03' Jetta 5spd - getting into 5th gear sometimes notchy

03TDICommuter · Oct 6, 2018

03' Jetta 5 spd, 350K miles (bought it with 315K). Was always dealer serviced. New clutch put in by previous owner before he sold it to me.
For me shifting has always been butter smooth but starting about 6 mos ago sometimes when I shift into 5th gear and let out the clutch I'm really in neutral. I shift again and it's fine. Lately I've been paying more attention to the problem and what I feel is that I'm getting past the syncros but the last motion to couple the slider is a little blocked sometimes. I have to make a mental note to feel that it's really in before letting out the clutch. The whole motion is not 1 smooth event but more like 3 steps. Sometimes it's perfectly normal feeling. Seems to be worse when hot.

Anyone experienced this? Is my 5th gear slider/gear worn? (I have no whirring noises nor 5th gear pop out). Maybe my linkage is getting sloppy and needs adjustment? All other gears feel fine.
Thanks for your help - I'm sure someone has run into this problem before.

Dave

WildChild80 · Oct 6, 2018

It sounds like your bushings are about gone, diesel geek has a fantastic kit that'll tighten it right up.

I also run motul gear 300 75/90 and that helped mine shift better

Can you replicate it in your driveway? You could rule out bushings if it's not engaging the shift tower properly. Or you could have someone hold the shift weight/tower while you move the shifter and see if it feels sloppy

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03TDICommuter · Oct 6, 2018

WildChild80 said:
It sounds like your bushings are about gone, diesel geek has a fantastic kit that'll tighten it right up.

I also run motul gear 300 75/90 and that helped mine shift better

Can you replicate it in your driveway? You could rule out bushings if it's not engaging the shift tower properly. Or you could have someone hold the shift weight/tower while you move the shifter and see if it feels sloppy

Good question - I haven't tried it in the driveway, only when driving. When driving and going into 5th I can feel it bump up on the 5th gear syncro and get past it but the last motion where it finally engages is notchy, almost like the syncro isn't lining up with the 5th gear dogs - but not always and not when cold.

Thanks for the info on the Diesel Geek bushing set - just watched the video on it.

mrfiat · Oct 6, 2018

I had notchy shifting in my 2003 sedan and put fresh transmission oil in it and the problem went away. I was having problems in 2nd and 3rd gear though, not 5th.

WildChild80 · Oct 6, 2018

I bought a 1 owner 2000 TDI with 297k on the clock and when it was warm I could barely get it in first, put gear 300 in it and it's been perfect ever since.

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03TDICommuter · Oct 6, 2018

WildChild80 said:
I bought a 1 owner 2000 TDI with 297k on the clock and when it was warm I could barely get it in first, put gear 300 in it and it's been perfect ever since.

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I have 3 bottles of Redline MTL on the shelf for a car I ended up getting rid of. Anyone know if MTL is correct for this trans?

WildChild80 · Oct 7, 2018

I think I've read about some folks using it

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Genesis · Oct 7, 2018

Which weight on the Redline? They make more than one weight in MTL. I run Redline in my Mazda 6 MTX and it improved shifting materially over the stock Mazda fluid, especially when cold -- same weight though. It was the only aftermarket GL-4 (never put GL-5 rated gear oil in an MTX unless the gearbox is specifically rated for it, and basically none of them are!) in the correct weight I could find.

AndyBees · Oct 7, 2018

5th gear is the first to suffer when the tranny gets low on oil. Also, since the car is in 5th gear far more than any of the other gears, the slider and hub wear is much faster. Thus, alignment of the slider and synchro rings become problematic resulting in those notchy shifts.

As others have suggested, try a different oil.

Herm TDI · Oct 7, 2018

On these MK-4's they're now showing their age .
when it comes to 5Sp transmission shifting issues I tell my owners there are three (3) things to do BEFORE you do anything else.
A) Replace the transmission shifter bushings 1J0-711-067-L (qty. 2)

http://pics.tdiclub.com/showfull.php?photo=114922
B) Replace the trans gear oil. 2 Qt. VW gear oil G 070-726-A2
C) Adjust the shift cables
This will resolve about 99% of shifter issues on the MK-3 & MK-4's
If you do this and you're still having shifter issues the last thing to replace is the shift tower bushings:
https://www.idparts.com/shifter-tower-bushing-repair-kit-a4-p-2281.html

03TDICommuter · Oct 7, 2018

Genesis said:
Which weight on the Redline? They make more than one weight in MTL.

It's just plain MTL which I read is 75w80

AndyBees said:
5th gear is the first to suffer when the tranny gets low on oil. Also, since the car is in 5th gear far more than any of the other gears, the slider and hub wear is much faster. Thus, alignment of the slider and synchro rings become problematic resulting in those notchy shifts.
As others have suggested, try a different oil.

Thanks Andy. I'm assuming it has a factory fill in it but not sure. Previous owner had everything done at the dealer including the clutch replacement but I don't see a receipt for the clutch to know what they filled it with. Will likely put the MTL in it as that I have on hand.

Herm TDI said:
A) Replace the transmission shifter bushings 1J0-711-067-L (qty. 2)
B) Replace the trans gear oil. 2 Qt. VW gear oil G 070-726-A2
C) Adjust the shift cables.

