What type of coolant?

dwilliiams

Active member
Joined
Oct 15, 2010
Location
Kansas City
TDI
2002
Hi Everyone,

Does anyone know what type of coolant I need to run in my 2002 Jetta (I believe it has an ALH engine)? Do I have to get it from the VW dealer or can I get some at a parts store? The owners manual says G12(?). Any help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Daniel
 

3800rpmDiesel

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2006
Location
Fall River, NS, Canada
TDI
'03 Jetta Wgn 5spd w/ mods, '03 Wgn 5spd stock, '05 Passat Wgn - chainless.
Yes you need G12. No other option.

Just get it from the dealer - it is not easy to find otherwise. you could order online but i suspect shipping costs would make it more feasible to just go to dealer.
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
NAPA sells it. It carries the Pentosin brand name (OES for VW).
 

Conan

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Location
Denver
TDI
2003 GLS TDI
I checked Checker/O'Reilly, AutoZone, and Advanced. No joy. Napa had something called Pentofrost (?) that didn't say G12 anywhere on it, so I just got some G12 from the dealer. It's interesting that Prestone, et al don't make a VW-approved antifreeze. They're passing up a bunch of business.
 

3800rpmDiesel

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Location
Fall River, NS, Canada
TDI
'03 Jetta Wgn 5spd w/ mods, '03 Wgn 5spd stock, '05 Passat Wgn - chainless.

TDICADDGUY

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Location
Blaine, MN
TDI
2012 BMW X5 35D
Zerex G-05 is compatible with G12 and is sometimes easier to find.

Sent from my DROID2 using Tapatalk
 

whoabeats

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 14, 2010
Location
Northern RI
TDI
98 RIP, 00 chugging along
My girlfriends ahu is running half dexcool right now and there have been 0 issues. It is also running 100% no mix amsoil synthetic power steering fluid. There have been 0 issues with either and both are considerably cheaper especially the pwrs fluid haha good luck
 

Abacus

That helpful B4 guy
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
Location
Relocated from Maine to Dewey, AZ
TDI
Only the B4V left
Hi Everyone,

Does anyone know what type of coolant I need to run in my 2002 Jetta (I believe it has an ALH engine)? Do I have to get it from the VW dealer or can I get some at a parts store? The owners manual says G12(?). Any help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Daniel

I know what was in it from the factory, but what has not been asked is what color is the coolant now?

Case in point, my brother is running green coolant in his B4 and has been since he bought it with no issues, it now has 293,000 miles on it.

If green, use green. If pink, use G-12 or G-12 compatable only. Personally I find $22 for a gallon of G-12 isn't that bad when you conisder the generic green stuff is $12 a gallon at Wal-Mart.
 

turbocharged798

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Location
Ellenville, NY
TDI
99.5 black ALH Jetta;09 Gasser Jetta
Why not just spend the extra 10 bucks and put the proper fluids in.

I don't understand why people want to put in other non-approved fluids when the OEM fluids were PROVEN to be very good.
 

whoabeats

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 14, 2010
Location
Northern RI
TDI
98 RIP, 00 chugging along
Cuz oem is not always readily available and it is cheaper to get other products. No offense its your car do what you wish but the majority of people are far too finicky about their cars. Dexcool is a fully compatible and comparable product and the amsoil actually exceeds the quality of the stock pentosin stuff.
 

prometheum

Active member
Joined
Jan 16, 2011
Location
Mojave Desert
TDI
04 Passat
Why not just spend the extra 10 bucks and put the proper fluids in.

I don't understand why people want to put in other non-approved fluids when the OEM fluids were PROVEN to be very good.
because they don't want to spend $10/liter for the stuff when cheaper stuff can offer the exact same corrosion protection?
 

Conan

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Location
Denver
TDI
2003 GLS TDI
Speaking for me, I'm highly suspect of simple chemicals that have to come as a dealer part. What would you think if you bought a Chevy Malibu that had to have antifreeze and oil, from the dealer, or void your warranty? You have to use Chevy brake fluid, or you get to buy your next motor. It looks like a racket, and it is. That being said, I bought my last antifreeze and oil at the stealer, 'cause I don't dare go against mfgrs recommendations based on internet chat.
 

turbocharged798

Veteran Member
Joined
May 21, 2009
Location
Ellenville, NY
TDI
99.5 black ALH Jetta;09 Gasser Jetta
because they don't want to spend $10/liter for the stuff when cheaper stuff can offer the exact same corrosion protection?
Do you have proof that they have the exact same chemistries? Did you send it out to a lab to be tested?

