How-To: Using BioDiesel in PD-TDIs...

[mudshark]

Originally Posted by pdxbiogirl

I am trying to read as much as possible about the issues with PD engines and bio. This posting has the most detailed information on why it is not a good idea and I have not seen any countering information or much discussion about it.

Here's an active thread with some "countering information."

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=149339

There's plenty more, so keep reading...

[ALAND]

Wondering if power and or economy can be restored with a chip or software change? I've been scanning the site all night and haven't seen this discussed. RocketChip claims to have a chip that does something- but it's not really spelled out what it does and what the benefits are. Mainly I'd be looking to restore economy, (I can still squeak tires if I try), but I don't want to screw anything up and I don't want to make the car run poorly on Petro, since I'd need to use it occasionally. I guess I want it all...

[MarkWaddle]

i have been running B100 since my PD was new. i now have 33k and no problems except three glow plug replacements. i'm not sure what those were about. the car runs great and i recently got RocketChip stage 1+ programming and it is fantastic! the power comes on smooth and i'm getting like 1mpg more when i drive normally. i can't praise it enough! if you are considering chipping, just do it. it was $295 well spent. it seems ridiculously cheap for the gains now that i have it.

[GoFaster]

Originally Posted by ALAND

Wondering if power and or economy can be restored with a chip or software change?

In my case, no restoration of economy has been necessary.

I've been using B100 exclusively for the last 18,000 km, but it was not until the last fill-up where I ran through a full tank of biodiesel without any trailer towing and without using the A/C (which is a big mileage killer).

With petrodiesel and filled to the brim, normally it will do about 920 km give or take before the low fuel light comes on (best ever was about 947). On the last biodiesel fill-up, filled to the brim, the light came on at 928 km.

In my particular case, there's no meaningful difference in fuel consumption compared to standard diesel fuel.

[myke_w]

I've run b100 in my 05 PD since about 20k miles (has almost 50k now)
No problems other than slightly less mpg's 43 vs 46 or so with D2.

[ALAND]

Originally Posted by myke_w

I've run b100 in my 05 PD since about 20k miles (has almost 50k now)
No problems other than slightly less mpg's 43 vs 46 or so with D2.

So, you've lost 7% or so also. That's the amount I've been trying to explain. I've accounted for the other 3% due to inaccurate metering at our co-op's pump (discussed in other threads). I'm down to under 39 mpg on B100, even on the highway. On B20 this past winter, I was doing 43 average, high of 56 on a Jan roadtrip with no mountains or A/C.
I can't account for how many mpgs I lose due to A/C usage yet, since I only started using B100 this summer, I'm in North Carolina, and I have a pregnant wife. So, needless to say, we've used A/C pretty heavily.

GoFaster, you've been getting 45-46mpg on both, that's great! I guess in the Arctic you don't use much AC!
Mark, what are your numbers like? I guess you also don't need the air too much. Also, is the RocketChip Stage +1 the same as the "biodiesel" chip? And, have you ever had to run a tank of StinkyDiesel since you upgraded? If so, what happened?
Thanks Y'all!

[thermographer]

At 118K miles on my car, I thought I would share my bio-use.. although not heavy due to the lack of availability in our area.

I ran straight dino until 60K miles. Between 40K & 60K, my car smoked like a semi going uphill. It was embarrassing, plus my wife was on my case about stinking up the planet, etc. I found a 20% Pump on south-west OK while traveling, put in 10 gallons, and filled the rest with regular dino, smoke got worse on that tank, then stopped. Never seen it sense.

Last year, I found a 2% pump across the state and ran 7 tanks in a row. I did need to replace my cat 2 filter at the end of that run, however, it was 20K on the filter anyway, so I have no conclusion.
This past summer, working across the state again, I ran at least 5 tanks of B2 with a new cat 2 filter & have yet to change it.

Today, I found a new B20 pump 16 miles away from the house. I've PM'd Sunrg to make sure our Elf 507 test will not be affected, I'm going to ease into the B20 slowly, & being my car is 3/4 full anyway, I have no choice.

Thats my story, I'm sticking to it.
Kevin

[BioThomas]

Originally Posted by thermographer

Thats my story, I'm sticking to it.
Kevin

Just remember: anything you say can and will be used against you.

[CaJones]

Originally Posted by thermographer

At 118K miles on my car, I thought I would share my bio-use.. although not heavy due to the lack of availability in our area.

