Fuel filter change without VAGcom

Bulldogger

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2011
Location
NY
TDI
2012 Golf killed by the dealer. 2014 Beetle given as replacement
This is a funny topic. Everyone here wants to change their own filters but doesn't want to spend $250 on the VCDS. I would think you are changing your filters at home to keep it out of the hands of the dealer or too save money.
Yet $250 seems too much to spend when the VCDS allows you to read and clear codes, prime the fuel filter in a few seconds, program new sensors that may have to be installed at some point and allows you too make adjusts to MFD fuel calculation, speed adjustment for different size tires, hill hold, adjustments to fuel gauge needle and to data log to find problems......... Yet 250 is too much when one visit to the dealer will well exceed that. Interesting
 

lawnarjax

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 5, 2009
Location
Jacksonville Fl
TDI
2015 GSW TDI SEL, 2006 Jeep Liberty CRD, 1994 Safari Trek (Isuzu 4BD2TC)
Fear is the mind killer...

The business model of any service based operations is to convince you that the service they offer you is either too complex or inconvenient for you to complete for yourself. To make you fearful.

Have no fear, approach this as a evaluation of the value of your time and you will do some work and have a mechanic do other work. The fuel filter change took me 30 minutes the first time I did it. Next time it will take half that. The dsg fluid change was something I was sure I could do in 4 hours, but my personal time was valued higher than the cost for the dealer to do it, so they got the job.
 

Bulldogger

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 20, 2011
Location
NY
TDI
2012 Golf killed by the dealer. 2014 Beetle given as replacement
There is also this: the fuel pump on the side of the engine feeds the HPFP directly. After the HPFP the fuel then goes to the filter on the low pressure side and to the tank from the high pressure side of the HPFP. When you do a filter change you remove the fuel from the bottom of the HPFP which is where the lower pressure return line is. The bottom of the HPFP is where the cam lobes and roller bearing are. On start up the car will run fine but there is no fuel in the bottom of the HPFP and it's only source of lubrication is the fuel. By not running the pumps and purging the bottom of the pump of air, and filling it with fuel, you get cavitation and possibly more wear then if it was filled with fuel. By simply running the pumps you purge out the air. That is why when you run the pumps you hear the air in the system getting pushed out of the pump and back into the tank.
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
I don't see how a filter change could possibly remove fuel from the hpfp.
 

jku72

Active member
Joined
Feb 28, 2011
Location
Cornville, Maine
TDI
2011 sportwagen
I have changed my fuel filter about 4 times so far. You don't need to do anything except take out the old one slowly, and put the new one in slowly. If it's more than 2/3rds full, there isn't going to be an issue.
I've never in my life taken a car to a dealer and had the problem I came in for fixed. But they always, without fail, tell me I have to replace some other part or another that will cost over a grand.
Example 1: Took my '11 JSW to a dealer on a road trip to diagnose and fix not so cold AC. 10 minutes later they quote me $1,000 to replace a compressor. I walk out, surf the net, buy some gauges, and add refridgerant on my own for $100 including tools. Problem fixed. Been working great for 2 years since.
Example 2: Take my '11 JSW in to find an issue with the front end, been eating up tires. I specifically ask to check the whole front end over to check for anything broken because I thought something was damaged, since whatever happened caused my tires to wear out after a thousand miles, and the handling was bad. . Dealer comes back and says my tires were bad, and that was causing the problem. They said they checked it all over and i just needed new tires. Charged my $150 just to look at it. I took it home and lifted it up, and in about a minute saw that the crossmember was cracked.
Example 3: 2006 Toyota; at 20,000 miles, wife went into a snowbank, and bent the brackets on the power steering pump, which caused the serp belt to flip over. Told them the brackets were bent, and to realign the pump. They came back and quoted me $2500 for a new power steering pump, new oil pan, new transmission pan, and all new AC lines. Of course they told me how dangerous it was, and told me warranty would be voided if I didn't pay them to fix all that stuff. I told them to F off, and took a pry bar and re-aligned the pump myself, doing nothing else to the car, and drove it a further 140,000 miles before the wife crashed it again, totalling it.
I'm trying to think of an example where I took my car to a dealer that didn't try to inflate the bill, or just take my money for doing nothing. Ah yes, back in 2004 I had a transmission wire harness replaced on an 2002 Ford F250, and they did a good job and didn't try to rip me off. Of course that was warranty, so who knows if they ripped off FO MO CO instead.
I wish it weren't true, but IMO, the dealer is the absolute worst place to bring any car for service.
 

