Dealership Trying to Push Me Into Phase 2 Fix!

GIDDY_UP_GO · Apr 28, 2019

2015 TDI GSW with 6MT. I was at the dealership which I purchased the car from 2 years ago for my complimentary free oil change. (I received the 10k, 20k and 30k services for free with the purchase of car). Anyway this was for the 20K service and my car rolled into the shop with 18,500 miles on the odometer.

Long story short, I was at the service desk signing my paperwork after the service was completed and the service advisor asked me if I wanted to have the phase 2 fix performed on my vehicle and I declined. ( I was under the belief that we didn't need to have phase 2 completed until after the car had 70k miles on it)

Anyway, he was kind of shocked that I turned down the fix at this time and even noted it on my paperwork that "Customer declines phase 2 fix at this time". He also went on to tell me that I should really get my car into their dealership soon because these "fixes' will eventually expire and I will be **** outta luck.

Anyway, can someone with more knowledge fill me in on how long I have to get this fix performed and is it true that it will expire sometime down the road as this advisor said?

I dunno where I got the 70k mile figure at, but I am sure I read it somewhere here on this site.

Thanks!

Mythdoc · Apr 28, 2019

There is something in the settlement to the effect that VW can decline to do warranty repairs on a vehicle that has not been fully fixed.

GIDDY_UP_GO · Apr 29, 2019

Yes, I am aware of this, however I thought we had more time to get phase 2 portion of the fix completed.

Z85rado · Apr 29, 2019

funny.. my car was at the dealer and i inquired multiple times and they more or less scoffed at it and gave me no info.

thundershorts · Apr 29, 2019

Here in West Chester its easy to figure out which dealer that was.

RIP TDI · Apr 29, 2019

GIDDY_UP_GO said:
( I was under the belief that we didn't need to have phase 2 completed until after the car had 70k miles on it)...

I dunno where I got the 70k mile figure at, but I am sure I read it somewhere here on this site.
Thanks!

Are you thinking of the minimum allowable mileage for Phase 2B which, for your 6MT, is 70K mi. (40K for DSG)?

If your dealer is talking about doing both 2A & 2B at < 70K, that violates VW's policy and intent that the dealer would have verified by going through the phone questionnaire on VW's TDI emission hotline. My dealer said all TDI emission jobs have to be processed and logged through the hotline in order to be authorized, so this scenario seems less likely.

If your dealer is just talking about doing 2A (2nd Nox sensor & harness) now, their point about the possibility of "expiration" if you too long isn't valid since VW is legally obligated to make the parts available for 11+ years, but there could be a delay if the warehouses run dry of them at some point. They're probably just saying, "Hey, we've got 'em in stock now, let's do it now; who knows what the supply situation will look like in the future."

740GLE · Apr 29, 2019

Dealer speak to pad their monthly shop time billable to VWoA.

They prob also just wanted to document that they spoke to you about it so if questioned they can prove that you can't plead ignorant at a later date about denying phase 2.

I'm more taken back that it'st taken you 2 years to rack up only 18K, what do you do just take the car to church on Sundays? How much longer before you hit that 70K?

Lightflyer1 · Apr 29, 2019

Chris Bell said:
Are you thinking of the minimum allowable mileage for Phase 2B which, for your 6MT, is 70K mi. (40K for DSG)?

If your dealer is talking about doing both 2A & 2B at < 70K, that violates VW's policy and intent that the dealer would have verified by going through the phone questionnaire on VW's TDI emission hotline. My dealer said all TDI emission jobs have to be processed and logged through the hotline in order to be authorized, so this scenario seems less likely.

If your dealer is just talking about doing 2A (2nd Nox sensor & harness) now, their point about the possibility of "expiration" if you too long isn't valid since VW is legally obligated to make the parts available for 11+ years, but there could be a delay if the warehouses run dry of them at some point. They're probably just saying, "Hey, we've got 'em in stock now, let's do it now; who knows what the supply situation will look like in the future."

Well VW must have approved mine as they did part 2A and part @b at the same time at about 17k miles on my new 2015 Beetle. I don't think they care really and just want to get as many of them done as soon as possible.

RIP TDI · Apr 29, 2019

Lightflyer1 said:
Well VW must have approved mine as they did part 2A and part @b at the same time at about 17k miles on my new 2015 Beetle. I don't think they care really and just want to get as many of them done as soon as possible.

