes you'll most likely need to add a small amount of coolant - this is perfectly normal with regular useage.
 
black_and_chrome

black_and_chrome

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 28, 2004
Location
Montreal, Quebec, Canada
TDI
Black Jetta 2005
gern_blanston said:
How does the heater use coolant? I may learn something tonight.
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Good question... I recently installed one and I can not see how you could louse any?

Great product BTW, so tired of freezing for the first 10 minutes... Instant heat is great! :D
 
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gern_blanston

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Joined
Dec 3, 2002
Location
PNW
TDI
Golf, '03, Silver
Yup. Of all the mods on the Golf, the E-codes and the TDIHeater are the only ones that I would consider mandatory. I'm kicking myself for waiting all those years.
 
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SuburbanTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2004
Location
Midwest
TDI
Beetle TDI, and two Jetta TDI
CoolWht said:
You mean you didn't even test run the heater? :confused: :eek: Hope you remember to check the coolant level once in awhile during winter as the heater does use a small amount of coolant. By the time spring comes you'll most likely need to add a small amount of coolant - this is perfectly normal with regular useage.
Click to expand...

I did test the unit - I just haven't begun to use it yet in production. I'm also curious to see why you think a properly installed heater would consume fluids, I can't see how that would be possible.
 
2

251

TDI Owner/Operator
Joined
May 11, 2002
Location
NW IN
TDI
2015 Passat TDI SEL
SuburbanTDI said:
I did test the unit - I just haven't begun to use it yet in production. I'm also curious to see why you think a properly installed heater would consume fluids, I can't see how that would be possible.
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My statement about the heater using coolant is based on personal experiences in my car and a few friends who also run the heater - been two years now at least for us since installation so we're not new to running the heater. Don't misunderstand me either - while it does use up a little coolant it's a small amount but enough to hit the 'min' mark on the coolant reservoir by the end of winter with daily use of heater here in the upper midwest. If you do nothing in regards to checking the coolant level when it drops low enough it'll trigger a CEL. I like to check mine visually now and then during the winter and it only takes a few seconds so it's worth the effort to do so IMO.

Doesn't matter if it's the TDI Heater or Standheizung heater - they both use a little coolant by the time spring arrives. I know firsthand as I have both installed on my TDI.

One of my friends and myself feel that the heater itself probably heats up the coolant to the point where a tiny portion evaporates. This is just speculation on our part with no attempt made to scientifically prove/disprove this theory. All we know for sure is that by the end of winter we needed to add a little more coolant to get it above the 'min' mark on the reservoir.

As I'm fortunate enough to be able to park by an outlet everyday at work I can tell you using the heater now to have an "instantly warmed up" motor gives me about 5 mpg more over a cold start on my commute home. :D
 
Joe_Meehan

Joe_Meehan

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Ohio USA
TDI
NB TDI, 2002.5, Silver
No car should USE coolant. It may leak a little and maybe that is what is happening.
 
Bob_Fout

Bob_Fout

Oil Wanker
Joined
Sep 5, 2004
Location
Indiana
TDI
2003 Jetta - Alaska Green (sold) / 2015 GTI 2.0T
CoolWht said:
My statement about the heater using coolant is based on personal experiences in my car and a few friends who also run the heater - been two years now at least for us since installation so we're not new to running the heater. Don't misunderstand me either - while it does use up a little coolant it's a small amount but enough to hit the 'min' mark on the coolant reservoir by the end of winter with daily use of heater here in the upper midwest. If you do nothing in regards to checking the coolant level when it drops low enough it'll trigger a CEL. I like to check mine visually now and then during the winter and it only takes a few seconds so it's worth the effort to do so IMO.

Doesn't matter if it's the TDI Heater or Standheizung heater - they both use a little coolant by the time spring arrives. I know firsthand as I have both installed on my TDI.

One of my friends and myself feel that the heater itself probably heats up the coolant to the point where a tiny portion evaporates. This is just speculation on our part with no attempt made to scientifically prove/disprove this theory. All we know for sure is that by the end of winter we needed to add a little more coolant to get it above the 'min' mark on the reservoir.

As I'm fortunate enough to be able to park by an outlet everyday at work I can tell you using the heater now to have an "instantly warmed up" motor gives me about 5 mpg more over a cold start on my commute home. :D
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That would imply the coolant heater heats to more than 190*F, as we don't see evap from the normal coolant system that does heat to 190*F.

What temp does it heat the coolant to?
 
2

251

TDI Owner/Operator
Joined
May 11, 2002
Location
NW IN
TDI
2015 Passat TDI SEL
Joe_Meehan said:
No car should USE coolant. It may leak a little and maybe that is what is happening.
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There is NO sign of leakage - and yes, we've had the skidplate off and checked underneath periodically. By now you should know there are some things that just can't be explained on a VW! :eek: :p

From another thread that this topic was mentioned in briefly:

Originally Posted by CoolWht
Be advised if you run a heater that you want to check the level of your coolant from time to time as both Convert and I found the coolant level drops slightly over time. We had to add a little before winter was over. Other than that it's pretty much maintenance free.
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What he said.:D I looked for any leaks, and I'm sure CoolWht did and found none, so the only explination that I have is that the heater *might* boil some of the coolant nearest the heating coils at times, turning some of the coolant into a gas, hence the lower level over time. I needed to add 8 oz. or so of coolant near the end of winter. I plug mine in every night, so it sees quite a bit of use.
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If you want to see the actual thread go here:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=152506&page=22

and check out posts #324 through #327 so you can see I didn't pull the above quoted statements out of thin air.

Seriously Joe_Meehan - do you have one of these heaters installed and working on your TDI? If so, what have your experiences been with it in regards to the coolant level after a winter season of daily heater useage? Please enlighten the rest of us so we can compare notes.....
 
2

251

TDI Owner/Operator
Joined
May 11, 2002
Location
NW IN
TDI
2015 Passat TDI SEL
Bob_Fout said:
That would imply the coolant heater heats to more than 190*F, as we don't see evap from the normal coolant system that does heat to 190*F.

What temp does it heat the coolant to?
Click to expand...
I don't know. Upon start up after heater has been used temp gauge goes to 190 and no furthur which is normal operating temperaure. Like I said, just speculating here as to why the coolant level does drop slightly with daily use of the heater.
 
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gern_blanston

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Location
PNW
TDI
Golf, '03, Silver
My brother's been running one on his Jetta for a couple of years, and no loss whatsoever.
 
Joe_Meehan

Joe_Meehan

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Ohio USA
TDI
NB TDI, 2002.5, Silver
CoolWht said:
There is NO sign of leakage - and yes, we've had the skidplate off and checked underneath periodically. Seriously Joe_Meehan - do you have one of these heaters installed and working on your TDI? If so, what have your experiences been with it in regards to the coolant level after a winter season of daily heater useage? Please enlighten the rest of us so we can compare notes.....
Click to expand...
Just because you don't see a coolant leak, does not meant there is none. It may be in the heater core. A very small leak where it evaporates before you see it.

Yes I do use my heater every winter. In over 40 years of owning and driving cars, I have never experienced any coolant loss that was not due to a leak, and only two of those.

What do you think the heater is using the coolant for?

I do wish you luck, but keep in mind that one possible problem when you are loosing coolant and can't find where, you should check the oil to see if there is any indication of moisture (usually white scum). That can indicate a cracked head or a head gasket issue.
 
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