cd_booth

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2012
Location
Brighton, Michigan
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI DSG
For what's it worth I've changed my fuel filter with both methods. Prior to having VCDS I had no issues, started right up every time. On the other hand, there's been two occasions now where I primed with VCDS and had a long crank. The latest change took two long crank attempts to start.

This is on a car that has had 0 issues. Doesn't seem to make sense.
 

Tarbe

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 20, 2002
Location
USA
TDI
Touareg and Sportwagon Sold to VW
When you do a filter change you remove the fuel from the bottom of the HPFP which is where the lower pressure return line is.

Did you just make this up?

You aren't trying to make yourself feel better about dealer FF changes, or having purchased VCDS...are you? :D
 

Bulldogger

Veteran Member
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Sep 20, 2011
Location
NY
TDI
2012 Golf killed by the dealer. 2014 Beetle given as replacement
Did you just make this up?
You aren't trying to make yourself feel better about dealer FF changes, or having purchased VCDS...are you? :D
Fuel system is under vacuum at the filter housing when operating. You open up the fuel filter to change it, air enters the system. The fuel runs to the HPFP first then to the filter housing. If the HPFP didn't loose fuel why would you sometimes get a stall after changing the filter? Stall is from air in the system and no fuel. Technically being the system has the fuel filter after the HPFP, then changing the filter should never cause a stall and we know this is not the case. When you run the VCDS you remove air from the lines and restore vacuum back into the system. Do you need the VCDS? no plenty of people do it with out. The HPFP's are considered a weak point, some fail some don't. Whether it is a lubrication issue, design or allowing it to run dry air in system is still is open for debate. Cavitation in the HPFP is not good and the the VCDS or manually running the pumps is the only real way to romove air and get the vacuum back into the system. Remember injector pressure can be over 26,000 psi which puts a pretty heavy load on the HPFP.
 
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turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
Yes, air in the system is bad. But so long as the filter canister is refilled or properly primed with vcds the amount of air is negligible, and will be returned to the tank. I've always refilled manually and never had so much as a hiccup. It seems to me the stalling phenomenon is more common among those who prime with vcds.
 

BoraT_Di

Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2007
Location
North East England
TDI
currently a Passat 1.6 CR 5 door
When you do a filter change you remove the fuel from the bottom of the HPFP which is where the lower pressure return line is. The bottom of the HPFP is where the cam lobes and roller bearing are. On start up the car will run fine but there is no fuel in the bottom of the HPFP and it's only source of lubrication is the fuel. By not running the pumps and purging the bottom of the pump of air, and filling it with fuel, you get cavitation and possibly more wear then if it was filled with fuel.
Surely running the Purge procedure with VCDS does exactly the same to the pumps - runs them potentially with air in the system, unlubricated by fuel etc etc. What I'm suggesting is that the VCDS purge procedure is not there to prolong the life of the pump, but to put fuel in the system so the engine will fire up. And nothing more...
 

meerschm

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Joined
Apr 18, 2009
Location
Fairfax county VA
TDI
2009 Jetta wagon DSG 08/08 205k buyback 1/8/18; replaced with 2017 Golf Wagon 4mo 1.8l CXBB
The only pump to really worry about is the HPFP. yes, the purge procedure will expose the intermediate pump to some air, but this is way less of a problem than air in the hpfp me, I like to cycle the lift pump first, then do them both.

always using the procedure is conservative, but if you have a VCDS, it costs little, good reason to run and save an auto scan, if you have not done so recently, and will get any air out of the fuel system.

if air in the fuel system is bad, why not get it out of there?

in the service manual, under a section titled, "Vehicle Damage Warnings":

If fuel system components between the fuel tank and high pressure fuel pump were removed or replaced, the fuel system must be filled in order to bleed it. Refer to --> [ Fuel System, Filling ] See: Service and Repair\Procedures\Fuel System, Filling. (Avoid running the high pressure fuel pump dry.)
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
You guys are overcomplicating simple routine maintenance. Just fill the canister or prime with vcds or jump the pumps. Not rocket science folks.
 

