Potential TDI guy, looking for real world MPG

I'm looking at a package 2 06 Jetta or an 04 Jetta wagon to replace my 04 R32. I've had very good luck with VW's over the years, so reliability isn't a huge concern, but I'm wondering what kind of fuel economy numbers I can expect. I put ~26k miles on my car each year, and I drive fast. I don't intend to change my driving behavior just to get a few extra MPG (a sacrilege on this forum, I'm sure. ;-)) Here's the question:

Given a fast driving style (75mph average with potential for runs at higher speed) and mostly highway mileage, is it reasonable to expect 40MPG?

TIA for the input.

Cale

Arrr32 said:

I'm looking at a package 2 06 Jetta or an 04 Jetta wagon to replace my 04 R32. I've had very good luck with VW's over the years, so reliability isn't a huge concern, but I'm wondering what kind of fuel economy numbers I can expect. I put ~26k miles on my car each year, and I drive fast. I don't intend to change my driving behavior just to get a few extra MPG (a sacrilege on this forum, I'm sure. ;-)) Here's the question:

Given a fast driving style (75mph average with potential for runs at higher speed) and mostly highway mileage, is it reasonable to expect 40MPG?

TIA for the input.

Cale

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From the guys around here with DSG's and 5M's, they seem to get above 40 consitently. I have an auto(5A) and see ~40 with half city/ half hwy. The highest I got was a 600 mile trip from MS to austin - 47.8 mpg. Thats including stopping on I-10 in lousisiana for 20 mins and Houston in the rain

EDIT: Just saw you had two choices. I think the wagon gets less mpg's, but I'll let someone who has one back that up.

I think the big thing is is that this car is just so much fun to drive.

remember the 120 rule

80mph=40mpg
70mph=50mpg
60mph=60mpg
50mph=70mpg

then you can always throw on some slight modifications to get those numbers up. if you're really putting 26k mi on per year, i'd definately recommend the .681 5th gear. do a search, i'm hopefully going to be putting one on my car soon.

if you dont intend to race around in the it or put in too many speed mods, you can always try 506.01 spec engine oil. it's designed for extremely long OCI (oil change intervals) and is 0w30 so you get a small MPG bonus.

i highly recommend a TDI, i love mine. i also highly recommend BioDiesel. do some research here, there's people who both support and hate it. personally, i use B99 and encourage others to do the same. i hope you choose to buy a TDI, and welcome to the club.

Real world

Here's what I have done in real world driving in my 2006 Jetta DSG TDI with 7500 miles:

City mileage is high 20's to low 30's in the city with AC on. Low to mid 30's in the city with it off. Tires at 40 psi.

Have gotten high 30's to low 40's on the highway with AC off.

I accelerate very gently, coast as much as practical and pump my tires up to 40 psi. Unless I am doing something grossly wrong I think I know how to drive for economy and yet have never hit the EPA estimates of 35/42 for my car.

The truth hurts but I am telling you the absolute truth.

I give a lot of credit to those who can extract more mileage out of these cars but their knowledge and expertise far exceed that of the average TDI owner.

Check the February 2005 Popular Mechanics "Hybrid vs. Diesel" article.
http://www.popularmechanics.com/auto...tml?page=6&c=y They only got 32 in the city with a manual transmission, but a whopping 53 on the highway. Consumer Reports had a review with similar results.

Super high mileage? You don't need a TDI for that, just extreme driving techniques in a fantasy world. Give me a Civic or Corolla, 10 minutes to accelerate to 40 mph in high gear with a super low ratio rear, locking the throttle on a perfectly level superhighway with 50 psi in skinny tires on a cold day with a nice tailwind and coasting to a stop and I'll show you some pretty impressive mileage numbers too.

All that for regular gas that sells for 30 cents less per gallon than diesel!

A TDI with less than 10k on the odometer will not give you top mileage as these motors do take some mileage to break in. My Passat TDI's very first tank only gave me in the low thirties. On my vacation trips the past two summers I have gotten as high as 46mpg with my TDI. I was not driving like a grandpa either.

Your driving style sounds quite the opposite of economy. Who knows what you would end up with in the test. I would say though that you would see a substantial increase over what you are getting in your current vehicle. Maybe 35 - 42 mpg? Is your fast driving style get up to speed and then steady state operation, or are you shifting, braking accelerating through traffic like a stock car driver? Diesel tuning box on my car for a little extra umph! I get around 45 mpg at normal highway speeds and smooth driving.

edgehill said:

I accelerate very gently,

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see, there's your problem right there. you gotta DILYSI

Thanks for the info folks, keep it coming. Glad to know the forums here are as useful as vwvortex. One other question, not sure if I'm inthe right section or not. How does your TDI do on hills? I commute to Denver regularly over the continental divide, so giddy-up over the mountains is a definite plus.

