Calling all Malone tuned and Deleted 2.0L TDI owners and/or experts!

buyingconstant7 · Jan 24, 2016

As I wait for my 2013 Jetta TDI to get out of warranty, I can only wonder what deleting the SOB will be like. I plan to go for the Rawetek Delete kit for the DPF and EGR with a straight pipe but keeping the original muffler and outlets. I don't want a full straight pipe because of drone and unwanted noise.

As for the Malone tune, what would be the best tune to get? Stage 1, 1.5 or 2? I heard stage 2, you burn more fuel and have dangerously high EGT temps on the highway, cruising. Is this true?

Also, doing conservative driving, did your fuel economy improve? Any issues to report? And how much am I looking at for a reputable shop to do the Malone tune, and rip out the emissions junk and put in the Rawetek system?

jackbombay · Jan 24, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
I heard stage 2, you burn more fuel and have dangerously high EGT temps on the highway, cruising. Is this true?

There is absolutely zero chance this is true.

EGTs go up because more fuel is being burned, to cruise at 65 MPH requires X amount of fuel, the fact that you *can* burn more fuel at WOT has no effect on what happens at %15 of WOT.

Theoretically you'll get a slight decrease of EGT as I imagine the injection timing is advanced a touch...

turbobrick240 · Jan 24, 2016

You'll need a stage 2 tune if you delete the dpf. Typically fuel consumption and egt both decrease with a stage 2 delete tune. So you have been misinformed.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 24, 2016

turbobrick240 said:
You'll need a stage 2 tune if you delete the dpf. Typically fuel consumption and egt both decrease with a stage 2 delete tune. So you have been misinformed.

I can't do stage 1 or 1.5 with a DPF delete? That's what Malone advertises. I though stage 2 was just a power increase.

jackbombay · Jan 24, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
I can't do stage 1 or 1.5 with a DPF delete? That's what Malone advertises.

I'm sure that's what he sells then, if you have any doubt why not just e-mail him and ask?

turbobrick240 · Jan 24, 2016

Yeah, come to think of it, you probably can get a stage 1 econo tune. I think just about everyone who does the delete gets stage 2 or better though. I guess some dsg folks who don't want to shell out for a dsg tune might get the stage 1 econo tune.

BuzzKen · Jan 25, 2016

We can do any of the tunes with or without dpf delete.

peobryant · Jan 26, 2016

After deleting my car I noticed a slight increase in mpg, maybe 2-3mpg. I went with a full 3 inch straight pipe from the turbo back along with a Malone stage II tune and I absolutely love it. At highway speeds just cruising the car isn't any louder than stock from inside the cabin but when you give it some throttle the little 4 cylinder sounds fantastic. There is a lot more turbo whistle near idle and lower rpm which I love as well.

Perhaps more importantly though, it completely solved my intercooler icing issue which is more than worth the price of admission.

Personally I'd go with the stage II tune, especially with a manual. My clutch is holding up perfectly fine after about 16K miles deleted and tuned (about 116K miles on the clutch total) but I do get a bit of shudder if I give the car full throttle at around 1600 RPM in top gear. Keep it higher than that or pick a lower gear and everything is perfect.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

peobryant said:
After deleting my car I noticed a slight increase in mpg, maybe 2-3mpg. I went with a full 3 inch straight pipe from the turbo back along with a Malone stage II tune and I absolutely love it. At highway speeds just cruising the car isn't any louder than stock from inside the cabin but when you give it some throttle the little 4 cylinder sounds fantastic. There is a lot more turbo whistle near idle and lower rpm which I love as well.

Perhaps more importantly though, it completely solved my intercooler icing issue which is more than worth the price of admission.

Personally I'd go with the stage II tune, especially with a manual. My clutch is holding up perfectly fine after about 16K miles deleted and tuned (about 116K miles on the clutch total) but I do get a bit of shudder if I give the car full throttle at around 1600 RPM in top gear. Keep it higher than that or pick a lower gear and everything is perfect.

Finally an answer I was looking for! Only 2-3mpg? These engines must not care that much then with the emissions junk on it or off. How's the smoke? And it feels very powerful? And did you do the install yourself or did you get a shop to do it?

belome · Jan 26, 2016

http://forums.tdiclub.com/forumdisplay.php?f=13

peobryant · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
Finally an answer I was looking for! Only 2-3mpg? These engines must not care that much then with the emissions junk on it or off. How's the smoke? And it feels very powerful? And did you do the install yourself or did you get a shop to do it?

From what I can recall it was 2-3mpg, maybe a bit more. When the car was stock my best tank average was 51mpg, since deleting the car I've easily hit 54mpg over a tank and that is with a few WOT pulls every week, if I drove it really conservatively I'm sure I could eek out some more mpg but it is too damn fun to stay off the throttle. My daily commute (or nightly I guess, since I'm third shift) is basically a little over 30 miles on the interstate, before tuning my best trip average was about 56mpg via the computer, after the tune I've hit almost 67mpg for the 35ish mile trip.

