2014 NMS alignment pull right torque steer ?

drjable · Dec 22, 2013

Hello Everyone,

After reading on TDIclub.com for 2 months I could wait no longer to get a Passat TDI. Using data from Truecar.com i purchased mine on 12/3/13.

Has anyone experienced severe torque pull to the right in NMS Passat? This is my 3rd VW that i've purchased new since 1999 but my first TDI. Avid VW fan and always happy in the past (99 passat 1.8T and 2006 Jetta 2.5). I have 700 miles on my new 2014 Passat TDI SE and couldn't be more dis-satisfied and frustrated. The car had 80 miles on it when I bought it new, a lot of driving in Atlanta is stop and go so I didn't first notice the alignment issue. At about the 250 mile mark on odometer I knew I had a severe alignment issue, I figured an alignment job would fix this and I'd be good as "new" :0. Called my dealer and was told alignment isn't covered under the maintenance plan or warranty. So instead when I finally found time at 600 miles I took the car to a local independent tire shop for an alignment check and correction. Come to find out it was only slightly out of alignment speck so this tire shop was surprised by my complaints of strong pulling to the right. After spending $89 to get the alignment into spec the tech said, "You have a bigger issue this isn't alignment this is some kind of torque pull or catching break or something else".

Now i'm waiting until VW is open on Monday to take the new car back to vw service at dealership, I will be sure to document every aspect with them and also call VWOA to open a trouble report and see where this leads. I'm hopeful this is a simple issue to repair and be solid fix forever. What can this be? Catching break, motor mount, issue with suspension? I'm not a very mechanically inclined person just love VW cars and lost at what the issue could be. I have researched the lemon law and won't hesitate to ask for a replacement or buy out if this can't be resolved. The pull to the right is so severe during light acceleration and very bad at 50+ mph or fast acceleration. I'm constantly fighting the car to nudge the steering wheel left to keep it straight and not able to drive straight at all. This is at best very annoying and totally unenjoyable and at worse this is dangerous. I don't want my wife or anyone else driving the car with this situation. When i step on it the car dips a bit right and steers about 15degrees to the right, a very quick lane change. if i put the car in neutral it seems to have no issue, soon as i put it back into drive it starts drifting right, soon as i step on the gas it pulls right 15 degrees.

I'd love advice from this group about 1) what this issue could and 2) best way to handle the issue with VW dealer and VWoA.

Thank you all,
James

nord · Dec 22, 2013

Should be virtually no torque steer. The dealer response will determine your next move. Something is VERY wrong and it should have been discovered before the car was delivered.

drjable · Dec 22, 2013

Thanks Nord, I'm curious if this is a common problem. I've searched the forum and only found a few related posts however most seemed to occur after suspension upgrades and not with a brand new car. I went to my dealer on Saturday and had him drive with me riding shotgun, he agreed something is wrong. we then jumped into another new Passat TDI to confirm the other new car didn't have the same issue, he drove but from my perspective the other new car was straight as an arrow. He asked me to come back Monday as he wants to work with a corporate VW regional rep. I hope this is either immediately fixed or I can get out of this car.

Bug Smasher · Dec 22, 2013

Definitely not torque steer - this engine is transversely mounted. In a transverse setup, the torque is applied in the same circular direction as the wheels, thus eliminating said problem. Torque steer is only present in longitudinal engines.

VeeDubTDI · Dec 22, 2013

Really?

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?492567-Purchased
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steering
http://www.aa1car.com/library/torque_steer.htm

An interesting factoid: There is a torque steer elimination setting in VCDS somewhere. I don't remember where, but we have come across it a couple of times. When activated, the electric power steering automatically compensates for the inherent torque steer caused by the unequal length drive shafts.

Regarding the OP's problem, I have a feeling that it's related to the alignment or possibly an improperly inflated tire. First step would be to have the dealership check the vehicle's alignment.

dzcad90 · Dec 22, 2013

I have a '14 and have not noticed this phenomenon.