Thanks,
Cale

TDI's looove moutains.

Chip it and enjoy.

.... and comparing tdiclub to vortex.... ouch. Thats just mean

The sticker is pretty close. 35 and 42 no AC, but on my last trip I got 40mpg with the ac on at 80mph with 6k miles. I get around 30 in the city with the AC on, but I drive pretty hard.

If you do a few odds and ends after its broken in 45 mpg should be doable.

04 passat wagon mileage

Hello,

I have an 04 tdi pasat wagon that if I drive with the air conditioner on and 600 pounds of cargo at 65 mph I get a wee bit over 40 mpg with a B20 - B30 ratio fuel mixture.

In town is lower of course ... between 25 and 30 ish but I live in the non-flat part of Kansas and drive up and down hills a bunch.

robert

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]2 05/08/06 655 318 7.20 44.17[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]3 05/19/06 1084 429 9.80 43.78[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]4 05/25/06 1486 402 9.10 44.18[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]5 06/05/06 1874 388 9.90 39.19[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]6 06/12/06 2114 240 6.50 36.92[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]7 06/17/06 2415 301 8.80 34.20[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]8 06/21/06 2593 178 5.10 34.90[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]9 06/29/06 2883 290 8.10 35.80[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]10 07/08/06 3147 264 7.20 36.67[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]11 07/16/06 3367 220 5.70 38.60[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]12 07/26/06 3693 326 8.50 38.35[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]13 08/04/06 4023 330 8.30 39.76[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]14 08/09/06 4185 162 4.00 40.50[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]15 08/13/06 4489 304 8.50 35.76[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]16 08/29/06 4895 406 9.90 41.01[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]17 09/11/06 5279 384 9.50 40.42[/FONT]

Arrr32 said:

I'm looking at a package 2 06 Jetta or an 04 Jetta wagon to replace my 04 R32. ...

Given a fast driving style (75mph average with potential for runs at higher speed) and mostly highway mileage, is it reasonable to expect 40MPG?

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A Jetta TDI wagon with 5-speed manual, in your location and with your driving, should average in the mid-40s. Probably best in the fall and spring.

A Mk5 Jetta would likely be just a little bit less. Maybe high 30s for the first 5k miles or so, then gradual improvement into the low 40s.

Thanks for this thread

I've been doing some minor freaking, lately. I just turned 2000 mi. in an 06 jetta tdi w/dsg, pkg 1.
First tank, dealer supplied w/44 mi on the odometer, diesle #2 provided me with 40.2 mpg.
second tank, B20,13.5 gals= 39.6mpg
third tank, B99 13.4 gals= 36.9 mpg.

70% city 30% highway driving at 65-75mph.

Are my numbers normal for a new engine and these driving conditions?

I'm trying to "drive the piss out of it" to get those valves seated properly.

06 Jetta DSG with 21K averaging around 35-37 on a 40 mile one way commute at 80-85 air always on. Can get 42 to 46 all highway same speed, a/c on if trip is over 75 to 100 miles long. This is with 17" GLI wheels which really hurt the mileage.

whyfish said:

I've been doing some minor freaking, lately. I just turned 2000 mi. in an 06 jetta tdi w/dsg, pkg 1.
First tank, dealer supplied w/44 mi on the odometer, diesle #2 provided me with 40.2 mpg.
second tank, B20,13.5 gals= 39.6mpg
third tank, B99 13.4 gals= 36.9 mpg.

70% city 30% highway driving at 65-75mph.

Are my numbers normal for a new engine and these driving conditions?

I'm trying to "drive the piss out of it" to get those valves seated properly.

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Last point first: the reason for working a new engine is to seat the rings, not the valves. Compression will gradually increase, oil usage will decrease, power will improve, fuel mileage will improve.

If 70% of your driving is city, and you're burning B99 which has fewer BTUs per gallon, then your fuel mileage numbers are normal.

VWoA does not recommend B99. In fact, if you have a fuel injection problem, the use of B99 could void your warranty.

Not sure about WOT (wide open throttle) acceleration

MrErlo said:

see, there's your problem right there. you gotta DILYSI

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Boy, I'm having a hard time with that concept.

My MDX has a mpg gauge. If I accelerate very slowly I can show 5-10 mpg while accelerating. If I hit the pedal hard I show zero mpg.

It just sounds like plain old common sense to me: If you floor the car in an effort to get to cruising speed as quickly as possible all you are doing is pouring fuel into the engine and not going very far while you are doing it. Just like idling the engine; you use gas but go nowhere. Result? Zero mpg.