So your save $10 every 100K miles when you do the TB change? Seems hardly worth it to try to experiment.

And again, it would be a different story if the OEM coolant was not very good. But the fact is that G12 is one of THE BEST coolants on the market right now.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
GM's specs were all screwed up, that is why the Dexcool has been reformulated some 6+ times, why there have been several lawsuits over it, and why so many GM cars had so many troubles.

The newer specs are certainly better, and the newest stuff you buy in the store is probably better as well, but just because both VW and GM spec a HOAT coolant package does not mean they are the same, just like the high-end Behr paint you buy at a home center is better than the cheap stuff you buy at Wal-mart, yet both can be a white latex paint.

It is old knowledge that GM's specs were 'looser' and they did not get the additive package correct (GM themselves confirmed this). This allowed the additives to come out of suspension when exposed to air, and caused all sorts of gunking as well as damage to the non-metal parts of the cooling system, which on many GM engines was the intake gaskets themselves. Trust me, everyone working on cars for the last 15 years has all-too-often seen this damage.

Volkswagen water-cooled cars (except the Vanagon) all use a sealed cooling system; there is no 'overflow' bottle, merely the expansion tank. So technically, the coolant should never come exposed to air anyways, since the pressure release on the cap is just for an over-pressure protection, there is never any migration of coolant in and out of the pressurized part of the system like many (most) GM cars had.

So, was it all the Dexcool spec's fault that all these GM cars had trouble, or was it just the old-fashioned cooling system designs that did not play well with HOAT? Probably a little of both, however I have seen similar gunkiness in VAG products when Dexcool has been used, but I think some of that may have been from a coolant mix. I do not think Dexcool mixes well with G12, despite both being HOATs, and this can cause some issues by itself.

I think it silly to whine about what ends up being a few pennies per year owned to use the proven correct stuff that NEVER seems to gunk up at all, has never caused any class-action lawsuits, and has only been reformulated a couple times, once for some reverse-compatibility with G11 (the blue stuff, which is STILL in use by BMW and MB on many models).

For anyone that has a Dexcool problem, Permatex makes some excellent flush stuff that will clean the crud out (of a Volkswagen or a GM product ;)) . The only caveat is that it is pretty harsh stuff, so if you run across a rotten gasket or something, it WILL exploit that failure as often the crud and gunk is the only thing left holding it together. I have used it with great success to clean stuff like this:



Funny, if you look in the cooling systems of newer GM vehicles, you will actually see the newest stuff they use is pinkish, just like G12, not the orange-salmon color the Dexcool once was. I'd bet the newest stuff from the factory is very much like what Volkswagen already knew works.
 

dieseldorf

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Oct 11, 2000
Location
MA
TDI
ex- 1996 wagon, ex-2000 Jetta
The VAG-spec coolants are one of the few proprietary products that are spot on (and not in need of other "solutions"). Many of us have seen high-mileage engines apart, still on the factory fill, with absolutely spotless passageways.
 

3800rpmDiesel

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Joined
Apr 29, 2006
Location
Fall River, NS, Canada
TDI
'03 Jetta Wgn 5spd w/ mods, '03 Wgn 5spd stock, '05 Passat Wgn - chainless.
The VAG-spec coolants are one of the few proprietary products that are spot on (and not in need of other "solutions"). Many of us have seen high-mileage engines apart, still on the factory fill, with absolutely spotless passageways.
What does 'VAG-spec' mean? and/or 'VAG' stand for?
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Volkswagen, AG. (sometimes refered to as 'VWAG'). This is the very large company, known as the Volkswagen Group, which includes Volkswagen, Audi, Seat, Skoda, Bentley, Bugatti, Lamborghini, part of Scania, MAN, Suzuki, and is now merged with Porsche.


Usually when we say 'VAG' it means Volkswagen Group automobiles, not necessarily just VW-branded ones.

VAG spec means the specifications by which Volkswagen wants their products' replacement parts and materials to adhere to for proper operation.

In this case, VAG coolant specs are:

G12: TL 744 F
G12++: TL 774 G

And of course, we all know the oil specs VAG uses (502.00, 505.00, etc.)
 
