www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2014 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You



Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW MKV-A5 Golf/Jettas

VW MKV-A5 Golf/Jettas Discussions area for A5/MkV Jetta/Golf (2005/2006 PD and 2009 CR).

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 17th, 2007, 07:16   #1
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default A5 Jetta alignment specs? Alignment warranty??

My 06 TDI with 10K miles needs an alignment check. I believe my toe adjustment is off based on driveway checks I have performed as measured with a homemade tool I have used successfully on other cars (I believe it is actually toe'd out slightly). The symptom is my car tends to wander at hi-way speeds.

I have contacted two Houston area dealers and they both tell me that VW doesn't cover alignment unless the car pulls dramatically (which mine does not). One dealer said that VW doesn't cover alignment at all after you take delivery of the car!! I think this is ridiculous, but rather than make an issue of it I think I will just take the car to a shop I trust and work with often and have them check it. I will call them and make sure they have the adapters for the bead-less rims that my VW has. I want to make sure they use the right specs for the alignment. I have a copy of the Bentley paper manual, and I have attached a copy of the page of specs to this thread. It appears to show 10 deg +/- 10 minutes for total toe (which converts to 10 deg +/- 0.17 deg). I assume this is toe "in" that is specified. That seems like an huge amount of total toe! Also, there is a comment that says "wheels not pressed". Anyone know what that is referring to? By referring to the text in the manual, the "base" column would apply to my car.

Maybe someone has had their car aligned and knows the specs used? Also, if someone has the full Bentley CD who can verify that the specs listed here are correct? Any comments or experience would also be appreciated. Thanks.


bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2007, 07:51   #2
buckeye96
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Alexandria, VA
TDI(s): 2005 Jetta ?
Default

I have never known any dealer to warranty an alignment. Go get it fixed at a place you trust and not the dealer. Just be glad that you don't have an AWD car like the Subaru, that takes a 4 wheel alignment machine that not a lot of places have or are aware of.
buckeye96 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2007, 08:07   #3
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeye96
I have never known any dealer to warranty an alignment. Go get it fixed at a place you trust and not the dealer. Just be glad that you don't have an AWD car like the Subaru, that takes a 4 wheel alignment machine that not a lot of places have or are aware of.
Well, in my experience (with Hondas and Toyotas) the dealer would generally warrant the alignment for 1 year 12K miles. I have been able to go in and they would check it without complaining. The attitude of VW not being willing to even check it was a surprise to me - but this is my first VW. I however agree that I will just go to my own shop, but I want to confirm the specs before I do....
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2007, 08:31   #4
Jason D
Veteran Member
 
Jason D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: St. Louis
Default

Keep us posted. Have you changed the "adaptive steering" setting in VAG-COM or whatever VW calls it? Mine has been changed but the car still wanders a bit on grooved or uneven roads, which leads me to believe its a toe problem also.
__________________
2006 TDI-5 speed
1990 Mustang GT-Vortech @ 11 PSI
Jason D is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2007, 08:55   #5
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason D
Keep us posted. Have you changed the "adaptive steering" setting in VAG-COM or whatever VW calls it? Mine has been changed but the car still wanders a bit on grooved or uneven roads, which leads me to believe its a toe problem also.
Yes, I have reset that setting to "4" from the initial setting of "5" from the factory. That did make an improvement for sure, but only on what I call "driver induced wandering". When set at 5 any slight input to the wheel results in the car turning slightly. This made it hard to keep the car going straight. With it at 4 that type of wandering is no longer an issue. I also tried 3 but have settled on 4. But, I still have wandering due to road and wind that seem too pronounced, and that can easily be due to alignment settings.
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2007, 09:14   #6
Andrewh
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Allen, TX
Default

They checked mine for free a couple of times. I didn't think the steering wheel was tracking straight, so they claimed to have checked it.
Andrewh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2007, 19:11   #7
f1wanabe
Member
 
f1wanabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Easton, PA
Default

My dealer service manager told me the wandering is caused by the steering sensitivity setting. I had my steering sensitivity changed and it pretty much solved the wandering problem. I had it on "4" for a while, changed it to "3", but will ask them to put it back to "4". Be prepared for some dealers not to know anything about it, or not wanting to do it based on liability concerns. A member with a VAG COM may help as well. But, I am sure your alignment is just fine.
f1wanabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 00:52   #8
Mach1
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Spicewood, Tx.
Fuel Economy: 49.3, 48, 21.2,19.99
Default

I thought that front wheel drive were toed out, because as they start to drive the tires the suspension wants to pull "in".
__________________
http://www.rsbdiesel.com/