Ianame

edgehill said:

Boy, I'm having a hard time with that concept.

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it seems counter intuative, and IANA Mechanical Engineer, but this engine is more efficient at turning fuel into power when pushed harder. so if you're reving quickly from 1900RPM to 3000RPM then shifting and repeating until you get to 5th gear, you're getting the full effect of the turbo and you fuel is being converted to forward motion/acceleration more efficiently. check out the threads "Driving for better MPG" and the like, many people will tell you that's the best way to drive.

Bad fuel, NOT inherantly BioD

TornadoRed said:

VWoA does not recommend B99. In fact, if you have a fuel injection problem, the use of B99 could void your warranty.

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Whyfish, he makes an excellent point. there are countless threads about BioD use and warranty coverage. no one has EVER proved that simply using BioD is bad for any engine. using bad FUEL of any kind, whether BioD, D2 or ULSD will unquestionably be bad for your engine and lead to worse MPG and possibly pump/injector damage.

i hope you continue to use BioD from a respectible dealer, we all appreciate it.

MrErlo said:

it seems counter intuative, and IANA Mechanical Engineer, but this engine is more efficient at turning fuel into power when pushed harder. so if you're reving quickly from 1900RPM to 3000RPM then shifting and repeating until you get to 5th gear, you're getting the full effect of the turbo and you fuel is being converted to forward motion/acceleration more efficiently. check out the threads "Driving for better MPG" and the like, many people will tell you that's the best way to drive.

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The key is finding the break-even point. Time vs. fuel usage and gearing....

You can (a) take longer to get up to cruising speed (less fuel used per second, but more seconds) or (b) get up to speed quickly (more fuel used per second but less seconds). Then throw in gearing into the mix...

I don't think it is fast driving that will kill the mpg, it's the rapid acceleraton. I have an 06 Jetta with only 5500 miles on it. I drive average, some acceleration to get the rpm up during break in but not all the time. I consistantly get 35-36mpg in town (about 60-70% stop and go). On the open road at 70mph I get 45-47. The probelm is that I have not been able to check a full tank on the road because I seldom drive 600 miles. I always have the AC on and I have a DSG transmission. 40mpg does not seem unreasonable. The 2005 and earlier Jettas are about 250-275 lbs lighter and that helps. Good luck!

There is a break-even point..it may not be realistic though. The two curves should meet depending on how slow and/or how fast you accelerate. And then find the area under the curve...hmm...harkening back to college calculus....

integration

seems like someone out there must already have this graph. and calculus is right, integrating for the fuel consumed in each gear and summing up to a max speed/RPM. yah, i bet someone already has this done for us.

Again, thanks everyone for the input. Test drives will happen this weekend, then I'll see what happens from there. Lovin' the TDIclub forums.

Arr32, my wife's '06 Jetta DSL with 10,000+miles on it has an average mpg of 38.7. She uses the a/c all of the time, has a fairly heavy foot, and drives almost exclusively in town.

As someone has already said, TDI's perform very well in the mountains. I've been all over the front range and western slope and love the TDI's mountain performance. Remember that when you coast down hill in a TDI while in gear (using the engine to assist breaking) you use no fuel.

Now, if you really want economy, I just got my first 800+ mile tank and almost 52 mpg with my '06 New Beetle.

my wife and i have an 06 jetta tdi with dsg and we tow our jetski and get over 40mpg!!!!

jetta mileage

I had a 2010 jetta TDI 6 speed manual was averaging 43 to 45 mpg after 36000 miles. It got wrecked and i bought a 2011 Jetta TDI 6 speed auto so far averaging 40 mpg with 13000 miles on it.
There is a differance in the gearing. the 2010 would tack at 2000rpm at 70 mph the 2011 is 2300 at 70mpg. so I', guessing the milage will suffer some.

i just put 240 miles on my 2001 bug, i just bought with 54k on it, i averaged about 40mpg driving from philly to OCMD and back i ran about 75 on the way down about 80 on the way back (no traffic this morning) i was quite impressed since my dodge truck gets about 15mpg this is my first "long" trip with the bug, i really enjoyed it except that the radio doesn't work.

THE FEZMAN said:

i just put 240 miles on my 2001 bug, i just bought with 54k on it....

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It sounds like it's practically new, so it needs to be driven like a new car -- search for one of the threads describing a proper breaking-in procedure.

But it does have ten-year-old belts, and most 2001 TDIs came with a timing belt rated for 60k miles. So find a nearby TDI guru and get a complete deluxe timing belt installed. And while he's doing that, ask to get everything else checked out.