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whoabeats

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 14, 2010
Location
Northern RI
TDI
98 RIP, 00 chugging along
I am not dismissing anything the people on here with more experience have as input. When it came down to it considering the coolant last so long it is a good idea to get the recommended fluids. I just hate companies getting away with charging a lot because they can. And I dont really understand why vw's and other European cars are so picky about what fluids are used. I could use the cheapest crappiest fluids everywhere in my truck and still expect a solid 400+k miles out of it.
 

Powder Hound

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Joined
Oct 25, 1999
Location
Under a Bridge, Crestview, FL, USA
TDI
'00 Golf 4dr White 5sp, '02 Jettachero 5sp, Wife's '03 NB Platinum Gray auto(!)
...
I think it silly to whine about what ends up being a few pennies per year...
If that's all it was, I'd not ever complain. But if the instructions from the maintenance crazies around here were followed to the extent to which they scream, then the actual difference would probably be on the order of hundreds of dollars per year.

I use fluids which I find to be superior in performance for half the cost of VW fluids (e.g. Redline MTL in my transaxles). Some of them are only similar in performance, Dexcool being one of them, but the cost is still half.

If I had experienced any instance of the problems that people such as OH decry as being caused by Dexcool, I would line right up and say don't use it. However, my experience has not been anything other that fine performance.

So am I to bend to the whiny nay-saying of people who are paranoid of the slightest problem? Again, without seeing such problems from people on the forum, then no. OH's photos to the contrary, it wasn't from a VW and it wasn't from mixing G12 et.al and Dexcool. The real whining is starting to sound really boring. And none of it comes from people who really use Dexcool.

So do what you want. If you are dying to pay double what you need to, then do so. I don't know of anyone shopping to try and pay the most they can for fuel, so why would I adopt that failing strategy for anything else? Does anyone say, "Everyone come to our GTG unless you use Dexcool?" Or, how about: "If you pay less than $100 for a front wheel bearing, then don't come by my house!" Sounds silly, doesn't it? So why the bother about G12 vs Dexcool? Why claim that you should not use a fluid that has not been shown to be a problem in this application?

I have asked previously for actual real proof of any of the assertions that Dexcool is a problem in a VW TDI, since I have experienced none in the 10 years that Dexcool has been in use in my cars. I have yet to receive any. Even the guy (OH) that has a photo of a problem (a real problem, not a photo of someone who poured urethane pour foam in a coolant recovery tank and claimed it was coolant) hasn't shown an example of a problem with this fluid in a VW.
:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

Vince Waldon

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 25, 2009
Location
Edmonton AB Canada
TDI
2001 ALH Jetta, 2003 ALH Wagon, 2005 BEW Wagon
since I have experienced none in the 10 years that Dexcool has been in use in my cars.
Again I'll ask: have you been running 100% Dexcool in any given VW engine, or adding it to engines already containing G12?

My guess: just about any coolant... including evil green... will probably run fine for some years in our engines... particularly at 100%.

Whether it's safe to add a different coolant to an engine already containing G12 is a different issue... we do know evil green will form a precipiate the presence of G12 for example. There's "what coolant will work in my car without trouble" vs. "what coolant won't cause precipitation when added to G12".

And, not saying Dexcool will precipitate out in the presence of G12... indeed, that's why I'm asking. ;-)
 
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oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
So, unless I show a picture of a Volkswagen's coolant bottle full of gunk, the problem does not exist, huh? But then if I did, someone would probably say it was "rigged". It never ends.... :rolleyes:

(BTW, they've been posted here before....)

And if you are spending 'hundreds' of dollars per year on fluids, you must have a lot of leaks. G12 costs most people about $20 every 100k miles. Has anyone driven 500,000+ miles in one year? Anyone? Bueller????
 
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Abacus

That helpful B4 guy
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
Location
Relocated from Maine to Dewey, AZ
TDI
Only the B4V left
My guess: just about any coolant... including evil green... will probably run fine for some years in our engines... particularly at 100%.

;-)
As stated before, my brother has always run the "evil green" (at 100%) in his B4 and is now has over 293,000 miles on it with no problems at all. And he never changes his water pump. He subscribes to the addage "if it's not broken, don't fix it". He says "if it leaks, then we'll change it"...easy to do when your brother (that would be me) does your timing belts and has the correct tools.

I, on the other hand, have replaced 3 water pumps in the last 45K due to 2 new ones failing, and I am running only G12+. Granted one leaked and the other spun the shaft, but both were supposedly top-quality parts.

But I am also at a quandry if you can add Dexcool or another product to the G12+. I saw some posts awhile back, but cannot remember if conclusively it was a problem or not.
 
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