I would ask to have a tech go out on a drive with you and demonstrate the issue. It sucks when your new car has issues, and this one doesn't sound like fun. I'd check tires as VDub said, but I'm sure this was one of the first avenues pursued by you if not the alignment shop.

Unfortunately you're probably gong to have to play the game with the service department and VWs customer service, however this seems pretty cut and dry and they should take care of you, especially with this being a safety issue. No manufacturer wants safety issues on their hands. The trend on this forum seems to indicate that VW covers a lot of items past the original warranty date, which really doesn't apply here but demonstrates VW wants to try and make it right in most cases. It may take a time or two, but give them a fair chance to make it right.

tcp_ip_dude · Dec 22, 2013

Bug Smasher said:
Definitely not torque steer - this engine is transversely mounted. In a transverse setup, the torque is applied in the same circular direction as the wheels, thus eliminating said problem. Torque steer is only present in longitudinal engines.

With that statement it's clear you don't understand what "torque steer" in a FWD vehicle is then..

"Torque steering is the influence of engine torque on the steering, especially in front-wheel drive vehicles with transversely mounted engines."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_steering

40X40 · Dec 22, 2013

If you don't take them for a test drive, they will likely claim they can't reproduce the symptom.

Don't tell them how to fix it, (IE, 'it needs an alignment') instead, just tell them and show them what it is doing wrong.

EDIT: Oops, I see you did this already!

Bill

tdiatlast · Dec 22, 2013

I'm afraid the OP has his work cut out for him, since the dealer refused to even entertain the thought of an alignment under warranty at 250 miles
You did the right thing to get an indie shop to determine there's something wrong. Hopefully your dealer will listen to that.
Keep us posted. Good luck.

Bobmws · Dec 22, 2013

Didn't any of you read post #3?
Please keep us updated drjable, and good luck.

pparks1 · Dec 22, 2013

My friend's wife works for VW warranty service and they bought a 2014 Passat. It does pull and there is a TSB. They are having this problem with their Passat and she is fighting VW to get it fixed. Seems they claim that getting alignments done under warranty is not covered, but yet she approves these types of repairs on a daily basis.

drjable · Dec 23, 2013

pparks1 said:
My friend's wife works for VW warranty service and they bought a 2014 Passat. It does pull and there is a TSB. They are having this problem with their Passat and she is fighting VW to get it fixed. Seems they claim that getting alignments done under warranty is not covered, but yet she approves these types of repairs on a daily basis.

Pparks1- thanks. Is "tsb" a technical service bulletin? I'll ask vw dealership service shop and vwoa customer care about a "tsb" today. Please keep this thread posted about your friends 14 passat with similar issue I'm a curious if they get theirs fixed and how.

I don't think my issue is related to alignment of wheels or tires because in neutral on fllat road it doesn't pull. However it doesn't feel good either. I had a 2.5 passat 2014 loaner already and it drove straight as arrow and steering felt great.

Thanks

Canuck64 · Dec 23, 2013

My Passat also had a hard pull to the right. Three separate alignment attempts by my dealer failed to fix it. They did not charge me for any of the alignments. They even went as far as replacing a suspected faulty tire at no charge. Took it to a local alignment shop a problem was fixed on the first a attempt.

Sent from my SM-N900W8 using Tapatalk

RoadRunnerTR21 · Dec 23, 2013

drjable all I can say is that bites! I've got over 20K on my 2012 and have not experienced anything like you described. Stay persistent. If that doesn't work find another dealer. I took my car to the dealer I purchased it from 1 time and that was the last time they ever saw the car. They were just a bunch of nit wits. I'm sure there are other VW dealers in your area. Good luck and keep everyone here posted.

drjable · Dec 23, 2013

Canuck64 said:
My Passat also had a hard pull to the right. Three separate alignment attempts by my dealer failed to fix it. They did not charge me for any of the alignments. They even went as far as replacing a suspected faulty tire at no charge. Took it to a local alignment shop a problem was fixed on the first a attempt.

