Chevy Cruze Eco MPG

PlaneCrazy

Top Post Dawg
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Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
If Ford can build an entire V-8 gasser for their pickups for about $750 (under $1,000 for sure) how much can a VW 2.0 cost?
HPFP cam follower: 40 bucks. Damage to camshaft caused by HPFP cam follower, $2000+

Another brilliant VW engine that was within an inch of what it should have been... only to be ruined by a $40 part.

I got lucky on mine, I put 100,000 miles on it no problems before trading it. Some weren't so lucky.
 

deezelpower

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Feb 18, 2004
Location
Martha Lake, WA
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2004 Jetta TDI, 2015 Audi Q7 TDI
Getting back on topic...

Let's not ignore the laws of physics. A gallon of diesel has ~30% more energy than gasoline, so the automakers must make their engines as efficient as possible. There's no question with the new direct-injection, variable valve timing and turbocharging (+supercharging, in the case of VW), gassers have made great strides in efficiency in recent years. It amazes me that even the cheapest car Hyundai makes employs direct-injection and VVT. 40 MPG highway is the reward.

Diesels are being hurt by the emission laws (DPF, regen cycles, etc.) so the gap is shrinking quick. Compression ignition and high compression (thermodynamics) plays into the hand of the diesel for allowing higher efficiency in heavy load conditions. It's a near guarantee that trying to tow a 1000 lbs trailer with the Cruze Eco will royally KILL the mileage on the freeway, whereas it just shaves ~5 MPG from a TDI.

Same reason you never see a towing hitch on a Prius, unless it's used for a bike carrier.
 

nicklockard

Torque Dorque
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Location
Arizona
TDI
SOLD 2010 Touareg Tdi w/factory Tow PCKG
Getting back on topic...

Let's not ignore the laws of physics. A gallon of diesel has ~30% more energy than gasoline, so the automakers must make their engines as efficient as possible. There's no question with the new direct-injection, variable valve timing and turbocharging (+supercharging, in the case of VW), gassers have made great strides in efficiency in recent years. It amazes me that even the cheapest car Hyundai makes employs direct-injection and VVT. 40 MPG highway is the reward.

Diesels are being hurt by the emission laws (DPF, regen cycles, etc.) so the gap is shrinking quick. Compression ignition and high compression (thermodynamics) plays into the hand of the diesel for allowing higher efficiency in heavy load conditions. It's a near guarantee that trying to tow a 1000 lbs trailer with the Cruze Eco will royally KILL the mileage on the freeway, whereas it just shaves ~5 MPG from a TDI.

Same reason you never see a towing hitch on a Prius, unless it's used for a bike carrier.
Diesel's heating value ranges from 7% to 12% more than gasoline, depending on whether you're talking about winter or summer diesel.

http://www.afdc.energy.gov/afdc/pdfs/fueltable.pdf



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 

deezelpower

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2004 Jetta TDI, 2015 Audi Q7 TDI
Sorry, you're right -- I was thinking of the mileage difference between equivalent gassers and diesels, which is usually in the 25-35% range.
 

tdi90hp

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Canuckland
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nicklockard

Torque Dorque
Joined
Aug 15, 2004
Location
Arizona
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SOLD 2010 Touareg Tdi w/factory Tow PCKG
The news is that the supposed "25%-35% better mpg" is actually twice that at 58% better miles-per-gallon.

The 25%-35% often quoted is misleading and wrong. Even here. It's 58% better MPG but that translates into 37% less gallons consumed per mile.

My point is that the press are mathematically challenged, and no one ever questions these "facts" by simple examination of using your 5th grade math skills. That's the news. Critical thinking skills are sorely missing in our society. Even here.
 

PlaneCrazy

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Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
The news is that the supposed "25%-35% better mpg" is actually twice that at 58% better miles-per-gallon.

The 25%-35% often quoted is misleading and wrong. Even here. It's 58% better MPG but that translates into 37% less gallons consumed per mile.

My point is that the press are mathematically challenged, and no one ever questions these "facts" by simple examination of using your 5th grade math skills. That's the news. Critical thinking skills are sorely missing in our society. Even here.
Another reason why I prefer fuel consumption over fuel economy.
 

Ski in NC

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Joined
Jul 7, 2008
Location
Wilmington, NC USA
TDI
2001 Jetta ALH 5sp stock
MPG is a truly crappy way to represent fuel economy.

Big difference between 15 and 20mpg. In 1000kmile driving, delta is 13gal

Very little difference between 40 and 50mpg. In 1000kmile driving, delta is 5gal.

