Se vs. Sel. Is the Sel worth the approx. $3,000 more?

Trying to decide between the se and sel. I know I the difference between the two for 2013. Do not like the sel seats, like the smooth seats on the se. No dual temp and different nav on se. Remote start is cool on sel and could always add faux wood trim to se. Are the nav systems so different? Will resale be so different? Wife likes tan interior but we hav a 7 and 10 year old girls. I want black not to show dirt. For those with tan int., is tan hard to keep clean? Opinions wanted to make decision.

puzzling option decisions

These new predetermined packages on the domestic Passat in NA make the choices more puzzling! I have a Tom Tom, wife doesn't care about dual zone. For me, adding the L is not worth it. But I would like a sunroof with a 6MT (no way). I can't tell if the stereo/speakers are different between SE and SEL. I know the Dynaudio is better than the standard system in my JSW, but even the basic sound is excellent. I saw Fender logo in a Jetta I drove. Not sure if it is in the Passat. Should be.

Cornsilk interior: We love the color, but are amazed at how much color transfer there is between our clothing and the light color leather and fabric. To be honest, we wear a lot of black (we're classical music performers, so black is the default for men, frequent for women) but in fact had the same issue with our tan leatherette on our 09 Jetta. As for 7 and 10 year old stains...the fabric inserts might prove to be difficult to keep clean.

Regarding the SEL vs. SE seats. After several visits to the dealer, sitting in both SE and SEL seats, I still swear they're different in shape. I think the SEL seats wrap around the shoulders more, but maybe it's the fabric insert stretching more than the leatherette? I like the shape of our SEL seats (early production...did they change the shape later? Doubtful)

The SEL nav is SLOW to the touch, quirky, but does the job once you've figured it out.

Yes, the SEL has the Fender system. It's nice, but i can't compare it to the SE sound system.

We like the wood trim (which is NOT plastic, but it is coated with plastic material) with the black dash and cornsilk seats. I prefer it to the brushed metal.

Dual-zone climate control? No big deal for us, we never use the "zone" option.

Remote start? I will never use it. My personal opinion is quite strong against the whole concept, as in suburbia, during the winter, all the cars sitting idle as they attempt to warm-up really stink up the neighborhood for those of us that walk in the morning (not to mention the wasted fuel, and the diluted oil during slow warm-up). Rural areas, where it's cold, it might be useful, but really, a diesel never warms up while at idle, and I just can't agree with remotely starting an engine in the cold, w/o a way to monitor the engine. Regardless of temperature, I just start it and drive gently.

Keyless start is just another gimmick. I do like the keyless entry, though.

All said, we would buy the SEL again, even with the observations above. Resale? Probably better with the SEL.

tdiatlast said:

Cornsilk interior: We love the color, but are amazed at how much color transfer there is between our clothing and the light color leather and fabric.

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That's something I was wondering about, and it makes me glad that I held out for black. I had light-colored leather (real leather, not leatherette) in the 2008 Accord I just traded in, and there was quite a bit of color transfer.

So glad we went with the SEL:
1. Interior with wood trim looks more upscale (Always had Audis and Mercedes)
2. Fender sound system is wonderful!
3. Keyless entry/lock is neat. It really grows on you. Wife does not need to dig through her purse for keys.
4. Larger nav screen is nice.
5. Real leather will increase resale value.
6. Little touches like floor lighting adds to style.
7. Don't know what the SE has, but our fog lights actually help light the sides of the roadway.

The only reason I think someone should select an SE (if they can afford an SEL) is that they want/require a manual transmission. We have had both through the years, but quite frankly the DSG (our first DSG was in an Audi TT) is about as close to a manual as you can get without the downsides (e.g., constant clutching while stuck in slow traffic).

This sound silly, but a show stopper for my wife was that Homelink was only available on the SEL. Yes you can install the visor with Homelink yourself but that's a bit of a hassle...

Absolutely. Unless you have to have a manual, get the SEL. I'm normally not into all the bells & whistles, but because the majority of my driving is work related this car has spoiled me. Kinda hard when the service dept gives me a loaner now.

The lack of a manual in the SEL trim was a deal breaker for me. I 'settled' for the SE.

