www.tdiclub.com

Economy - Longevity - Performance
The #1 Source of TDI Information on the Web!
Forums Articles Links Meets
Orders TDI Club Cards TDIFest 2016 Gone, but not forgotten VAG-Com List Unit Conversions TDIClub Chat Thank You




Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)

Upgrades (non TDI Engine related) The place of handling, lighting and other upgrades that do not relate to the performance or economy of the TDI engine. In other words upgrades to your TDI that don't fit into TDI Fuel Economy & TDI Engine Enhancements.Please note the Performance Disclaimer

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old July 27th, 2015, 13:52   #241
bokonan
Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Baltimore, Md.
Default

I found the first half of this thread interesting and useful. I learned a lot about the intent of the original designers of the Mk4 suspension and why they made the compromises they made. I was very interested in pursuing the GT concept and learning about which tweaks seem to work well and especially about any that do not. It seemed that a lot of valuable information was shared by Ceilidh and Peter Pyce and I'm wondering if they could be dragged back into this thread (kicking and screaming?) Basic handling was discussed along with geometry explanations and the pros and cons of most of the usual things that get done to cars because people think they will make them zoomier. Recently Air-Lift has introduced a "performance" kit for Mk4s which allows people to have their cars appear to lay on the ground (I'm too old to understand why unless it is considered funny) but this kit allows you to adjust both front and rear ride height and have adjustable damping too along with adjustable spring rates. This all sounds almost too good to be true so I'm hoping that a knowledgeable person (Ceilidh or Peter?) might know something about this in order to save me from spending my social security check on a useless product.

In my 2003 Jetta wagon I'm presently running about an inch of mechanical lift (I like fast dirt roads during hunting season) with Bilstein HDs and stock everything else and 225/45-17's. I can attest to what Ceilidh said previously about increasing the roll stiffness of the rear making the handling a bit "on edge" sometimes because I'm sometimes on Oliver's LeMons racing team and his 86 Golf can be a bit of a handful of oversteer at times (but it's OK because it's a race car). I grew up on air cooled rear engined cars and always thought oversteer was normal so it hasn't caught me out (yet).
bokonan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 8th, 2015, 18:10   #242
kfdunn
Newbie
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Belmont, NC
Default

I'm firmly in the #4 category. After springing for a coilover (NJT kit from ECS) 12/2014, I was happy with the "go-kart" handling, but not so much with the "go-kart" ride. No amount of tuning or tire pressures could remedy the situation.

Last weekend (9/2015) I installed Koni FSDs with Eibach sport springs from IDParts (learned about them from this forum - THANKS). The ride is not as low, but the handling is every bit as good (absent the "dartiness" of the previous setup).

Some technical observations about the NJTs: I'm not sure of the spring rate at ride height, but conservatively, it's double the OEM rate (and I could easily believe it's triple); the damping required to control that results in essentially a solid suspension, i.e. the tires become the principal springs. Further, with the addition of a rear anti-roll bar (Eibach 25mm) I could induce oversteer by decelerating in turns (I'm old enough to remember driving Porsche 911s in the 70s...).

I can't say enough positive about the new setup though. I was looking to turn my 2005 Jetta TDI handling & ride height to roughly the equivalent of a GTI Mk4. SUCCESS. BTW, I've also changed to tires: 225/45/17s & offset to near the body edge so the geometry is roughly that of said GTI, too.

Thanks for all the comments and discussion; it helped my decision. I'm posting here in hopes someone can benefit from my experiences, too. Oh... and if anybody wants the NJT set, I'm happy to unload it. Just be sure that "go-kart" is the effect you want!

-Ken
kfdunn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 8th, 2015, 20:12   #243
darkhorse
Veteran Member
 
darkhorse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Fuel Economy: mid 40's
Default

I've run with Koni FSD's for several years now. I love the handling & ride.
__________________
'06 Golf GLS 5 speed, Evo skid plate, Koni FSD's with Shine RSS, SBC stage 3, SMF, KERMA custom tune, R 32 snorkel,PD 150 airbox,MAF,TIP & manifold, K3B,R 783's, Colt stage 2, EJ SMIC, piping by ID Parts, Whitbread 2.5" DP, Aero muffler, 3"KERMA SS pipes, Sigma 5 short shifter, .681 5th gear & Peloquin, Nicktane 1 um fuel filter & DG/Amsoil bypass filter.
darkhorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2016, 09:43   #244
Judson
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cheyenne, WY
TDI(s): 2001 Jetta
Default

Hey all -

I'm also looking at Koni FSDs. I have currently have HR sport springs and bilsteins. The sport springs make the ride too harsh around town, unfortunately.

So, I'm looking for something stock ride height, but something a little firmer than stock, but not as harsh as sport springs.

Anybody have any suggestions? Right now I'm leaning towards stock springs with the Koni FSDs, but I do like a planted feel around town. See my sig for details on bushings and wheels for the full picture.

Thanks in advance!