The smoke isn't bad but after a week or so of driving, especially after some hard 3rd and 4th gear pulls, the bumper near the exhaust is pretty black. Not nearly as bad as my Cummins but it is definitely noticeable.

It definitely feels more powerful than stock. It isn't like it throws you back in your seat but it will definitely push you back and you can notice the difference in power delivery. Personally I love the way the car sounds straight piped, I set the cruise to 68-70mph on my way to work, turn on some Led Zeppelin and I can't hear the car at all. If I feel like some spirited driving though, I can take a back road, row through the gears and the car sounds fantastic.

I had a local guru do the install for me. I'm a 12 Valve Cummins guy, these new fangled computers are a little too complicated for my taste, especially since I only had the car for about 5 months before I tuned it.

Cptcrnch · Jan 26, 2016

Definitely subscribing to this thread. I Plan on having Les/GDM do this to my '14 in March when the tax man gives me money back. Having searched the forum for past threads about it reveals lots of happy owners. I expect more of the Sam from this thread.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

peobryant said:
From what I can recall it was 2-3mpg, maybe a bit more. When the car was stock my best tank average was 51mpg, since deleting the car I've easily hit 54mpg over a tank and that is with a few WOT pulls every week, if I drove it really conservatively I'm sure I could eek out some more mpg but it is too damn fun to stay off the throttle. My daily commute (or nightly I guess, since I'm third shift) is basically a little over 30 miles on the interstate, before tuning my best trip average was about 56mpg via the computer, after the tune I've hit almost 67mpg for the 35ish mile trip.
The smoke isn't bad but after a week or so of driving, especially after some hard 3rd and 4th gear pulls, the bumper near the exhaust is pretty black. Not nearly as bad as my Cummins but it is definitely noticeable.
It definitely feels more powerful than stock. It isn't like it throws you back in your seat but it will definitely push you back and you can notice the difference in power delivery. Personally I love the way the car sounds straight piped, I set the cruise to 68-70mph on my way to work, turn on some Led Zeppelin and I can't hear the car at all. If I feel like some spirited driving though, I can take a back road, row through the gears and the car sounds fantastic.
I had a local guru do the install for me. I'm a 12 Valve Cummins guy, these new fangled computers are a little too complicated for my taste, especially since I only had the car for about 5 months before I tuned it.

Well that gives me lots of confidence then. I think I'll just keep the original muffler and exhaust outlets. I don't mind noise, but I like hushed cruising since this car is so damn quiet on the highway. I'm a 24v Cummins guy. Love my 1998.5 Dually. On a cold start, do you hear the turbo whistle like what a typical modified diesel truck would make? Obviously not as pronounced, but I'd love to have that whistle on idle. If you don't mind me asking, how much did everything cost for you? I'm hoping to keep it under $3k. Rawtek says with the delete of the EGR and DPF, the oil stays cleaner for longer and increases interval change times. Is this true?

peobryant · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
Well that gives me lots of confidence then. I think I'll just keep the original muffler and exhaust outlets. I don't mind noise, but I like hushed cruising since this car is so damn quiet on the highway. I'm a 24v Cummins guy. Love my 1998.5 Dually. On a cold start, do you hear the turbo whistle like what a typical modified diesel truck would make? Obviously not as pronounced, but I'd love to have that whistle on idle. If you don't mind me asking, how much did everything cost for you? I'm hoping to keep it under $3k. Rawtek says with the delete of the EGR and DPF, the oil stays cleaner for longer and increases interval change times. Is this true?

This is pretty much exactly what my car sounds like. Mine may be a tad louder since I went with a full 3 inch pipe instead of 2.5 inch but definitely similar. And yeah, you can definitely hear that glorious turbo whistle when she starts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJ4sexiO_hI

It cost me right at $2K to have everything done which I don't find bad at all. Since VW sent me $1000 I guess I could say I'm really only $1000 all in for the mods.

As far as the oil, I'm not sure on that. I still change mine at 10K miles regardless but I use Rotella T6 5W-40 instead of the low ash oil required when you have a DPF.

Any pictures of your 24 Valve? Nothing looks better to me than a dual rear wheel Cummins. I'm partial to the 1st Gen trucks myself but the 2nd gens look damn good too.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask. If you'd like I may be able to take a few videos of the car in a few days. They'd be Galaxy S4 videos though so I don't know how high the quality would be...

fouillard13 · Jan 26, 2016

how many miles needed to pay off that $2000?

peobryant · Jan 26, 2016

None. I didn't mod it to get more mileage, I modded it for more enjoyment and it certainly delivers. Although if the intercooler icing issue that I had hydrolocked the engine and bent a rod like my VW claimed, the $2K for the deletes and tune would be chump change compared to what it would cost to fix that. Since the deletes and tune completely fixes the icing issue I'd say it is money well spent.