Yes, some have reported the same. I assumed they would do mine that way also (@ 15K), but they had just implemented the hotline system. I think I was the first at this dealership to be put through the online questionnaire.

Z85rado · Apr 29, 2019

need to update my locale.. not in west chester anymore..

GIDDY_UP_GO · Apr 29, 2019

740GLE said:
I'm more taken back that it'st taken you 2 years to rack up only 18K, what do you do just take the car to church on Sundays? How much longer before you hit that 70K?

Well, to be honest with you, it only had 8000 miles on it less than a year ago and that's when I decided I needed to drive it more before something stupid happened and it was out of warranty.

So, I got rid of my 2004 TDI Jetta and got this thing on the road, and have been driving it daily ever since!

Don't worry, I will get the miles on it quickly!

aditud · Apr 29, 2019

I went through the same thing when I took the car in for the 20K service (I had about 18.5k on the odometer). They included a note saying "customer declined the emission recall service at this time", but they told me I could do it later. Which I did, this past December, when the car had about 24k. Mine is an MT as well, so I suppose they only did part of Phase 2? So they have to complete it when I reach 70k? I knew about these things at some point but I forgot, 70k is a long way away.

740GLE · Apr 30, 2019

Chris Bell said:
Yes, some have reported the same. I assumed they would do mine that way also (@ 15K), but they had just implemented the hotline system. I think I was the first at this dealership to be put through the online questionnaire.

I believe if you bought the car new (untitled) in '17 VWoA would allow dealers to gave you both A and B regardless of mileage and the documentation states, but obviously the only thing that's consistent of VWoA/Dealers is inconsistency.

RIP TDI · Apr 30, 2019

740GLE said:
I believe if you bought the car new (untitled) in '17 VWoA would allow dealers to gave you both A and B regardless of mileage and the documentation states, but obviously the only thing that's consistent of VWoA/Dealers is inconsistency.

Bought mine new in '17... but you may be right that dealers were not constrained before the hotline was instituted.

Lightflyer1 · Apr 30, 2019

Bought mine new in 2017 as well.

laminated · Apr 30, 2019

and after you get the fix, get the Malone or Kerma tune done. once you got it, you cant live without.

MichaelB · Apr 30, 2019

laminated said:
and after you get the fix, get the Malone or Kerma tune done. once you got it, you cant live without.

Until your fuel system, hpfp, etc. fails and you can't live without that because your car will not run and it is not covered by warranty after the tune was installed.

dubStrom · May 3, 2019

GIDDY_UP_GO said:
2015 TDI GSW with 6MT. I was at the dealership which I purchased the car from 2 years ago for my complimentary free oil change. (I received the 10k, 20k and 30k services for free with the purchase of car). Anyway this was for the 20K service and my car rolled into the shop with 18,500 miles on the odometer.
Long story short, I was at the service desk signing my paperwork after the service was completed and the service advisor asked me if I wanted to have the phase 2 fix performed on my vehicle and I declined. ( I was under the belief that we didn't need to have phase 2 completed until after the car had 70k miles on it)
Anyway, he was kind of shocked that I turned down the fix at this time and even noted it on my paperwork that "Customer declines phase 2 fix at this time". He also went on to tell me that I should really get my car into their dealership soon because these "fixes' will eventually expire and I will be **** outta luck.
Anyway, can someone with more knowledge fill me in on how long I have to get this fix performed and is it true that it will expire sometime down the road as this advisor said?
I dunno where I got the 70k mile figure at, but I am sure I read it somewhere here on this site.
Thanks!

The dealership gets PAID to do the Phase2 work. nuf said on that...

But THE REAL choice is whether you decide to do this before 40k for a short pipe replacement mid-rear piping, with a new "NOx sensor". After 40k? You get the entire cradle removed

and replaced, and lots of replacement parts up there behind the engine.

I spoke to the technician at the dealership that was working on my car yesterday (for unrelated electrical issue). He does Stage 2 fixes regularly. He likes them (remove and replace, no diagnostics to do). He told me that VW will NOT reimburse dealerships for an alignment after the more extreme cradle removal job after 40k!!! So they are told to "mark it" and replace it in the same place. Assume no change in alignment.

So, you can pay for the alignment, and get it, or take it somewhere else and have it done for less, Don't do the alignment, or perhaps better yet, do the Stage 2 fix before 40k. You still get warrantee extension.

