Electric vehicles (EVs), their emissions, and future viability

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Oilerlord

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Gotta ramp up for 500K+ Model 3's hitting the streets I suppose.

Still, the amount of money Tesla burns is incredible. Based on it's stock price, Tesla is a $51B company but with just $4B in net tangible assets, that lost nearly $2B dollars since 2015, and investors seem to have absolutely no problem with the company losing an average ~$275M per quarter going forward - just to keep the lights on. Tesla has a pipeline to a seemingly endless supply of cash for projects like the one above.
 

VeeDubTDI

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oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Our Ford jobber magazine showed up yesterday.... C-max is dead. Poor sales.

But the F-150 is alive and well, and the plants are running at capacity.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
C-Max is alive and kicking in Europe, we just never got the hybrid versions (the hybrids never had the C-Max's signature second row seating arrangement anyway)
So is the diesel Golf, the diesel Focus, ANY Volkswagen truck/van/transporter, and about 100 other models we cannot buy.
 

German_1er_diesel

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So is the diesel Golf, the diesel Focus, ANY Volkswagen truck/van/transporter, and about 100 other models we cannot buy.
And the Grand C-Max, the B-Max, the S-Max, the Galaxy, the Transit/Tourneo Courier, the Transit/Tourneo Custom, the Fiesta (with a new 120-hp diesel), the Mondeo wagon/hatch, the diesel-only European-marked Edge...
 

bhtooefr

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Note that the C-Max in the US was positioned as a weird-and-different Prius-fighter, a category that's never worked well outside of the Prius itself. (The Gen 1 Insight sold well, but then it was actually very different from the Prius, and the Gen 2 Insight was an almost total flop.)

And then the C-Max had a fuel economy scandal.

I think Ford would've been much better off just putting that hybrid system in the Escape (Kuga) in the first place, figuring out a rear motor or some way to drive the rear axle mechanically to offer AWD, and rating it honestly (not using the Fusion numbers inappropriately) - the Escape Hybrid had sold rather well due to the increasing crossover market before it was effectively replaced with the C-Max, and the US market is allergic to anything even adjacent to a minivan, unless it looks like a SUV.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Sad because the C-max hybrid is a superior driving car to the Prius, even if it does use more fuel (it should, it is heavier, has a bigger engine, and is WAY faster). It actually fits full sized humans well, has a far less disconnected feel in its braking, handles well too.

But Ford just can't sell them. The Fiesta is dead too.

Hey, at least we still get the Focus... and the new RS model is AWD, 350hp, and MANual transmission only! :D
 

turbocharged798

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Our Ford jobber magazine showed up yesterday.... C-max is dead. Poor sales.

But the F-150 is alive and well, and the plants are running at capacity.
That's I see on the roads now, brand new F150s, exploders, suburbans, ect. Gas is cheap now....seems people have such short term memory.
 

RabbitGTI

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Gotta ramp up for 500K+ Model 3's hitting the streets I suppose.

Still, the amount of money Tesla burns is incredible. Based on it's stock price, Tesla is a $51B company but with just $4B in net tangible assets, that lost nearly $2B dollars since 2015, and investors seem to have absolutely no problem with the company losing an average ~$275M per quarter going forward - just to keep the lights on. Tesla has a pipeline to a seemingly endless supply of cash for projects like the one above.
Next bond offering might not go so well.
 

oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Tesla reminds me of the Church of Scientology... you know there must be something else going on behind closed doors, you just don't really know exactly what that something is. :p
 

251

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Tesla reminds me of the Church of Scientology... you know there must be something else going on behind closed doors, you just don't really know exactly what that something is. :p
Maybe Elon Musk jumps up and down on a couch like Tom Cruise? :p
 

2015vwgolfdiesel

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I am ignorant on Tesla and all the EV stuff.

....but their finances reminds me of the tulip bulb debacle centuries ago
 

turbobrick240

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Tesla reminds me of the Church of Scientology... you know there must be something else going on behind closed doors, you just don't really know exactly what that something is. :p
Except Elon is far more likely to introduce us to extraterrestrial civilizations than L Ron. :D
 

VeeDubTDI

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We test drove a 2015 Model S 85D last night. It was fantastic, but I have issues with rear seat passenger comfort. The Passat is definitely better in this category.

Of course, the Model S's closest competitor is the Audi A7, which I have the same rear seat comfort issues with.
 

Oilerlord

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We test drove a 2015 Model S 85D last night. It was fantastic
That was our experience too. I sat in a Model X for the first time at a mall in Scottsdale. Damn that's a nice SUV but I can't justify the price tag.
 

Oilerlord

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Tesla reminds me of the Church of Scientology... you know there must be something else going on behind closed doors, you just don't really know exactly what that something is. :p
Interesting comparison, and strangely enough may not be too far off the mark. Watch the audience at any event where Elon Musk is giving a keynote speech. The audience is hanging on every word he says, and has the distinct impression of a pastor giving a sermon to the congregation. Watching the audience gives you the feeling that people in that crowd are more about being "believers", than merely customers. I think that a lot of people view Elon Musk as some sort of Messiah. Kind of creepy.
 

nwdiver

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Watching the audience gives you the feeling that people in that crowd are more about being "believers", than merely customers.
Except Hubbard wrote about spaceships and Elon actually built them ;)
 

turbobrick240

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Interesting comparison, and strangely enough may not be too far off the mark. Watch the audience at any event where Elon Musk is giving a keynote speech. The audience is hanging on every word he says, and has the distinct impression of a pastor giving a sermon to the congregation. Watching the audience gives you the feeling that people in that crowd are more about being "believers", than merely customers. I think that a lot of people view Elon Musk as some sort of Messiah. Kind of creepy.
Well, he certainly is very admired by the brightest minds in the tech industry. But you can find plenty of Russian trolls and flat earthers who hold the opposite view of him. Sometimes I like to read the comment section following an RT article on SpaceX for a laugh. There are actually lots of people who think there is an impenetrable dome in the sky, believe it or not. Funny stuff.
 

Oilerlord

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There's a difference between admiration and adoration. I can admire the guy for what he's accomplished, but I don't think spreading the Word of Elon as a faithful disciple is a necessary prerequisite.
 
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nwdiver

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There's a difference between admiration and adoration. I can admire the guy for what he's accomplished, but I don't think spreading the Word of Elon as a faithful disciple is a necessary prerequisite.
I think 'grateful' is the best description. But then that's mostly from people that accept the scientific consensus on climate change. Tesla is Plan A. Space X is Plan B.
 

Oilerlord

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I think 'grateful' is the best description. But then that's mostly from people that accept the scientific consensus on climate change. Tesla is Plan A. Space X is Plan B.
^^^

Exhibit A.) Elon Faithful Disciple.

Believe the Word of Elon. Spread the Word of Elon. If others ask questions, or otherwise raise a few concerns about the long term viability of Tesla or humans colonizing Mars - they shall be herewith labeled as Suppressive Persons, and enemies of the religion.

Personally, I'd expect Elon to be grateful to investors for pouring billions of dollars into his ventures, and to the customers who buy his products. I suppose the truly faithful see it differently than I do. I only admire the guy. Guess that doesn't measure up. No matter, I'm not much into signing billion year contracts.
 

Oilerlord

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"Tesla is Plan A. Space X is Plan B".

Sounds a lot more like beliefs than accepted "facts". Do we assume that should either Plan A or Plan B fail - we're doomed? I really hope the fate of mankind isn't in the hands of one person named Elon.

Oilhammer may be onto something. Who knows what's going on behind closed doors at Tesla.
 
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