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VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) This is a general discussion about A4/MkIV Jetta (99.5-~2005), Golf(99.5-2006), and New Beetle(98-2006). Both VE and PD engines are covered here.

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Old May 7th, 2005, 17:56   #1
SKM348
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

Would periodic use of a fuel treatment product like Lucas help in reducing the egr/manifold soot problem that seems to plague these cars? Or, will just reving it hard a few times a day help the problem. I saw a post here of a guy who had very little soot buildup with lots of miles on the engine - all he did was 'floor it' a few times a day. I'm not technical enough to do the CCV mods that some here have done but it also seems there is no clear conclusion that those mods will eliminate the problem. If you pay $400-$500 every few years for a egr/manifold cleaning you'll negate all the savings from the high MPG! I love my Golf but if I had known how much TLC our engines need I may have considered something else..Are there any other solutions?
Thanks
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Old May 8th, 2005, 03:37   #2
TornadoRed
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

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I'm not technical enough to do the CCV mods that some here have done but it also seems there is no clear conclusion that those mods will eliminate the problem. If you pay $400-$500 every few years for a egr/manifold cleaning you'll negate all the savings from the high MPG!
Reducing the soot from the EGR, plus reducing the oil mist from the CCV, are the two things you can do to minimize intake clogging. Your 2003-model TDI may benefit from the EGR mod -- it's easy for anyone with VAGCOM to dial back the EGR cycle. And surely there's someone in Tennessee with VAGCOM who can help you out.

Just as babying your engine can lead to more intake clogging, running it harder can keep the intake cleaner, longer.

If you're getting oil in the intake from the CCV, that gives soot something to stick to and mix with. There are a number of inexpensive solutions to the CCV problem.

Finally, the fuel itself is not a direct cause of intake clogging. So a fuel additive, by itself, will not solve the problem. That said, you should still use a good fuel additive on a regular basis. Primrose 405 is my choice, because it's good and it's cheap (about 30 cents per tank of fuel).
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Old May 8th, 2005, 08:25   #3
SKM348
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

Thanks TR - are there any 'how-to's for the EGR mod and will it solve the problem versus doing the CCV setup? Are there any side-effects from adjusting the EGR?
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Old May 8th, 2005, 10:32   #4
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

The EGR mod has to be done utilizing the VAG-COM program and cable.

You can install some form of CCV filter to catch a lot of the oil. Old Navy CCV (no longer available)or it's clone from Canada, or a Provent filter system.

Something you can do for cheap is to put a .410 gauge shotgun brass or copper brush in the bore of the CCV valve. This allows some oil to condense from the vapors and drip back into the valve cover. Just cut to length, shove it in there, and fuhgittaboutit.
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Old May 8th, 2005, 10:36   #5
TornadoRed
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

Quote:
Thanks TR - are there any 'how-to's for the EGR mod and will it solve the problem versus doing the CCV setup? Are there any side-effects from adjusting the EGR?
I had the EGR mod done at a GTG. It was about 18 months ago, I think Peter Pyce was the one who did it for me, and it took him all of about 3 minutes. So it's simple to do, but I didn't do it myself.

[correction]Peter may have checked my timing in adaptation, but it was Denis from Chula Vista who did the EGR mod a few weeks earlier than the Capistrano GTG.

Will it solve the problem? Dunno. It reduces the percentage of time that the EGR valve lets the recirculated gases into the intake. So it doesn't cut it to zero.

Some folks have replaced the EGR with the Oldman Race Pipe. No EGR, but also no anti-shudder valve. And often a CEL except on the older TDIs (2000 and earlier?) Some folks have modified their EGR (this is called the Stealth RacePipe), but again a CEL is likely except on the older models. Finally, some have disconnected the vacuum actuator and plugged it with a golf tee. All of these fixes eliminate the soot part of the problem.