Personally, I do not like the idea of removing the cradle. THose are perfectly good factory installed and tensioned bolts, tightened once, possibly set in position by a robot, and with wheels subsequently aligned. Do I really want the post 40k Stage 2? Hmmm!?

Lightflyer1 · May 3, 2019

There really is no benefit to waiting unless you are prepared to wait until over 100k miles or so (unreasonable IMHO). If done early less is touched on the car and the extended warranty still covers everything if needed.

IndigoBlueWagon · May 3, 2019

I don't intend to bring my GSW to the dealer, ever. And with 13K on it, I'm certainly not going to get the Phase II fix now, even if I did take the car in. Part of that fix is a preventive replacement of emissions components to make sure the vehicle is compliant for all of its warranty period. Replacing stuff way early defeats that purpose.

Lightflyer1 · May 3, 2019

As I have stated before you are in a unique position compared to almost all here. I would assume the dpf won't last my entire warranty and will have to be replaced anyway. They aren't replacing it early anyway. Supposedly they did 2B on mine but no dpf that I am aware of. I will double check with them though. The dealer just told me only 2A was done on mine. No idea when to come back for 2B. I told him I would like it if he would investigate some as to when VW suggests you return for 2B. Also told him I would see him in about 10 years or 120k miles if I didn't hear from him. He also said it doesn't affect the warranty status if you get 2B at some later time.

JohnBlutarsky · May 4, 2019

Everyone keeps saying that getting Phase 2 done is connected to the extended warranty, but I haven't had it done, and when I check the online VIN lookup, I get the following:

2015 Golf Hatchback 4D TDI S I4 Turbo
Volkswagen Emissions Modification Programs
Vehicle (VIN) Included in Settlement:
YES
Modification Approved by EPA and CARB:
YES
Modification Completed for this Vehicle (VIN):
PARTIAL
Vehicle has Extended Emissions Warranty:
YES

Looks good to me! Should I be worried that this could change? At this point I don't have any incentive to get Phase 2 done if I've already got the extended warranty. Thoughts?

740GLE · May 6, 2019

IMO phase 2 A and B is to keep EPA happy as well as dealer replacement of hardware within scope of the usable life of the car (168K).

I don't believe there is a % of Phase 2 fix rate VW needs to hit for EPA compliance, as phase 1 was "good enough" for them to be released for sale and on the road.

Eitherway, our '15 Passat is getting 2A and 2B @36K when I brought the car in for failed radio and takta air bag recall.

gqboy · May 6, 2019

JohnBlutarsky said:
Everyone keeps saying that getting Phase 2 done is connected to the extended warranty, but I haven't had it done, and when I check the online VIN lookup, I get the following:
2015 Golf Hatchback 4D TDI S I4 Turbo
Volkswagen Emissions Modification Programs
Vehicle (VIN) Included in Settlement:
YES
Modification Approved by EPA and CARB:
YES
Modification Completed for this Vehicle (VIN):
PARTIAL
Vehicle has Extended Emissions Warranty:
YES
Looks good to me! Should I be worried that this could change? At this point I don't have any incentive to get Phase 2 done if I've already got the extended warranty. Thoughts?

What's the website where I can go to get information on my car? Is it the same for owners in Canada? TIA....

rotarykid · May 6, 2019

IndigoBlueWagon said:
I don't intend to bring my GSW to the dealer, ever. And with 13K on it, I'm certainly not going to get the Phase II fix now, even if I did take the car in. Part of that fix is a preventive replacement of emissions components to make sure the vehicle is compliant for all of its warranty period. Replacing stuff way early defeats that purpose.

this was my understanding, the stage 2 fix was to replace parts they expect to meet the end of their serivice life around ~70k from the current overuse they suffer from to make carb & the epa happy. At that point, not sooner certain parts have shown in testing to suffer failure to the point that they can cause emissions to exceed agreed to limits.....

so vwag agreed to install replacement parts at the this point to guarantee a car that operates emissions wise to accepted limits up to 162k miles.....

after that they are likely off the hook for the stage 2 fix....

JohnBlutarsky · May 6, 2019

gqboy said:
What's the website where I can go to get information on my car? Is it the same for owners in Canada? TIA....

For US: https://www.vwdieselinfo.com/

For Canada, all I could find is the 3.0L vehicle lookup: https://www.vwcanadasettlement.ca/en/VINLookup3

Dealership Trying to Push Me Into Phase 2 Fix!

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