I toyed with this very dillema. I ended up with the SE with Sun and Nav. I think this is the best of what comes on the SEL but without the extra gadgets that raise the price 3k.

as far as the interior goes I had to have black. I like the lighter color seats, but the carpet has to be black, that's what gets dirty most, and that was not an option. so all black it was.

Regarding the other features. Yes the Nav unit is probably quite a bit better the large higher def screen would be nice. I didn't want the nav but had to get it for the other stuff I wanted. the cheaper nav works just fine.

The fender audio is probably margianlly better. the SE speakers are pretty good and plenty loud and I'm a snob when it comes to that stuff. I will be adding a sub or two and it will be good.

The Kessy system was something I really wanted. I really like that feature, but it wasn't enough alone for me to spend 3k. Plus I just feel like it's one more feature to break or malfunction and if that happened with the kessy I can't imagine the cost to replace or fix or how annoying it would be.

Remote start again not very well executed and proven to not be very beneficial to diesels. I think it's annoying that the car has to shut off when you open the door. I will just suck it up.

the leather Inserts in the seats....they are nice, but again not enough to make me want to spend 3k the SE seats are just fine for what it is.

I prefer the brushed aluminum in the non SEL trims. I think it looks much better especially with the black interior.


So with all that I figured if any of those things were really bugging me that I didn't have them I could probably get most of it installed after market for much less than 3k.

SE with sun and nav is the best package IMO overall.

If you're going for value for dollar spent, the SE would be the way to go. Keeping the car under $30k after taxes. When I was younger, I wouldn't have minded upgrading things on my own to save a few $$$. Now that I'm approaching 50, not so much. The SEL is nice though. If money were tight, I would've went with the SE.

It gets more puzzling when you throw in the '13 model year changes. Once climatronic was axed in the '13 model, I ran out and found a manual transmission '12. Here's my reasoning...

1) Required manual...DSG is the best automatic transmission you can buy, but it still does weird things from time to time.
2) The base audio system beat my expectations immensely! It sounds terrific.
3) I use nav like twice a year. So I got over that.
4) I'm not a huge sunroof guy. So that was easy to pass over in order to get a manual.
5) The fake aluminum trim is way sportier than the fake wood trim which looks awful. I would have swapped that out if I bought an SEL (it would have been the first thing I did).
6) I preferred 17" wheels because I will be using them as my winter set with winter tires. I don't want to buy 18" winter tires. I will buy a nice summer set of wheels next spring (probably 19's).
7) The lack of fog lights wasn't going to deter me either. Again, if I use them for their intended purpose more than once a year, I'd be surprised.
8) The leatherette was surprisingly comfortable to me. I'm coming from the Audi world with leather/alcantara combo. The leatherette is good for a daily driver.

After I started adding it up, it was worth saving $6K+ to get the preferred transmission, wheel preference, and the fake aluminum trim instead of the SEL. But in all honesty, VW missed out because I would have spent more had they offered a manual in the SEL. But they actually did me a favor and saved me a bunch of money.

In the end.. to sum it up..

It is all based on personal preferences on what you want in the car for creature comforts..

My $.05 was when I got the SEL.. Why not go for the gusto and get it all. Again, my personal preferences was I wanted all the goodies.

Nothing wrong with that.

TDIMikeMN said:

My $.05 was when I got the SEL.. Why not go for the gusto and get it all. Again, my personal preferences was I wanted all the goodies.

Nothing wrong with that.

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Nope, nothing at all. That's what I did, and I even waited for the 2013 to get the RVC.

I tend to decide on what make/model I want, and then get the top trim level in whatever that ends up being. That impacts what cars I include in my search, since I have to make sure I can afford that. It would suck to get psyched up for a particular car and then find out that it's too pricey with the features I want.

TDIMikeMN said:

In the end.. to sum it up..

It is all based on personal preferences on what you want in the car for creature comforts..

My $.05 was when I got the SEL.. Why not go for the gusto and get it all. Again, my personal preferences was I wanted all the goodies.

Nothing wrong with that.

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Yep...perfectly fine to decide this.