Thanks. I was reading on the DieselGeek page that those bushings are usually not bad but all the others in there are (shifter, slider, etc). Will order one of their shifter bushing kits as it has everything on the inside including the alignment pin.
First I'll be putting in the MTL as that I already have.

Genesis · Oct 7, 2018

The MTL will be fine and may help quite a bit. It makes a material difference in my Mazda.

I run VW oil in my TDI and haven't had a reason to switch as of yet (~250k miles.)

AndyBees · Oct 7, 2018

For what it is worth, the OE 5th in my 2000 Jetta was only slightly "notchy" going into 5th gear and mostly it was a "now and then" thingy. At the time, I never gave it any thought other than prolly just all the miles. Heck, I'd never changed-out the OE oil.

So, one day without warning, at a little over 291k miles just driving along on a long flat straight-way at about 55 MPH, bam, it jumped out of 5th gear. I immediately put it back in 5th. In less than a half mile it jumped out again. Finally, after several more attempts putting it back in 5th, it would not stay in gear. In fact, I could not hold it in gear.

Well, until I found another tranny or OE replacement gear, I ran a gasser 5th gear for about 5k miles.

The OE oil looked like mud... brownish butterscotch with a grease like texture. Prolly had some water contamination.

Anyway, over the course of "rehabbing" the tranny, I first flushed it with some regular 85w-90 Dino oil.... for about 500 miles. Then, I followed by flushing with some old OE "settled" oil for about 1500 miles. And, then I did a couple more flushes with the regular Dino stuff. Then, when I finally got a good used OE gear, I used OE oil and have changed it twice since. The tranny is now up to 371k miles and shifts fine.

03TDICommuter · Oct 7, 2018

AndyBees said:
I used OE oil and have changed it twice since. The tranny is now up to 371k miles and shifts fine.

Good info Andy. The previous owner was very good with his cars, which is why I didn't think buying it with 315K on the odometer was a bad idea - I knew he took care of it and I knew he always had the dealer do the oil changes.

I cannot imagine he didn't have the gearbox oil changed but I can't find it in the stack of receipts he gave me

I did order 2 qts of the G070726A2 oil from IDParts (they have the least expensive shipping). Will change out the oil next weekend and flip a coin for MTL or the G070726A2.

I see a lot of people run the Pennzoil Syncromesh. I ran that in my Geo Metro with 519K miles on the original trans. Never was happy that the oil - always looked golden metallic even after I changed out the synchros. Don't think I'll use that in the Jetta.

AndyBees · Oct 7, 2018

I recently changed the oil in the Vanagon tranny. I used the Pennzoil Syncromesh in it for the first time. I'm a bit concerned whether or not the Syncromesh will provide adequate lube to the Diff and Ring & Pinion. I rebuilt and upgraded that tranny with over a $1,100 in parts from Weddle. I've changed the oil in it at least 6 times in 82k miles with most of the changes up front and within the first 25k miles.

The Syncromesh doesn't have a weight rating on the bottle (or did miss that). It does appear to be quite thin.

jokila · Oct 8, 2018

AndyBees said:
For what it is worth, the OE 5th in my 2000 Jetta was only slightly "notchy" going into 5th gear and mostly it was a "now and then" thingy. At the time, I never gave it any thought other than prolly just all the miles. Heck, I'd never changed-out the OE oil.

So, one day without warning, at a little over 291k miles just driving along on a long flat straight-way at about 55 MPH, bam, it jumped out of 5th gear. I immediately put it back in 5th. In less than a half mile it jumped out again. Finally, after several more attempts putting it back in 5th, it would not stay in gear. In fact, I could not hold it in gear.

Well, until I found another tranny or OE replacement gear, I ran a gasser 5th gear for about 5k miles.

The OE oil looked like mud... brownish butterscotch with a grease like texture. Prolly had some water contamination.

Anyway, over the course of "rehabbing" the tranny, I first flushed it with some regular 85w-90 Dino oil.... for about 500 miles. Then, I followed by flushing with some old OE "settled" oil for about 1500 miles. And, then I did a couple more flushes with the regular Dino stuff. Then, when I finally got a good used OE gear, I used OE oil and have changed it twice since. The tranny is now up to 371k miles and shifts fine.

I had that same kind of nasty brownish lube too. Had a worn out shift tower bushings that caused so much free play that it wore the shift tower seal allowing water to enter.

That in turned cause the reverse light switch tip to wear prematurely. I had replaced it a few years back not knowing what had caused it.

03TDICommuter · Oct 14, 2018

Changed the trans fluid today. Old fluid was clean and clear but maple colored. Was only able to put about 1.6L of G070 back into it before it started coming out the fill hole. Not sure what was in it before but seemed a little thicker than the G070 that went in.

Hopefully this helps with the 5th gear issues.

jokila · Oct 15, 2018

03TDICommuter said:
Changed the trans fluid today. Old fluid was clean and clear but maple colored. Was only able to put about 1.6L of G070 back into it before it started coming out the fill hole. Not sure what was in it before but seemed a little thicker than the G070 that went in.

Hopefully this helps with the 5th gear issues.

Sounds like it was low on gear oil. This is really part of the problem of 5h gear wear out people experience. Low fluid level over time is not going to be noticeable.

03' Jetta 5spd - getting into 5th gear sometimes notchy

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