I'd like to see the epa mileage numbers displayed in gal/1000mile. Or in metric, l/1000km. I think l/100km makes the numbers look too small. Folks need to see the big fuel burn numbers for the reality to sink in.


TDI (38mpg)

26.3gal/1000mile

SUV (16mpg)

62.5gal/1000mile

Avg miles per month is about 1000, typical. Folks can think in terms of a month.

TDI (at $4/gal): $105/mo

SUV (at $3.80/gal): $237/mo

Delta is about a third of a typical car payment, or about the same as Iphone bill (??)

No real point in this, just tired of typing the work thing I should be doing.
 

rotarykid

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Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Piedmont of N.C. & the plains of Colorado
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1997 Passat TDI White,99.5 Blue Jetta TDI
MPG is a truly crappy way to represent fuel economy.

Big difference between 15 and 20mpg. In 1000kmile driving, delta is 13gal

Very little difference between 40 and 50mpg. In 1000kmile driving, delta is 5gal.

I'd like to see the epa mileage numbers displayed in gal/1000mile. Or in metric, l/1000km. I think l/100km makes the numbers look too small. Folks need to see the big fuel burn numbers for the reality to sink in.


TDI (38mpg)

26.3gal/1000mile

SUV (16mpg)

62.5gal/1000mile

Avg miles per month is about 1000, typical. Folks can think in terms of a month.

TDI (at $4/gal): $105/mo

SUV (at $3.80/gal): $237/mo

Delta is about a third of a typical car payment, or about the same as Iphone bill (??)

No real point in this, just tired of typing the work thing I should be doing.
Most suvs or pickups may be rated ~15 but the reality of most is far less real world. And we all know the EPA rating on our diesels is underestamated by at least 30 % real world. So if you want to do a comparrison that is actually helpful the numbers should be,

42-45+ mpgUS for the diesel / 9-13 or less mpgUS are good numbers for most full size puckups and SUVs.

REal world it's more like 40-55+ % better fuel economy for the diesel.
 

rotarykid

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 27, 2003
Location
Piedmont of N.C. & the plains of Colorado
TDI
1997 Passat TDI White,99.5 Blue Jetta TDI
2003 Jetta GLS Tdi 5m 38mpg
2003 Jetta GLS 2.0 5m 24mpg

Figures from http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymodel/2003_Volkswagen_Jetta.shtml

38/24 = 58.3% better mpg = 36.9% less fuel consumed per mile
The 2003 jetta TDI 5 spd man was EPA rated a concervative 42 city / 49 highway sedan, 42 city / 50 highway for the wagon. It is hard to make one of these get lower than the mid 40s in the worst of conditions. And with very little effort low to mids 50s are well within reach............
 

BadMonKey

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Location
Colorado
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2013 Focus ST
Most suvs or pickups may be rated ~15 but the reality of most is far less real world. And we all know the EPA rating on our diesels is underestamated by at least 30 % real world. So if you want to do a comparrison that is actually helpful the numbers should be,

42-45+ mpgUS for the diesel / 9-13 or less mpgUS are good numbers for most full size puckups and SUVs.
He's using the mpg's on the latest TDI model which isn't 40+mpg in any world.

Pretty much every 1/2 ton available today is 16-19mpg, i have a lifetime average of 17.7mpg with my 04 GMC 1/2 ton 5.3L.
 

rotarykid

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Joined
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Location
Piedmont of N.C. & the plains of Colorado
TDI
1997 Passat TDI White,99.5 Blue Jetta TDI
He's using the mpg's on the latest TDI model which isn't 40+mpg in any world.

Pretty much every 1/2 ton available today is 16-19mpg, i have a lifetime average of 17.7mpg with my 04 GMC 1/2 ton 5.3L.
Even the DSG equipped Passat TDIs today are reporting mid 40s mpgUS, owners of the manual Passat TDIs today are reporting high 40s to above 50 mpgUS.

Manual trans Jetta's and Golf's with the current TDI are clocking above 40 into the low 40s mpgUS in all types of loops. So these numbers are not out of line. If you go with a DSG then yes your numbers are going be lower but not likely ever as low as the current clueless epa rating!!
 

Softrockrenegade

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Howellbama, NJ
TDI
None...2011 Golf DSG (replaced by VW W/) 2013 Passat SE 6M(bought back) Current 2017 sportwagen TSI 4Motion.
I don't understand all this "new" gasser tech that gets "up to" 40mpg on the highway..... My 94 Mazda pos beater with 200k gets 32-33 50/50 mixed driving and easily 36-38 straight highway ! I don't see the big leap in technology .... Emissions I suppose ???