Are there any side-effects? Some report lower fuel mileage, most report no change to fuel mileage. So the answer is, probably not.
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Old May 8th, 2005, 20:21   #6
Deezleer
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Default Re: Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold cloggi

It's difficult to say if a fuel additive will do anything (except for fuel gell prevention).
I religiously used Stanadyne Performance Formula during the first 60,000 miles in my 1994 6.5L Diesel but I did not use ANY additives for the last 80,000 miles.

I have 140,000 miles on my Suburban now. The Injection pump failed at about 60,000 miles. The replacement is still going strong.

I could conclude that the additive *caused* the failure at 60,000! I didn't though....I just think it didn't do anything except cost me about $50+ tax per case.


Oh by the way....It's still not clogged. Intake clogging is caused by mixing oil vapor with exhaust soot. (period)

VW is the cause. NOT THE FUEL, or driving habits, or anything else. VW designed an EGR system that mixes oil vapor with soot and then tries to to ingest it into the intake system.

On the way to the engine this mixture condenses on the intake manifold and stays. That's it! NO additive will fix this. You have to either remove the oil vapor, or the soot, or both. It will be difficult or impossible to remove the vapor. (any high compression engine produces vapor from oil blow-by. Aircraft engines have always had this problem. It is reduced by installing a oil separator....it's not eliminated completely. Most aircraft engines are 10:1 compression ratios or less) Engines with higher compression ratios are going to produce oil vapor.
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Old May 10th, 2005, 06:45   #7
03_01_TDI
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Default Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold clogging?

Quote:
Would periodic use of a fuel treatment product like Lucas help in reducing the egr/manifold soot problem that seems to plague these cars? <font color="blue"> None to very very little </font> Or, will just reving it hard a few times a day help the problem. <font color="blue">yes </font> I saw a post here of a guy who had very little soot buildup with lots of miles on the engine - all he did was 'floor it' a few times a day. I'm not technical enough to do the CCV mods that some here have done but it also seems there is no clear conclusion that those mods will eliminate the problem. <font color="blue">If your close to Georgia shoot me a PM </font> If you pay $400-$500 every few years for a egr/manifold cleaning you'll negate all the savings from the high MPG! I love my Golf but if I had known how much TLC our engines need I may have considered something else..Are there any other solutions?
Thanks
Send your ECM to www.rocketchip.com and get the ASV conversion. This will turn the EGR system OFF. It will decrease the chance of a clogged intake by 99% if not 100%. I've got the conversion on both of my TDI's.

A simple 25.00 CCV mod/filter will trap about 1-3oz of oil every 3k miles.
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Old May 10th, 2005, 06:47   #8
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Default Re: Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold cloggi

Quote:
VW is the cause. NOT THE FUEL, or driving habits, or anything else. VW designed an EGR system that mixes oil vapor with soot and then tries to to ingest it into the intake system.

On the way to the engine this mixture condenses on the intake manifold and stays. That's it! NO additive will fix this. You have to either remove the oil vapor, or the soot, or both. It will be difficult or impossible to remove the vapor. (any high compression engine produces vapor from oil blow-by. Aircraft engines have always had this problem. It is reduced by installing a oil separator....it's not eliminated completely. Most aircraft engines are 10:1 compression ratios or less) Engines with higher compression ratios are going to produce oil vapor.
Also some oil is introduced to the intake by the turbo oil seals. So the best method is to do away with the heat aka the EGR.
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Old May 10th, 2005, 18:39   #9
Dorado
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Default Re: Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold cloggi

Fuel quality and the use of additives to increase cetane is important. Our 2002 TDI will not ever have a clogged intake because it's been running mostly on biodiesel, which substantially reduces smoke and soot. And I have a fully working EGR.

In contrast, I understand that folks in our area that have seen their TDI's "clogged solid" in as little as 40k miles have not put any though to the quality of the diesel fuel they are filling up with.
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Old May 11th, 2005, 05:11   #10
delste
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Default Re: Lucas Fuel additive reduce EGR/Manifold cloggi

Any update on the biodiesel plant on Neville Island? How much are you paying for biodiesel in Export?
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