Jud.
__________________
2001 Jetta TDI, converted to manual, black leather/red stiching, PP520s, rc4, franko6 cam, 11mm pump, VNT 17, PD150 intake, EGR/cooler delete, 2.5" Buzzken exhaust, PD150 clutch/flywheel, DRW six-speed, Eurojet intercooler, 3bar MAP, FIS Cluster, Cupra bushings, Koni Reds/stock springs, Alpine iLX-207, foglights, Indiglo boost gauge, Longbeach wheels, Euro wood steering wheel, lift pump, Gentex autodim/homelink mirror.
Judson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2016, 09:57   #245
GoFaster
Moderator at Large
 
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Brampton, Ontario, Canada
Default

The Bilsteins are more likely the source of the harshness, unless you are hitting bump stops. If it is NVH - you feel every crack in the pavement, every pebble - it is more likely to be a combination of lack of tire/sidewall compliance together with too much low-speed compression damping.
__________________
Brian P.
formerly ... 2006 Jetta TDI 5-sp, Spice Red, Unitronics stage 1, 0.681 5th gear.
and before that ... 1996 Passat TDI, Silk Blue
GoFaster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2016, 10:06   #246
IndigoBlueWagon
TDIClub Enthusiast
Principal IDParts
Vendor
w/Business number
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: South of Boston
Fuel Economy: 50/45/37
Default

I agree. 17s and the Billy HDs are going to be harsh. I didn't even like them with 15s. FSDs are going to ride better, but are still on the firmer side in a MKIV sedan. If you're after a dramatically improved ride I'd suggest Reds.
__________________
2002 Jetta wagon, 373K, RC3+; 1993 Mercedes-Benz 300D 2.5, 197K; 1997 Passat, 286K; '99.5 Golf, 259K; 2011 335d, 56K; 2015 Golf Sportwagen, 10K. Principal, http://www.idparts.com
Kid's cars: 2002 Golf TDI, 2002 Jetta TDI
IndigoBlueWagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2016, 16:01   #247
tju317
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: California
TDI(s): VW Golf
Default

I have an MK6 Golf TDI 4 door DSG with about 36k miles. Will Koni FSD and VWR springs provide a minor drop of about 1" to 1.3"? Will the ride be similar to stock or better? The stock sport springs tend to ride rough over rough road and doesn't feel balanced. Is there anything else I should replace during installation? Thanks.
tju317 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 14th, 2016, 16:56   #248
IndigoBlueWagon
TDIClub Enthusiast
Principal IDParts
Vendor
w/Business number
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: South of Boston
Fuel Economy: 50/45/37
Default

I don't think R springs are a good replacement. Rs weigh more in the rear and ride height may not be what you want. And I don't think an R is a lot lower than a Golf TDI, which has springs that put it pretty close in ride height to a GTI.

If you want a better ride raise the car. Jetta Sedan or JSW springs in front, Sedan springs in back. That will bring it up about an inch, maybe more, and improve the ride dramatically. Anything that goes lower will end up harsher because the suspension has less travel.
__________________
2002 Jetta wagon, 373K, RC3+; 1993 Mercedes-Benz 300D 2.5, 197K; 1997 Passat, 286K; '99.5 Golf, 259K; 2011 335d, 56K; 2015 Golf Sportwagen, 10K. Principal, http://www.idparts.com
Kid's cars: 2002 Golf TDI, 2002 Jetta TDI
IndigoBlueWagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2016, 07:43   #249
Judson
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cheyenne, WY
TDI(s): 2001 Jetta
Default

Huh. So Koni Reds, eh? Should I bag the springs, or just keep them?

I plan to move to an H-rated tire. The current Michelins are V-rated, and also suck. Probably the worst Michelins I've bought. I do have a ton of NVH, but I've gone with larger rear brakes; only specific 16s fit, and it just isn't worth the hassle of changing.
__________________
2001 Jetta TDI, converted to manual, black leather/red stiching, PP520s, rc4, franko6 cam, 11mm pump, VNT 17, PD150 intake, EGR/cooler delete, 2.5" Buzzken exhaust, PD150 clutch/flywheel, DRW six-speed, Eurojet intercooler, 3bar MAP, FIS Cluster, Cupra bushings, Koni Reds/stock springs, Alpine iLX-207, foglights, Indiglo boost gauge, Longbeach wheels, Euro wood steering wheel, lift pump, Gentex autodim/homelink mirror.

Last edited by Judson; February 15th, 2016 at 07:46.
Judson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2016, 07:50   #250
IndigoBlueWagon
TDIClub Enthusiast
Principal IDParts
Vendor
w/Business number
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: South of Boston
Fuel Economy: 50/45/37
Default

I'd go back to stock springs. Big improvement in ride, little sacrifice in handling.
__________________
2002 Jetta wagon, 373K, RC3+; 1993 Mercedes-Benz 300D 2.5, 197K; 1997 Passat, 286K; '99.5 Golf, 259K; 2011 335d, 56K; 2015 Golf Sportwagen, 10K. Principal, http://www.idparts.com
Kid's cars: 2002 Golf TDI, 2002 Jetta TDI
IndigoBlueWagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old February 15th, 2016, 08:10   #251
Judson
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Cheyenne, WY
TDI(s): 2001 Jetta
Default

OK, thanks. I was thinking stock as well. Stock plus new bushings, plus new tires with softer sidewall, keep the 17s, Koni Reds. That should do it. Should be a hell of a lot quieter as well !
__________________
2001 Jetta TDI, converted to manual, black leather/red stiching, PP520s, rc4, franko6 cam, 11mm pump, VNT 17, PD150 intake, EGR/cooler delete, 2.5" Buzzken exhaust, PD150 clutch/flywheel, DRW six-speed, Eurojet intercooler, 3bar MAP, FIS Cluster, Cupra bushings, Koni Reds/stock springs, Alpine iLX-207, foglights, Indiglo boost gauge, Longbeach wheels, Euro wood steering wheel, lift pump, Gentex autodim/homelink mirror.
Judson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old April 7th, 2017, 02:52   #252
Bill21
Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: usa
TDI(s): Polo
Default

Thank you folks again so much for bringing this info here.
Bill21 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 15:23.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright - TDIClub Online LTD - 2017
Contact Us | Privacy Statement | Forum Rules | Disclaimer
TDIClub Online Ltd (TDIClub.com) is not affiliated with the VWoA or VWAG and is supported by contributions from viewers like you.
1996 - 2017, All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.16106 seconds with 9 queries
[Output: 108.59 Kb. compressed to 91.60 Kb. by saving 17.00 Kb. (15.65%)]