She's a beauty ...LOL . I guess the 90's was just the pinnacle of economy meets simplicity !
 
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supton

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Joined
May 25, 2004
Location
Central NH (USA)
TDI
'04 Jetta Wagon GLS
Bah, L/km, km/L, mpg vs L/100km... In the end, I don't take trips in round increments of 100miles, 100km nor 1,000km. So no matter what, I wind up having to do math to figure out a trip will cost in fuel, or what my monthly cost will be.
 

MPBsr

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Location
NJ
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2009 TDI....Traded in
Unfort those cars like the ones in the 80's who got great mpg were also death traps.
 

BadMonKey

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2007
Location
Colorado
TDI
2013 Focus ST
Even the DSG equipped Passat TDIs today are reporting mid 40s mpgUS, owners of the manual Passat TDIs today are reporting high 40s to above 50 mpgUS.

Manual trans Jetta's and Golf's with the current TDI are clocking above 40 into the low 40s mpgUS in all types of loops. So these numbers are not out of line. If you go with a DSG then yes your numbers are going be lower but not likely ever as low as the current clueless epa rating!!
OK in your inflated world they are:rolleyes: I simple check in something like fuelly will show you they aren't averaging that high.

I will agree the epa numbers are still slightly inflated on hybrids and slightly deflated on diesels but they aren't that far off any more for what the average driver would see.
 

rotarykid

Top Post Dawg
Joined
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Location
Piedmont of N.C. & the plains of Colorado
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1997 Passat TDI White,99.5 Blue Jetta TDI
OK in your inflated world they are:rolleyes: I simple check in something like fuelly will show you they aren't averaging that high.

I will agree the epa numbers are still slightly inflated on hybrids and slightly deflated on diesels but they aren't that far off any more for what the average driver would see.

You know as well as I do that the EPA has admitted that the current light duty diesel test is off by at a minimum 19 % and as much as 29 % from real world.

Do you dispute that the previous test was more in line with reality but still a little low?? Have you owned an ALH or 1Z powered car?? I have owned and clocked many miles in both. I have close friends with models still powered by these engines. And neither of these even when flogged will come close the lower numbers in the old test. And the current adjusted numbers on a 5 spd manual version of these are down right laughable they are so far underestimated below real world.

I also have more than a few miles clocked in a DSG and manual TDI-PD so can speak from real world records of how far off the current adjusted numbers are on this power train. I have driven and kept records on the current Golf TDI-CR and can say the current epa rating is off by at least 20 % low on the highway and mixed loop, more on the city rating.

WE all here know how much you hated your VW TDI-PD so are always in the bleachers when it comes to bashing the current VW diesels. I am truly sorry you had such a bad experience with your PD, but come on how long are you going to hold on to anger at VW...........

I also have years of first hand knowledge of those clown cars known as hybrids. They cost way too much and never in the real world come close to reaching the over estimated EPA rating.

So when I speak on real world mpgs I speak from miles I have data logs for, not going by fuely. So until you actually get behind the wheel of one the current TDI-CRs and clock some miles sorry but your bashing of diesels singing the praises of the current less than useless epa test on light duty diesels really doesn't hold any water.........
 

Grievous Angel

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OK in your inflated world they are:rolleyes: I simple check in something like fuelly will show you they aren't averaging that high.

I will agree the epa numbers are still slightly inflated on hybrids and slightly deflated on diesels but they aren't that far off any more for what the average driver would see.
Did you filter the jetta by the diesel engine on fuelly?

The gassers bring the "jetta" average way down.
 

Grievous Angel

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Location
Tuscaloosa, AL
TDI
2012 Jetta TDI (traded after Diesel-Gate)
He's using the mpg's on the latest TDI model which isn't 40+mpg in any world.
Wrong. I am personally 45mpg after 10k . . with the automatic.

I wonder--how many of us bother to find an Eco Cruze board (if such a thing even exists) and extol the virtues of the TDI over there, seeking some sort of validation?

Jesus Christ enough already. I just bought. I was aware of the Cruze, the Prius, the various other Hybrids and japanese econo sh--boxes.

I wanted a car that got out of this world mileage in an attractive, comfortable, button down driver's car. I got that and more.
 

tdi90hp

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Location
Canuckland
TDI
2011 Golf TDI 6 speed(gone but NEVER forgotten)
Wrong. I am personally 45mpg after 10k . . with the automatic.