I would have bought an SEL if it came in a 6-speed manual. I would have changed the wood trim immediately of course, but I'm used to going only for fully optioned cars.

But in the end, for me, I feel like VW did me a favor. All the extras just weren't really worth the extra $6K+. Would I have regretted an SEL purchase for financial reasons? Maybe not. But I would have regretted the auto tranny potentially and I would rather avoid that and live without a few of the extra things.

But this is why everyone has to certainly make this decision for themselves. Everyone's situation is different. So the great news in this thread is that there are no wrong answers. At the end of the day, the 18" wheels, Fender system, nav, sunroof, fog lights, and leather surfaces where you touch were just not worth $6K+ to me. Again, I would have bought an SEL manual. But now looking back, I'm glad they didn't offer it.

I think the other thing to consider is if you have other cars you drive. I have an Audi S4 and Nissan 300ZX both with over 500 hp. I was looking for something bigger than the Audi that I could daily drive (be reliable, good mpg, and very roomy inside). I just prefer driving a manual as you can see and I didn't want that to change. Also, I was trying to buy the Passat to be a little more responsible. I can take out the other two monsters whenever I want. Looking back, I don't regret giving up some of the fluff of the SEL (which I normally prefer as well) to be in the car that's got more bang for the buck. After all, it's a pretty economical daily driver for me with a warranty.

So personally for me, it was the right decision to go with the SE manual. But I certainly have my own unique situation.

I think it depends on what your choices are in colors and if your going for the more sporty look SE with the fake brushed metal or the more elegant SEL wood trim. The SE in a lighter color with the larger wheels looks younger, and sportier to me, the dark colored SEL looks more elegant and for an older buyer. This is just my opinion, my first choice was the navy blue SEL package but I settled for the light silver SE based on availability.

Cost Differential

The cost difference between an SE and SEL is not $4000 or so when your finished with the car. An SEL will always resell for more that an SE so some of the new price difference will be recovered. I suspect it will be a good percentage.

I think an SEL will be easier to resell also. An SE not having a large screen nav or Fender sound system could be a deal breaker to a used buyer. Not many buyers seems to complain if a used car has too many options.

cookeze said:

The cost difference between an SE and SEL is not $4000 or so when your finished with the car. An SEL will always resell for more that an SE so some of the new price difference will be recovered. I suspect it will be a good percentage.

I think an SEL will be easier to resell also. An SE not having a large screen nav or Fender sound system could be a deal breaker to a used buyer. Not many buyers seems to complain if a used car has too many options.

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Don't be so sure. The car is too new to tell that as of now. Years down the road will tell the story.

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emmkayJuan said:

Absolutely. Unless you have to have a manual, get the SEL.

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Hit the nail on the head with that one. I almost got the manual, but I could not live without 1) Fender; 2) built in NAV; and 3) 18" wheels.

The way I saw it getting the SE w/6MT:

A better sound system can be added. (Ebay, Crutchfield)
A Nav system can be added. (Ebay,Vortex, iPhone, Garmin, etc.)
Backup camera can be added. (Ebay, Garmin w/camera option, etc.)
18" wheels can be added. (Ebay,Vortex)

A manual transmission, and the control of choosing the proper gear when you want it, can't be added (Unless you spend huge bucks).

I basically then have the option to create my own SEL, with the options and features that I want, as well as still getting a true manual transmission.

Driver_found said:

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A manual transmission, and the control of choosing the proper gear when you want it, can't be added (Unless you spend huge bucks).

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gee...I can control the "proper" gear when I want it with my DSG!! I do it all the time...

One of the major magazines recently mentioned the sometimes quirky behavior of the DSG, and preferred the manual for many reasons. The cost of the mandatory service on the DSG is another concern. Since I drive 40k miles a year, that would add up quickly and reduce any savings I would get by having the TDI in the first place.

While the DSG may be considered the best automatic in the world, I've driven both, and chose the manual. There are no surprises with the manual. There are numerous threads on the car not doing what the driver thinks it should do with the DSG.

Some basic info for those wanting to learn more: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/DSG-faq-VW-Audi.htm

Anyway, it's a different experience with the third pedal. Especially downshifts, holding a gear in a corner, choosing a gear coming out of a corner, etc.