What turned out to be the issue? I dropped mine off today. Sales manager handed me off to service. Because he drove my car Saturday he gave a very accurate first hand experience. The ticket is accurate in description. Now I'll just wait and see what they do. I won't accept the car back with this extreme 15 degree pulling. Fingers are crossed there is something easy to fix. Doubt it is tires or alignment due to straight tracking in neutral. I'll keep you guys posted on the next test drive.

Thanks all.

Canuck64 · Dec 23, 2013

drjable said:
Canuck64 said:

What turned out to be the issue? I dropped mine off today. Sales manager handed me off to service. Because he drove my car Saturday he gave a very accurate first hand experience. The ticket is accurate in description. Now I'll just wait and see what they do. I won't accept the car back with this extreme 15 degree pulling. Fingers are crossed there is something easy to fix. Doubt it is tires or alignment due to straight tracking in neutral. I'll keep you guys posted on the next test drive.
Thanks all.

Click to expand...

The different mechanics at the VW dealership was trying out all kinds of configurations to stop the pull to the right.
The only thing the local tire shop did was adjust the toe on both front tires to 0.10 degrees, problem solved.

rustycat · Dec 23, 2013

drjable said:
Canuck64 said:

My Passat also had a hard pull to the right. Three separate alignment attempts by my dealer failed to fix it. They did not charge me for any of the alignments. They even went as far as replacing a suspected faulty tire at no charge. Took it to a local alignment shop a problem was fixed on the first a attempt.

What turned out to be the issue? I dropped mine off today. Sales manager handed me off to service. Because he drove my car Saturday he gave a very accurate first hand experience. The ticket is accurate in description. Now I'll just wait and see what they do. I won't accept the car back with this extreme 15 degree pulling. Fingers are crossed there is something easy to fix. Doubt it is tires or alignment due to straight tracking in neutral. I'll keep you guys posted on the next test drive.

Thanks all.

Click to expand...

Just one of group chiming in that I've never experienced any form of torque steer with my 2013. Actually not even the faintest whiff of torque steeriness ever---one of my favorite features is how they have totally eliminated torque steer on a front wheel drive.

thundershorts · Dec 23, 2013

I'd ask for a copy of the tsb on the subject. VW doesn't generate tsb's unless its a pretty common problem. Its something more than an alignment issue most likely.

drjable · Dec 30, 2013

So VW service at my dealer has had car for a week. This morning I get a call that the car is fixed and drives comparable to all TDi cars. I asked him to clarify this statement and he says all tdi have a bit of torque steer and don't track straight with gas pedal applied. Laugh out loud. Have a feeling I'm in for an interesting test drive and conversation when I go see my car today.

Can you'll confirm your passat nms tdi can drive straight?

pparks1 · Dec 30, 2013

My 2013 TDI Passat drives straight with the accelerator applied. If there is some torque steer, it's so minimal that I do not recognize any correction on my part.

dzcad90 · Dec 30, 2013

I have a '14 and it does not seem to exhibit this behavior. It's easy to tell though, grab a similarly equipped new car off the lot and take that for a ride.

dzcad90 · Dec 30, 2013

Also, if this dealer doesn't help you, go somewhere else. Other dealers LOVE to handle issues like this. They get the payment for the work from VW and they know when it comes time to buy, you'll likely be back again.

drjable · Dec 30, 2013

Hello Everyone, thank you for your feedback regarding your Passat nms tdi torque steer (mostly lack of from what I'm reading) as well as advice for handling this issue with dealer.

I went to pickup and drive my car today. after working on my car for 3 business days they said it turns out that a tire rotation and alignment fixed the issue. They said the 3rd party alignment job I received last week was out of spec and made my issue seem worse. I showed them the print out from third party and it was in spec, so i'm losing faith and trust in this VW service department. To make it worse when I asked him to provide their alignment before and after results he hands me a generic looking print out that I question isn't even from my car. The paper he handed me didn't match his claim that the before measurements indicated right front tire was toe out causing the right drifting.