I ran straight dino until 60K miles. Between 40K & 60K, my car smoked like a semi going uphill. It was embarrassing, plus my wife was on my case about stinking up the planet, etc. I found a 20% Pump on south-west OK while traveling, put in 10 gallons, and filled the rest with regular dino, smoke got worse on that tank, then stopped. Never seen it sense.

Last year, I found a 2% pump across the state and ran 7 tanks in a row. I did need to replace my cat 2 filter at the end of that run, however, it was 20K on the filter anyway, so I have no conclusion.
This past summer, working across the state again, I ran at least 5 tanks of B2 with a new cat 2 filter & have yet to change it.

Today, I found a new B20 pump 16 miles away from the house. I've PM'd Sunrg to make sure our Elf 507 test will not be affected, I'm going to ease into the B20 slowly, & being my car is 3/4 full anyway, I have no choice.

Thats my story, I'm sticking to it.
Kevin

I can't believe this is true. Biodiesel is not good for your motor oil and engine, it dilutes your motor oil?
http://www.biofuelsforum.com/general...lters_dpf.html
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[mudshark]

Originally Posted by CaJones

I can't believe this is true. Biodiesel is not good for your motor oil and engine, it dilutes your motor oil?

The following is from a guy who is testing engine oil from cars running bio, and he says,

"I can tell you that we have measured several cars around our town and found zero to only trace amounts of (<3%) of biodiesel in the crankcase oil. This includes a car that runs b70 and had not changed the oil for 60K miles."

[TDIMeister]

3% is a lot!!!

[BioThomas]

Yeah, 3% is quite a bit. It would be interesting to know, though, how old these cars were, what kind of condition they were in, etc. Could it be that these were older cars with engines, that were not well maintained ?

I do not know all these reasons why bio would get into the crancase, but I am sure there are a lot. This is certainly not gonna discourage me from using B5 in my Jetta.

[mudshark]

I was surprised by the 3% number...

I'm participating in the study and have been sending him oil samples. I've asked him to let me know how much bio he's found in my oil and will post the info once I get it.

[SUNRG]

it's been a LONG time since i checked into this thread...

my 2004 Golf PD100 TDI has been running BioDiesel since new (B33 to B100) - 58,000+ miles.

i have also probably had more oil samples lab analyzed from this vehicle than anyone with a BioDiesel fueled TDI. never has a trace of fuel been found in my motor oil - not once.

in contrast, my use of BioDiesel has contributed to consistently low engine wear, as indicated by used motor oil lab analyses.

Below are all details regarding the 8 analyses on the ELF Evolution CRV 0w-30 506.01 oil that was in my 04 Golf PD-TDI including GRAPHS of V@100C and Fe Wear Rate.

The oil was performing optimally [equal to or better than new] after 16,004 miles of use...

the bottom line = clean, dry, well stored, high quality ASTM BioDiesel, treated with a comprehensive additive and blended conservatively with D2 for the climate in which it's being used - is a super-premium diesel fuel.

V@100C

1. 1. mile 228 - 10.2
   2. mile 2016 - 10.2
   3. mile 4319 - 10.3
   4. mile 8108 - 10.4
   5. mile 10042 - 10.6
   6. mile 12093 - 10.7
   7. mile 14125 - 10.6
   8. mile 16004 - 10.7

Oil Sample Interval / Fe Wear Rate

1. 1. mile 228 to mile 2016 / 2.79
   2. mile 2016 to mile 4319 / 0.00
   3. missed mile 6000 sampling
   4. mile 4319 to mile 8108 / 1.84
   5. mile 8108 to mile 10042 / 2.58
   6. mile 10042 to mile 12093 / 0.98
   7. mile 12093 to mile 14125 / 2.95
   8. mile 14125 to mile 16004 / 2.13

Fuel: is 66% common LSD (500ppm low sulfur diesel) / 33% ASTM Virgin Soy ULSBioD
OilFilter: OEM MANN

oil will be sampled and lab analyzed again at 18,000 miles. oil will stay in service until lab oil analysis results show that the oil is no longer functioning optimally (equal to or better than new oil).

all analyses are listed in their entirety below.

after 16,004 miles soot is approximately 0.21% (CAT tables were used to convert UFM # to % Allowable and then to the common Soot % by Weight). V@100C has gone from 10.2 to 10.7 - and increase of 0.5 cSt. both of these values are excellent.

[asabatelli]

What exactly does, "treated with a comprehensive additive" mean? I'm awaiting a new Jetta after totaling my 96 Passat TDI, and had been running b100 in the old car with no problems since April.