DerekG · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
Well that gives me lots of confidence then. I think I'll just keep the original muffler and exhaust outlets. I don't mind noise, but I like hushed cruising since this car is so damn quiet on the highway. I'm a 24v Cummins guy. Love my 1998.5 Dually. On a cold start, do you hear the turbo whistle like what a typical modified diesel truck would make? Obviously not as pronounced, but I'd love to have that whistle on idle. If you don't mind me asking, how much did everything cost for you? I'm hoping to keep it under $3k. Rawtek says with the delete of the EGR and DPF, the oil stays cleaner for longer and increases interval change times. Is this true?

You do hear a bit of the turbo at idle and on start-up

Here is a warm start in my car with a few revs. (mine is a straight pipe from the turbo back with a small resonator)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4Tnb_2NUZk

Cost including install and tune will be anywhere from $2000-$3000 depending on the exhaust setup you choose and the shop hourly rate.

I haven't noticed any soot on my bumper, but my car is grey so I would be hard to see anyway.

I've experienced a 8%-10% increase is fuel economy so easily 5+mpg when driving normally. I did my first 700+ mile tank right after my car was tuned and deleted.

I'll find out about the oil, my next Blackstone oil sample post-delete will be in about 5k miles.

fouillard13 · Jan 26, 2016

Let's say 3 mpg.

It's a 15 gallon tank?

So that would get you 45 miles per tank

These cars get about 45 mpg so well say that saves you one gallon per tank

So 2.50$ usd per tank saved.

Would take approx 800 tanks of fuel to save $2000 or so?

Getting roughly 600 miles per tank. It would take 480,000 miles to pay itself off? Seems high. Where did I screw up?

adjat84th · Jan 26, 2016

I think it's obvious that most people do a delete for the power, sound, and piece of mind knowing they'll never have to replace a DPF/EGR/Exhaust flapper valve etc. The fuel economy is not the sole reason for doing this, it's just a bonus.

As for the sound of the two videos listed above, I think the resonated version is more my taste. I really like the rumble without the slight touch of raspiness without the resonator. Can't wait to get mine done in the coming months!

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

peobryant said:
This is pretty much exactly what my car sounds like. Mine may be a tad louder since I went with a full 3 inch pipe instead of 2.5 inch but definitely similar. And yeah, you can definitely hear that glorious turbo whistle when she starts.

Oh good! And that does sound pretty awesome, I must admit...

peobryant said:
Any pictures of your 24 Valve? Nothing looks better to me than a dual rear wheel Cummins. I'm partial to the 1st Gen trucks myself but the 2nd gens look damn good too.

I just went outside to snap one of it. Just finished flushing the cooling system and putting a new thermostat in. It blew a frost plug so I thought it was time the coolant got changed out. Has 430,000kms on it. Runs like a top! The rust is starting to get to her, but I know a guy who can set me up with colours matched fenders so I'm not worried... Oh and ignore those awful headlights. I bought them on EBay and it was the worst decision I ever made. Vision is awful. I don't know which ones to get now...

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

fouillard13 said:
Let's say 3 mpg.
It's a 15 gallon tank?
So that would get you 45 miles per tank
These cars get about 45 mpg so well say that saves you one gallon per tank
So 2.50$ usd per tank saved.
Would take approx 800 tanks of fuel to save $2000 or so?
Getting roughly 600 miles per tank. It would take 480,000 miles to pay itself off? Seems high. Where did I screw up?

3mpg is a bit low. Many are reporting 10mpg, and two guys on this thread are reporting 3-5mpg. So let's say 5, since the guy who only gets about 3mpg better, drives it hard-ish. Since we're both Canucks, let's do this in proper notation(try to follow along, yanks

)
Stock: 5.7l/100km
Deleted and Tuned: 5.1l/100km
Average Canadians annual mileage: 24,000kms
Stock fuel usage @ 24k annually: 1,368 litres
Deleted fuel usage @ 24k annually: 1224 litres
That's 144 litres difference every year
Average diesel prices in Canada $1.00/litre, so that makes it 144 litres different as well as $144 saved each year.
Payoff: $2,500/$144: 17.3 years or 415,000kms.

So your math wasn't off, but it should be more around 5mpg difference. So it'll never practically pay off unless you're a super long distance driver and keep the car until it dies. I'm just going to do it not only for the better mileage, but for the better performance and the longevity it will boost the engine to. I can't wait.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

adjat84th said:
I think it's obvious that most people do a delete for the power, sound, and piece of mind knowing they'll never have to replace a DPF/EGR/Exhaust flapper valve etc.

