Is this the first 3.0L TDI Gen 2 buyback, potentially?

MBQ · Mar 18, 2019

The high pressure fuel pump in my 13 Porsche cayenne 3.0L diesel was diagnosed as gone bad. The emission system was fixed around one year ago. The car have been in a Porsche dealer for repair since 01/11/2019. As of today, the dealer has kept telling me that they can't fix it.

The HPFP problem is a very rare one and this dealer probably has little or no experience dealing with it especially for the post emission repaired cars. If they can't fix the HPFP 18 months/18000 miles after the fix, whatever comes first, they'll have to buy back the car, according to the Lemon law provision in the court approved agreement, in my memory.

Anyone else has had the same issue here? What steps should I take to get it settled? Your suggestions are much appreciated.

Mythdoc · Mar 19, 2019

MBQ said:
The high pressure fuel pump in my 13 Porsche cayenne 3.0L diesel was diagnosed as gone bad. The emission system was fixed around one year ago. The car have been in a Porsche dealer for repair since 01/11/2019. As of today, the dealer has kept telling me that they can's fix it.

The HPFP problem is a very rare one and this dealer probably has little or no experience dealing with it especially for the post emission repair cars. If they can't fix the HPFP within 3 months, they'll have to buy back the car, according to the Lemon law provision in the court approved agreement, in my memory.

Anyone else has had the same issue here? What steps should I take to get it settled? Your suggestions are much appreciated.

I’ve not heard of of a similar case before. Very interesting. Please let us know what happens next, including any actions you take to invoke the provision and replace the vehicle.

You might call the class attorneys and ask them for next step. Lieff, Cabraser is where I’d begin.

Zawurah · Mar 19, 2019

If they give you a loaner the entire time, you don't get anything.

They covered their rear, and all you can do is drive your car with a crummy unreliable fix.

kjclow · Mar 19, 2019

I see it as three steps:
1. Look up lemon law for the state of Texas. See what it says about out of service times.
2. Tell the dealer what you're planning on doing as that may either light a fire under their butts to get it fixed or they may help you through the lemon process.
3. As Mythdoc suggested, contact the lawyers that helped set up the whole thing and see what they tell you.

psd1 · Mar 19, 2019

Yikes, Lemon law is where I'd start, but...it isn't under the original factory warranty so they may have some wiggle room.

Good luck!

Zawurah · Mar 19, 2019

The tdi settlement has it's own lemon law remedy.

Read it

MBQ · Mar 19, 2019

Zawurah said:
The tdi settlement has it's own lemon law remedy.

Read it

Yes it's absolutely somewhere in the settlement, I just haven't found it yet for now.

MBQ · Mar 19, 2019

Found it in the FTC Amended Second Partial Stipulated Order (05/17/2017). Page 43-44, L-M. Damn I should have demanded a buyback 33 days ago!

L. Defendants must offer (for Repaired Vehicles) or reoffer (for Modified Vehicles) and provide a Buyback or Lease Termination to any Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee of a Modified or Repaired Vehicle, in the event that, during the 18 months or 18,000 miles(whichever occurs first)following the completion of the Approved Emissions Modification or Certified Emissions Repair (the “Reoffer Period”):

1. Defendants fail to repair or remedy (at Volkswagen’s expense)a confirmed mechanical failure or malfunction covered by the Extended Emissions Warranty and associated with the Approved Emissions Modification or Certified Emissions Repair(a “Warrantable Failure”) after the Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee physically presents the Modified or Repaired Vehicle to a Dealer for repair of the Warrantable Failure and:

a. the Warrantable Failure is unable to be remedied after making four(4) separate service visits for the same Warrantable Failure during the Reoffer Period; or

b. the Modified or Repaired Vehicle with the Warrantable Failure is out of service due to the Warrantable Failure for a cumulative total of 30 days during the Reoffer Period. For avoidance of doubt, a Modified or Repaired Vehicle shall not be deemed “out of service” when, after diagnosing the Warrantable Failure, the Dealer returns or tenders the Modified or Repaired Vehicle to the customer while he Modified or Repaired Vehicle remains Operable.

M. If any such consumer is entitled to elect and elects a Buyback or Lease Termination pursuant to Subsection L, the owner or lessee shall receive the Consumer Payments that he or she would have received under a Buyback or Lease Termination at the time the Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee first requested the Approved Emissions Modification, less any Consumer Payments already received; or in the case of a Certified Emissions Repair, the Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee shall receive the Generation 2 Buyback Restitution or Generation 2 Lessee Restitution payments, less any Consumer Payments made, with the exception of any Generation 2 Participation Payments. No Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee shall receive double recovery of any portion of any Consumer Payment.

https://www.ftc.gov/system/files/documents/cases/3227_ftc_30l_order_executed.pdf

Mythdoc · Mar 19, 2019

That would be some nice payback on the Porsche. Keep us posted!

GoFaster · Mar 19, 2019

If I were you, I'd bring that document to your dealer with the relevant clause circled in highlighter, present it to the service manager, and ask nicely how we should proceed. Then see what happens.

MBQ · Mar 19, 2019

GoFaster said:
If I were you, I'd bring that document to your dealer with the relevant clause circled in highlighter, present it to the service manager, and ask nicely how we should proceed. Then see what happens.