So either VW or the 3rd party is not accurate in their readings. i'm skeptical that VW gave me the print out from my car since it didn't list my car anywhere on the sheet.

I'm concerned VW simply aligned me to point more left to over compensate for the torque steer. they do have my car tracking pretty straight in neutral and drive at low RPM. I think my next move will be to go to another local VW dealership service shop and ask for an alignment and proper print out of my before and after. I'll then have 3 different sheets and see if any compare to the 1st dealer.

I asked them if there is a TSB on this issue and they said no. I asked VWOA customer care and they said they will research it and get back to me. VWOA wouldn't comment to me if the Passat TDI is supposed to torque steer. when I'm at about 2,500 to 3,000 RPMs I'm still pulling hard right about 15 degree angle. if it was minor i'd live with it, I know I bought my third VW and not a Benz however I've never seen this amount of torque steer in any car I've been in.

anyway needless to say I'm not satisfied with how this has transpired so far. my car is now at about 750 miles.

I appreciate all your comments and confirmation that your TDI NMS's are in fact tracking straight and don't experience excessive torque pull when you get to 2,500 and higher RPMs.

Thanks,
James

drjable · Dec 30, 2013

dzcad90 said:
I have a '14 and it does not seem to exhibit this behavior. It's easy to tell though, grab a similarly equipped new car off the lot and take that for a ride.

the Sales manager drove me around in another TDI SE and it didn't torque steer like mine at all. I've also had two 2.5 loaners that had zero torque steer.

anyone know if the suspension and axel designs are the same on a TDI vs. 2.5 NMS?

nord · Dec 30, 2013

Three Passat TDI's. All 2013. Two SE manuals and a SEL Premium. All track straight and true. None exhibit any torque steer.

Softrockrenegade · Dec 30, 2013

No torque steer on my 2013 6m at all.

PassatSE4me · Dec 30, 2013

Bug Smasher said:
Torque steer is only present in longitudinal engines.

The torque steer in my 1984 Dodge Colt turbo with a transverse mounted engine was downright wicked. So I would agree that this is mis-information at its finest.

I was actually shocked that there is no discernable torque steer with my 2013, even under hard acceleration.

tdiatlast · Dec 30, 2013

drjable: Please repeat this phrase: "The 2012-2014 NMS Passat TDI does NOT have issues with torque steer." Repeat this phrase at regular intervals until you convince yourself that it isn't "torque steer".

I know I'm sounding like an A$$, but maybe, just maybe, if you'd stop using the phrase, anyone working on your car would stop looking for something that doesn't exist, and instead would concentrate on a proper alignment.

drjable · Dec 30, 2013

tdiatlast said:
drjable: Please repeat this phrase: "The 2012-2014 NMS Passat TDI does NOT have issues with torque steer." Repeat this phrase at regular intervals until you convince yourself that it isn't "torque steer".

I know I'm sounding like an A$$, but maybe, just maybe, if you'd stop using the phrase, anyone working on your car would stop looking for something that doesn't exist, and instead would concentrate on a proper alignment.

I don't think you are sounding like an ass. However it is vw service at my dealer as well as vwoa customer care telling me I have torque steer And that it is common in tdi passat and that I should accept it as normal. I can't explain the fact that when I step on gas hard the cart moves right a lot not a little. However when coasting or in neutral it is straight.

I'm going to go to a different dealer tomorrow and check into service and drive with a manager my car and then other new passat tdi.

TDIguy02 · Dec 30, 2013

Drjable: I'm having the same issue with my 2014 se 6mt. Already had one alignment done by a DFW vw dealer. No luck. Same symptoms as you. Keep us updated

2014 NMS alignment pull right torque steer ?

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