2006.5 DE DSG, RC2, Sunroof, Rear airbags, 73K miles, 61MPG best.
2005.5 Jetta-5 SP, LSD, Spec S2, 110K, 48 mpg every tank. Best-49.3 mpg-LOCAL. ELF 506 0-30W/15K OCI/37PPM FE, Best=740 MPT, RSB Diesel custom 2.5DP/3" SS exhaust, Synthetic fuel, Koni lowering springs. One of the first Mark V Jettas to hit the street. Pkg 1, MFD, Autowipe, Auto-headlights, Auto-dim mirror, auto-climate. 248C=150HP RC2
2004 6L 89000 19MPG
2000 7.3 388 HP-818 FT lbs Propane
Mach1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:48   #9
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f1wanabe
My dealer service manager told me the wandering is caused by the steering sensitivity setting. I had my steering sensitivity changed and it pretty much solved the wandering problem. I had it on "4" for a while, changed it to "3", but will ask them to put it back to "4". Be prepared for some dealers not to know anything about it, or not wanting to do it based on liability concerns. A member with a VAG COM may help as well. But, I am sure your alignment is just fine.
As discussed earlier in the thread, the steering sensitivity setting does effect the feel of the steering, and I have a VAG-COM and did try different settings also settling on 4. It does not however eliminate the tendency of the car to be heavily effected by wind and road textures, which is my current problem.
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 21st, 2007, 11:53   #10
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach1
I thought that front wheel drive were toed out, because as they start to drive the tires the suspension wants to pull "in".
That could be, but the specs that I posted from the Bentley paper manual above do not clearly state which it is. I would think that the manual would state whether it was toe in or out. Some (but not all) front drive cars do have toe out, but that is not always the case.

Is there anyone out there with the full Bentley manual on CD who can check the alignment specs and confirm what they are?? What is the toe supposed to be, and does it state toe in or out??
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 23rd, 2007, 03:17   #11
Mach1
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Spicewood, Tx.
Fuel Economy: 49.3, 48, 21.2,19.99
Default

From the specs above 10 degrees...which would be 10 degrees toe out(as toe in would be negative)..

Most front wheel drives are toed positive(toe-out).
__________________
http://www.rsbdiesel.com/

2006.5 DE DSG, RC2, Sunroof, Rear airbags, 73K miles, 61MPG best.
2005.5 Jetta-5 SP, LSD, Spec S2, 110K, 48 mpg every tank. Best-49.3 mpg-LOCAL. ELF 506 0-30W/15K OCI/37PPM FE, Best=740 MPT, RSB Diesel custom 2.5DP/3" SS exhaust, Synthetic fuel, Koni lowering springs. One of the first Mark V Jettas to hit the street. Pkg 1, MFD, Autowipe, Auto-headlights, Auto-dim mirror, auto-climate. 248C=150HP RC2
2004 6L 89000 19MPG
2000 7.3 388 HP-818 FT lbs Propane
Mach1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 24th, 2007, 14:05   #12
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mach1
From the specs above 10 degrees...which would be 10 degrees toe out(as toe in would be negative)..

Most front wheel drives are toed positive(toe-out).
OK, assuming the Jetta is supposed to be toed out, I really doubt the listed spec of 10 deg total toe is correct. 10 deg would be an ENORMOUS amount of toe. Doing some quick trigonometry, that would be 5 deg per side. Assuming the diameter of each wheel and tire is about 24 inches tread to tread, then that would be result in about 2" of toe out per side!!! Most cars have about 1/16" - 1/8" toe in or out. There must be a misprint in the specs that I posted in the first post of this thread from the paperback Bentley manual.

Can someone with the full CD version of the Bentley manual check to see what the toe specs are for an 06 Jetta?
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 24th, 2007, 23:45   #13
DPM
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Newtownards, N. Ireland
Fuel Economy: 38.5- 47 Forester, 49-55 Peugeot
Default

"wheels not pressed" does that imply toe is to be measured with the wheels off the ground?
DPM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old June 7th, 2007, 08:18   #14
bondtimbond
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Houston Texas
Default Results of alignment

Well, I finally got my car into the alignment shop as I discussed that I would and the results are posted in this thread below. I am very happy with the results. The car now drives noticeable better at highway speeds. There is much less "twitchiness" than existed before. The car is also less affected by crosswind. Slight inputs to the steering wheel now do not result in the car darting off left or right like it did before. Overall, much improved. I recommend to anyone who isn't happy with the feel of their Jetta on the highway that you have your alignment checked, as your toe setting might be off also.

Regarding the specs that were used, the shops alignment computer system had a set of specs that the tech pulled up, and I compared them to those that I posted at the beginning of this thread which came from the Bentley hard copy manual. All the specs were exactly the same except that the front toe settings in the shops alignment computer were shown to be +0.17 deg toe in (basically the same as the rear) where the Bentley manual listed a confusing number that didn't make sense (10 deg toe!).

As you can see from the posted results which shows before and after (actual), my car was initially toed out in the front, not in. According to the experienced tech at this shop who is highly respected around here and also in another reference that I reviewed, positive toe represents toe in, not toe out. I questioned the tech on this since I have heard (in this thread for example) that front drive cars should be toed out. His response was that some, but certainly not all front drive cars call for toe out. The spec sheets list all toe settings as positive, front and rear. The rear toe on my car was initially not too far off, just not equal left to right but at least it was positive. My rear camber was only slightly off, but the tech reset it anyway. Front camber and caster is not adjustable but were OK anyway.

Finally I enjoy long drives in my Jetta! :-)

__________________
____________________________________
2006 Jetta Mk5 June build Package 2 Auto
bondtimbond is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 16th, 2011, 11:05   #15
Henrick
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Ireland
Default

Sorry to reply to an old thread, but...

Any ideas on how to recover/repair/align an out-of-spec Caster and Camber?

My car's right side Caster and Camber are out of spec:
-Caster: Should be in range of 7*04' - 8*04' but mine's at 6*52'
-Camber: Should be in range of -1*00' - 0*00' but mine's at -1*10'
Henrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 22:58.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2014
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
1996 - 2013, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.17128 seconds with 9 queries
[Output: 122.14 Kb. compressed to 101.74 Kb. by saving 20.40 Kb. (16.70%)]