I did and asked the service manager and he nicely answered that the dealer will follow whatever Porsche USA instructs them to do

KevinGary · Mar 20, 2019

This could be a very nice payday.

kjclow · Mar 20, 2019

MBQ said:
The way I see it, there is only one possible pithole in the following description preventing the buyback:

Defendants fail to repair or remedy (at Volkswagen’s expense)a confirmed mechanical failure or malfunction covered by the Extended Emissions Warranty and associated with the Approved Emissions Modification or Certified Emissions Repair(a “Warrantable Failure”) after the Eligible Owner or Eligible Lessee physically presents the Modified or Repaired Vehicle to a Dealer for repair of the Warrantable Failure

How do they decide the HPFP failure is following a NATURAL cause or is due to the approved Emissions modification or Certified Emissions Repair?

Since the HPFP is now covered under the extended fix warranty, I don't see that your last statement should have any relevance on the process. If your dealer deemed the HPFP sound enough to do the fix, then the failure becomes something that happened due to the fix.

MBQ · Mar 20, 2019

Mythdoc said:
That would be some nice payback on the Porsche. Keep us posted!

Yay, contacted Elizabeth Cabraser’s office, but no response yet.

Contacted Porsche care, was told that they are talking to the dealer, figuring out what's going on and will get back to me next week.

Seems they have had very few similar cases if they ever had one.

KevinGary · Mar 21, 2019

This could get very interesting

kjclow · Mar 21, 2019

At least you're not being ignored!

MBQ · Mar 22, 2019

This is what the dealer has done so far to repair the HPFP:

We started with read of fault memory and testing the fuel system along with replacing fuel filter on WPXXXXXXXXX46. Contacted Porsche help desk. .We checked the DME control unit with pin to pin testing for open/shorted circuits and pin drag (tension of pin connect). We have replaced the high pressure injection pump along with necessary seals and gaskets. Have replaced fuel pressure and fuel regulator, all tested fuel pressure within specifications. We have done screen, oscilloscope, crank sensor and cam sensor shots all within specifications. . Have done voltage drop test on wiring.

KevinGary · Mar 22, 2019

They have done quite a bit.

Smashed Ixnay · Apr 8, 2019

Did you start your lemon process? If so, what did you do? My car has not been in a shop as long as yours but I’m right at a month and the same fault keeps coming up every time they “fix” it for the same thing. It’s been 4x now and a few days from being in the shop for a month now.

KevinGary · Apr 8, 2019

I hope that this is not the start of a trend.

MBQ · Apr 8, 2019

Smashed Ixnay said:
Did you start your lemon process? If so, what did you do? My car has not been in a shop as long as yours but I’m right at a month and the same fault keeps coming up every time they “fix” it for the same thing. It’s been 4x now and a few days from being in the shop for a month now.

I am waiting for Porsche commitment center to call me back to discuss the issue. They said they would figure out what's going on and would call me sometime last week. But the person who was in charge was out of the office the whole week. In the meantime, the dealer still has not repaired the HPFP issue and it's been in the shop for almost 3 months. It's quite frustrating!

MBQ · Apr 9, 2019

Well just got a phone call from Porsche and discussed with the lady(Porsche commitment center)about the numbers for which the car will be bought back.

Caveat emptor! If your car went through the same situation, you do have the rights for it to be made good and VW/Audi/Porsche owes it to you!

Smashed Ixnay · Apr 9, 2019

Great to hear! Now I’m really interested in hearing about the next fix for my car if there is a way out!

kjclow · Apr 9, 2019

Glad to hear you're getting a good response. Too bad it's at the expense of your TDI.

MBQ · Apr 9, 2019

Yeah, it sucks to lose a TDI like this but the emission repair did make the car significantly worse performance wise(Q7 too), plus going through all this agony, so I probably won't miss it as much as if I lose it before the emission repair.

Mythdoc · Apr 9, 2019

MBQ said:
Yeah, it sucks to lose a TDI like this but the emission repair did make the car significantly worse performance wise(Q7 too), plus going through all this agony, so I probably won't miss it as much as if I lose it before the emission repair.

Seems like the fair outcome to me. Hope they follow through on the deal.

KevinGary · Apr 11, 2019

MBQ said:
Yeah, it sucks to lose a TDI like this but the emission repair did make the car significantly worse performance wise(Q7 too), plus going through all this agony, so I probably won't miss it as much as if I lose it before the emission repair.

Please share the purchase price if they buy it back.

MBQ · Apr 12, 2019

KevinGary said:
Please share the purchase price if they buy it back.

The amount offered is the Gen2 buyback amount minus money paid.

Meanwhile I was just told by the dealer that the car finally started and is running after a good three months!

Mythdoc · Apr 12, 2019

MBQ said:
The amount offered is the Gen2 buyback amount minus money paid.

Meanwhile I was just told by the dealer that the car finally started and is running after a good three months!

Sounds like you hold all the cards. I know what I’d choose!

KevinGary · Apr 12, 2019

MBQ said:
The amount offered is the Gen2 buyback amount minus money paid.
!

Amazing deal!

Is this the first 3.0L TDI Gen 2 buyback, potentially?

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