I wonder--how many of us bother to find an Eco Cruze board (if such a thing even exists) and extol the virtues of the TDI over there, seeking some sort of validation?

Jesus Christ enough already. I just bought. I was aware of the Cruze, the Prius, the various other Hybrids and japanese econo sh--boxes.

I wanted a car that got out of this world mileage in an attractive, comfortable, button down driver's car. I got that and more.
that is the beauty of this board...discussion is wide ranging. You made a GREAT choice getting your new car but does not stop us from noting interesting things and facts from competitors does it?
 

GoFaster

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Jun 16, 1999
Location
Brampton, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
I've got a US-spec 2012 Ford Focus hatch as a rental car for a few days (business trip).

Generally, I like the car. Despite all the fuss concerning Ford's Powershift transmission, to me it seems fine. Very quiet and comfortable. Good brakes, seems to have plenty of grip when cornering. The steering isn't quite a match for a VW Golf but it's certainly no Corolla, either. (Far, far closer to the Golf than the Corolla.) The view out the rear is terrible but on the other hand, the outside mirrors are really good. It has built-in wide-angle mirrors in the corner on each side - never seen that as original equipment before.

But ... for fuel consumption, it is no match for a TDI. Not even close.

Trip computer says 31.3 mpg (US) and I have not figured out how to either reset it or figure out when the last time was that it was reset. I've driven it about 200 mi and the fuel gauge is showing a bit above half. I'll find out the actual consumption tomorrow when I return it but I reckon it's going to be not far from the trip-computer average.

The US numbers are gibberish to me, but 31.3 mpg US = 7.51 L/100 km, which is not bad for a gasser with an auto tranny, but my TDI would be using 5.5 ...
 

albow77

Active member
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Location
sioux falls sd
TDI
12 Cruze Eco manual
Well I have just under 5k one the Cruze. I have regapped the spark plugs, raised the tire pressure to 45 psi and running most of the time 87 oct non eth gas. I just got my record high MPG of 44.7 hand calculated. The thing is I drive no faster than 65 MPH and I am find with that speed. The warmer weather really brought the MPGs up. Also the spark plug gap was off from factory. They should have been .033 to .037 and they were gapped to .024 - .025. After the regapping the low end torque is 100% better. The cruze is like driving a TDI now and I am loving the car. I have a 40.0 fuelly.com average for the life of the car so far!!!
 

RebelTDI

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Nov 1, 2009
Location
Boston, MA
TDI
2016 Audi Q5 TDI, 2016 BMW 535d Xdrive
I've got a US-spec 2012 Ford Focus hatch as a rental car for a few days (business trip).

Generally, I like the car. Despite all the fuss concerning Ford's Powershift transmission, to me it seems fine. Very quiet and comfortable. Good brakes, seems to have plenty of grip when cornering. The steering isn't quite a match for a VW Golf but it's certainly no Corolla, either. (Far, far closer to the Golf than the Corolla.) The view out the rear is terrible but on the other hand, the outside mirrors are really good. It has built-in wide-angle mirrors in the corner on each side - never seen that as original equipment before.

But ... for fuel consumption, it is no match for a TDI. Not even close.

Trip computer says 31.3 mpg (US) and I have not figured out how to either reset it or figure out when the last time was that it was reset. I've driven it about 200 mi and the fuel gauge is showing a bit above half. I'll find out the actual consumption tomorrow when I return it but I reckon it's going to be not far from the trip-computer average.

The US numbers are gibberish to me, but 31.3 mpg US = 7.51 L/100 km, which is not bad for a gasser with an auto tranny, but my TDI would be using 5.5 ...
I had a Ford Focus as a rental and I agree... it's a decent little car. Good road manners. I don't know the mpg and I couldn't figure out how to reset the trip computer, either. I seem to remember it reading around 31 mpg, also. I feel spoiled by the interiors of my Golf and Jetta and the interior of the Focus made me appreciate it even more. I had a Focus SE, so it wasn't bottom of the barrel. It was an automatic and when I needed to accelerate (as in merging) it really screamed, like I was flogging it. Those small gas engines are better for maintaining your momentum, as opposed to impressive acceleration.
 