StevesTDI

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Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Location
Bay City, OR
TDI
2009 & 2010 Jetta
This is like the third thread I've read and I find it fascinating the back arching on both sides. This is how it will roll for me, I will replace and fill the canister old school, when I buy the VCDS I will use it or not, but the probability of me using it is very great if I have it due to the "playing with toys fun factor". Mind you all the threads I've read have been good reads.
 

Racerman27410

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 14, 2012
Location
Greensboro NC
TDI
2012 JSW TDI 6MT
I purchased VCDS as insurance against being stranded on the side of the road without a clue as to what might be wrong.
Since i have it... i use it.
Everybody has to steer their own boat.
 

pknopp

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 29, 2011
Location
WV
TDI
2012 Jetta Sportwagen
I removed my filter (checked for flakes, there was none) put the new one in, buttoned it all back up and started it. Let it run for a minute and drove off. No drama.
 

StevesTDI

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Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Location
Bay City, OR
TDI
2009 & 2010 Jetta
I'll be doing mine today old school. I advised/hinted to the wife I'd love to have a VCDS for xmas. Hope I was on the good list. :)
 

JSWTDI09

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 31, 2009
Location
Las Vegas, Nevada
TDI
2009 JSW TDI (gone but not forgotten)
I purchased VCDS ....snip...
Since i have it... i use it.
Everybody has to steer their own boat.
There are several threads here (and elsewhere) debating this topic and I have read most of them. When it comes to fuel filter changing on a CR engine, people seem to fall into two simple categories. Those who have VCDS (or access to it) and those who don't. Those who have VCDS would not think of changing fuel filters without priming the fuel system and those without access to VCDS (or another similar tool) rationalize their method by the logic of "well, it hasn't killed my HPFP yet" - and they might be right, we really don't know. After reading hundreds of posts about this subject - this seems to be what it really boils down to. As stated above: "Everybody has to steer their own boat".

Have Fun!

Don
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
And there are probably at least several with vcds who prime manually. Changing the fuel filter isn't opening the fuel system in the sense that some seem to think. Much like changing the oil filter isn't opening up the engine.
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
I think it comes down to type A and type B personality. Type A will see a torque spec for lug bolts, and out comes the torque wrench. Type b will think, gee I'm hungry, and out comes the four-way.
 

StevesTDI

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Location
Bay City, OR
TDI
2009 & 2010 Jetta
Well it's done and no hitches except for a little deisel that pushed out of the canister and caught by paper towels. Started right up no problem. I again hinted to the wife about my xmas wish.
 

Jeffro420

Active member
Joined
May 20, 2017
Location
Raleigh, NC
TDI
2010 Jetta TDI
Just wanted to bump this with an update - I changed my fuel filter the other day without the VAGcom software (2010 Jetta TDI late one-hole filter). I used a bungie cord to hold the fuel filter housing cap up (to reduce air into the tubes), filled the fuel filter housing up with diesel, put plenty of paper towels around when I squeezed the housing down, and it started up just fine! Didn't have trouble turning over at all.
 

Jetta_Pilot

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 14, 2005
Location
West Hill, Ont.
TDI
2015 Passat Highline TDI Candy White (SEL Premium) long gone 2002 Jetta TDI
Just wanted to bump this with an update - I changed my fuel filter the other day without the VAGcom software (2010 Jetta TDI late one-hole filter). I used a bungie cord to hold the fuel filter housing cap up (to reduce air into the tubes), filled the fuel filter housing up with diesel, put plenty of paper towels around when I squeezed the housing down, and it started up just fine! Didn't have trouble turning over at all.
You must have looked it up on the web like I did.

Used bungee cord too. Gently pulled up on the filter and let the diesel run out. Immediately threw it into a plastic shopping bag. Checked the bottom of the filter housing which was clean as a whistle. Next gently lower the new filter into the housing to let it soak up any diesel. Then filled it to the top with PowerService Silver. Closed it up and engine started right away.
 
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