Can you tell me what the flapper valve is and what it does, as well as where it is? I'm thinking of the valve that goes to the intake and it closes when you shut the car off to reduce how much it shakes, but obviously that's in the intake so I have to be wrong.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

DerekG said:
You do hear a bit of the turbo at idle and on start-up
Here is a warm start in my car with a few revs. (mine is a straight pipe from the turbo back with a small resonator)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4Tnb_2NUZk
Cost including install and tune will be anywhere from $2000-$3000 depending on the exhaust setup you choose and the shop hourly rate.
I haven't noticed any soot on my bumper, but my car is grey so I would be hard to see anyway.
I've experienced a 8%-10% increase is fuel economy so easily 5+mpg when driving normally. I did my first 700+ mile tank right after my car was tuned and deleted.
I'll find out about the oil, my next Blackstone oil sample post-delete will be in about 5k miles.

Okay good to know. 5mpg is a decent increase, but some are even saying they get 10 better. I'd definitely enjoy that

adjat84th · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
Can you tell me what the flapper valve is and what it does, as well as where it is? I'm thinking of the valve that goes to the intake and it closes when you shut the car off to reduce how much it shakes, but obviously that's in the intake so I have to be wrong.

There is a flapper valve in the exhaust that is used to create back pressure in the exhaust. From what I understand, that increase in pressure allows for more EGR flow when needed, and also to increase exhaust temperature during a regen cycle.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

DerekG · Jan 26, 2016

adjat84th said:
I think it's obvious that most people do a delete for the power, sound, and piece of mind knowing they'll never have to replace a DPF/EGR/Exhaust flapper valve etc. The fuel economy is not the sole reason for doing this, it's just a bonus.
As for the sound of the two videos listed above, I think the resonated version is more my taste. I really like the rumble without the slight touch of raspiness without the resonator. Can't wait to get mine done in the coming months!

Exactly

fouillard13 said:
Let's say 3 mpg.
It's a 15 gallon tank?
So that would get you 45 miles per tank
These cars get about 45 mpg so well say that saves you one gallon per tank
So 2.50$ usd per tank saved.
Would take approx 800 tanks of fuel to save $2000 or so?
Getting roughly 600 miles per tank. It would take 480,000 miles to pay itself off? Seems high. Where did I screw up?

I don't think anyone does this for fuel economy...$3k buys a lot of diesel. The better MPG just gives us another excuse to mod the car lol I would really have to try to get lower than 45mpg on the highway now.

Honestly the main reason I did it, and I think most people that have done it would agree that it is for the power increase and never having to worry about the DPF/EGR again.

If I used the numbers I've been getting to see how long it would take to make up the difference......The results are laughable, especially with diesel being as cheap as it is now lol

DerekG · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
Okay good to know. 5mpg is a decent increase, but some are even saying they get 10 better. I'd definitely enjoy that

I think 10mpg would be doable. With a stock car I REALLY had to try to get 44-45mpg. Now without even trying 48-50 is easy to get (with favorable conditions, i.e. no 40mph head wind, 7% grades, torrential rain...etc). If I were to really push for a good tank I think 55 isn't out of the question.

buyingconstant7 · Jan 26, 2016

DerekG said:
I think 10mpg would be doable. With a stock car I REALLY had to try to get 44-45mpg. Now without even trying 48-50 is easy to get (with favorable conditions, i.e. no 40mph head wind, 7% grades, torrential rain...etc). If I were to really push for a good tank I think 55 isn't out of the question.

With my Jetta, I can do about 42 in the winter which I think is fantastic. My 2015 Golf could only do about 34 but it was the 1.8t. I'm seriously impressed with this 2.0L unit. Starts better in the cold than my new Golf ever could. Glad it's gone in place for this!

fouillard13 · Jan 26, 2016

just to be clear, I wasnt talking about the delete.
I was talking about the tune, as im also considering getting one, mainly for mileage.
now that I think about it, the $2000 price tag was obviously for a delete, and a tune. Id imagine the delete is 75% of the price.
either way, seems like it would take a long time for a $500 tune to pay itself off, and the last thing I need is to dump more money into this damn car.

iadubber · Jan 26, 2016

I can't seem to get any better than 36 mpg combined this winter with my Malone stg 2 and DPF/EGR Delete.

DerekG · Jan 26, 2016

buyingconstant7 said:
With my Jetta, I can do about 42 in the winter which I think is fantastic. My 2015 Golf could only do about 34 but it was the 1.8t. I'm seriously impressed with this 2.0L unit. Starts better in the cold than my new Golf ever could. Glad it's gone in place for this!

Good to hear. I did 485 miles on Saturday through the Arkansas mountains and wind on I-40 and admittedly drove like a bit of an arse in the twisties. I filled up when I got home for 47.4mpg. Temps were in the upper 30s.

Calling all Malone tuned and Deleted 2.0L TDI owners and/or experts!

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