MPG's are better with the manual. I think everyone here will admit that one.

I've also driven @ a thousand miles in a classic NSU Ro80, that had a system similar to the Porsche 'Sportmatic' system. http://theretromobilist.com/video/6-classic-top-gear-nsu-ro-80.
I've had AUDI and VW automatics, tiptronics and manual gear boxes over the years. I just prefer the three pedals and hand selection process, as do many other folks.

Driver_found said:

One of the major magazines recently mentioned the sometimes quirky behavior of the DSG, and preferred the manual for many reasons. The cost of the mandatory service on the DSG is another concern. Since I drive 40k miles a year, that would add up quickly and reduce any savings I would get by having the TDI in the first place.

While the DSG may be considered the best automatic in the world, I've driven both, and chose the manual. There are no surprises with the manual. There are numerous threads on the car not doing what the driver thinks it should do with the DSG.

Some basic info for those wanting to learn more: http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/DSG-faq-VW-Audi.htm

Anyway, it's a different experience with the third pedal. Especially downshifts, holding a gear in a corner, choosing a gear coming out of a corner, etc.

MPG's are better with the manual. I think everyone here will admit that one.

I've also driven @ a thousand miles in a classic NSU Ro80, that had a system similar to the Porsche 'Sportmatic' system. http://theretromobilist.com/video/6-classic-top-gear-nsu-ro-80.
I've had AUDI and VW automatics, tiptronics and manual gear boxes over the years. I just prefer the three pedals and hand selection process, as do many other folks.

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Yep. I hang out with true car officianados every week. One of them has an R32 with DSG for his daily driver and flat out told me to get the manual. The DSG is unpredictable at times (seems to have a mind of its own) and you definitely lose the fun factor of rowing your own gears. There will never be anything that replaces the fun of a true manual in a street car. Not to mention, with the possibility of a tune in the future for me, the manual is definitely the way to go. I am not going to deal with DSG stuff in a modified car. And even in a stock car, it's just more fun.

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I would never spend over 26k on a sedan that wasn't a Automatic or DSG. It's a family car not a sports car. & when you do sell it your market is going to be so small, most younger people don't know how to drive a stick. Just my opinion if you plan on keeping it forever and you like to shift then get the 6m, but don't not get the DSG because some writer didn't like it, most will notice no difference from a regular automatic.

This is my first DSG and it's one of the best auto shifting cars I have had. I drive a ton of hills and the DSG doesn't do the annoying shift up, shift down, shift up again.

My vote SEL with DSG!

Wow. Thanks for all opinions, that is why I joined this forum. Wife will not go for black interior which is my choice. Anyone able to comment on moon rock and ability to show dirt and keep clean. My 04 tdi was white and grey interior, not an option with the new passat.

ssg510 said:

Wow. Thanks for all opinions, that is why I joined this forum. Wife will not go for black interior which is my choice. Anyone able to comment on moon rock and ability to show dirt and keep clean. My 04 tdi was white and grey interior, not an option with the new passat.

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The black interior isn't very black other than the seats just so you know. The headliner and pillars are light gray still. It's not anywhere near a normal black interior I'm used to where a lot of stuff is black (like in my Audi).

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Only1Z said:

The black interior isn't very black other than the seats just so you know. The headliner and pillars are light gray still. It's not anywhere near a normal black interior I'm used to where a lot of stuff is black (like in my Audi).

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I have already tried that one on the wife, maybe if someone else told her she would believe it. She says it is black. I have tried so hard. I want the white/black int. perfect to not show dirt and wear with two kids. But she will be driving it not me so much.

If she says it's black, it's black. When she sees that it isn't black, then she'll tell you it isn't black...or...she'll continue insisting that it isn't black.

What part of this don't you understand?

ssg510 said:

I have already tried that one on the wife, maybe if someone else told her she would believe it. She says it is black. I have tried so hard. I want the white/black int. perfect to not show dirt and wear with two kids. But she will be driving it not me so much.

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Yeah I know what that is like...lol. I was trying to help you sell the idea. Always worth a shot.

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SE vs SEL

does SEL have better road noise/sound insulation then the SE?