MPBsr

Veteran Member
Joined
May 31, 2009
Location
NJ
TDI
2009 TDI....Traded in
Well I have just under 5k one the Cruze. I have regapped the spark plugs, raised the tire pressure to 45 psi and running most of the time 87 oct non eth gas. I just got my record high MPG of 44.7 hand calculated. The thing is I drive no faster than 65 MPH and I am find with that speed. The warmer weather really brought the MPGs up. Also the spark plug gap was off from factory. They should have been .033 to .037 and they were gapped to .024 - .025. After the regapping the low end torque is 100% better. The cruze is like driving a TDI now and I am loving the car. I have a 40.0 fuelly.com average for the life of the car so far!!!
Interesting. Maybe when I bring my Cruze (2LT 6M) in to my local shop for an oil change I'll have them check the spark plug gap. 5000 miles and so far 35.4mpg and that's about 85-90% back roads.
 

VWBeamer

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Jan 1, 2009
Location
GA
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2004 Jetta Wagon
The jetta will get 2-3 mpg better, and it's a lot faster. There is no after market for the chevy and the car will be off the market before one develops. This not counting that the resale value on a used chevy econo car is very poor.

Well I have just under 5k one the Cruze. I have regapped the spark plugs, raised the tire pressure to 45 psi and running most of the time 87 oct non eth gas. I just got my record high MPG of 44.7 hand calculated. The thing is I drive no faster than 65 MPH and I am find with that speed. The warmer weather really brought the MPGs up. Also the spark plug gap was off from factory. They should have been .033 to .037 and they were gapped to .024 - .025. After the regapping the low end torque is 100% better. The cruze is like driving a TDI now and I am loving the car. I have a 40.0 fuelly.com average for the life of the car so far!!!
 

tdi90hp

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Location
Canuckland
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2011 Golf TDI 6 speed(gone but NEVER forgotten)
The jetta will get 2-3 mpg better, and it's a lot faster. There is no after market for the chevy and the car will be off the market before one develops. This not counting that the resale value on a used chevy econo car is very poor.

off the market?? ummmmm doubt that ...chevy seems comitted to small displacement turbo to up their mileages on their small car fleet....why would this car be "off the market" ? a used econo car with a big warranty on powertrain and a good reputation with tall mileage will do just fine....this is nA sir...people buy chevs every day used. ya cobalts dont hold value cause they are cans...you simply cannot compare to a cruze.
 

PlaneCrazy

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Joined
Jan 3, 2000
Location
Province of Quebec, Canada
TDI
Gone...
off the market?? ummmmm doubt that ...chevy seems comitted to small displacement turbo to up their mileages on their small car fleet....why would this car be "off the market" ? a used econo car with a big warranty on powertrain and a good reputation with tall mileage will do just fine....this is nA sir...people buy chevs every day used. ya cobalts dont hold value cause they are cans...you simply cannot compare to a cruze.
The problem with resale on cars like the Cruze won't be whether it's a tin can or not, but how many will end up in rental fleets. Used cars from rental fleets flood the market, driving down the price. Since there aren't too many TDIs in rental fleets (or VWs for that matter), resale stays up. Simple supply-and-demand. Look at any car popular in the fleets and I can guarantee you resale will be low.

I like the small-displacement turbo formula. It was great fun in the 1.4 TSI Golf I rented last week in the UK. I wish VW did that here instead of the agricultural 2.5. Driving in the UK is intense (and fast on the motorways, 80 mph) and I still averaged around 33 mpg. On slower, straight 60 mph roads I could top 38 mpg. I'm sure in more relaxed N. American conditions I'd be able to touch 40 mpg on the highway.
 

tdi90hp

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Location
Canuckland
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The problem with resale on cars like the Cruze won't be whether it's a tin can or not, but how many will end up in rental fleets. Used cars from rental fleets flood the market, driving down the price. Since there aren't too many TDIs in rental fleets (or VWs for that matter), resale stays up. Simple supply-and-demand. Look at any car popular in the fleets and I can guarantee you resale will be low.

I like the small-displacement turbo formula. It was great fun in the 1.4 TSI Golf I rented last week in the UK. I wish VW did that here instead of the agricultural 2.5. Driving in the UK is intense (and fast on the motorways, 80 mph) and I still averaged around 33 mpg. On slower, straight 60 mph roads I could top 38 mpg. I'm sure in more relaxed N. American conditions I'd be able to touch 40 mpg on the highway.
there will be lots of LTs around but RSs and Ecos are FEW and FAR beetween....I think they will do just fine on the resale market and should hold a good percentage on trade and look like a good value.....love chevys but still love my little torquey superb 6 speed Golf BETTER.
 
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