Real World MPG - 6 speed Manual

eatpasta

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2011
Location
Santa Barbara, Ca
TDI
2012 Passat
LOL! I will have to look you up next time I visit my sister in SB. I'll only be in Valencia next trip. I can compare your Opera Red/Titan Black to mine...
well we live in Los Angeles but we are up there all the time.... because why wouldnt you be?
 

Niner

duplicate account, banned
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
LOL! I will have to look you up next time I visit my sister in SB. I'll only be in Valencia next trip. I can compare your Opera Red/Titan Black to mine...
Where is Valencia, in relationship to Weed and Tijuana?
 

NSTDI

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 26, 2002
Location
Nova Scotia
TDI
15 Passat
I plugged in my scan gauge II, and was stunned how easy it is to peg that darn turbo at 2500mb, and at really low rpms... think like 1400 to 1450, it will deliver almost full boost, that's like 21 to 22 psi. Just rolling your foot into it at low rpms, 12 to 1300rpm in 2nd and 3rd to 2400 rpms on a 6 Man works the turbo vanes on this motorized model.
I don't see this turbo lasting that long, if your romp on it, thrash it, or drive it like you stole it. It spools up so fast, with so much boost, stuff is either going to break, or that turbo will reach stall speed and somethings going to snap or melt, get hot, get bent, and then fail.
Niner, how does this turbo compare to my 98 TDI and 2003 1.8T for RPM spoolup?

Don
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
The new TDI turbos are much more aggressive. For comparison, a stock ALH runs about 14 psi, a stock 180HP 1.8T (K03) runs 11.6 psi, the 225HP 1.8T (K04) runs almost 15 psi. The new TDIs are in the low 20-psi numbers.

As far as spool-up is concerned, the TDI spools up quicker than any of the previous gassers or diesels.
 

r11

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2012
Location
NJ
TDI
2012 Passat TDI SE 6MT (BB'd), 2015 Passat TDI SE 6MT
A perf mod that is out there for our TDI's, simply delays opening of the turbo's waste gate so that even higher boosts are achievable. But, I'd stay with stock tuning, as long as I get my 53 Mpgs (!) - this is what I got on today's drive from Poconos to NJ, not even a 1000 miles on the car yet and still running winter diesel formulation.
 

wolfsburg_de

Ross-Tech AssociateVendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Location
Lansdale, PA USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6MT
Over the weekend, I went to a party that was 239 miles away (each way). I drove 9mph over the speed limit most of the time, with no drafting or hypermiling. Result per the MFA was 45.3 mpg on the way up, 47.0 mpg on the way back. This car just loves stretching its legs! BTW, I was logging requested and delivered boost most of the time. It definitely works the turbo even during what seems like steady state cruising and when you mash the go pedal, it only takes a second or so for the actual boost to hit the same 22-23 psig as the request. This turbo seems to be well-sized for the application.
 

Niner

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Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Over the weekend, I went to a party that was 239 miles away (each way). I drove 9mph over the speed limit most of the time, with no drafting or hypermiling. Result per the MFA was 45.3 mpg on the way up, 47.0 mpg on the way back. This car just loves stretching its legs! BTW, I was logging requested and delivered boost most of the time. It definitely works the turbo even during what seems like steady state cruising and when you mash the go pedal, it only takes a second or so for the actual boost to hit the same 22-23 psig as the request. This turbo seems to be well-sized for the application.
What's the speed limit? 9 mph tells me nothing when I don't know what roads or freeways or tollroads you took?

I'm really interested in requested versus actual fuel pressure at the rail, vs rpm's and load on the motor, does VCDS monitor that too, if you log it? Any logs, charts or screen shots you could put up of that, would love to see it.
 

Niner

duplicate account, banned
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
Variable vanes controls boost, right?
VNT Variable Nozzle Turbo, since the 1998 NB here in North America. Last waste gated model was the early 1999 A3 jettas, no idea how many were produced, but not much. I've never seen one, myself, but they are supposedly out there. The 1999.5 Jetta was the VNT turbo'd version, that was the new Mk IV chassis.
 

cj42

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Location
East CT
TDI
80 Rabbit,84 jetta,85 Jetta,03 Cummins, 2012 Passat SE 6MT Tdi
First tank went 720 with 17 gal.(42MPG) Second tank 703 with 15.6 gal.(45MPG) I didn't expect this good of mileage so soon. It's not like I'm babying this thing either. Once its warm I shift right around 3200 RPM. I'm thinking now after break in 48- 50 MPG maybe possible.
 

Niner

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Jun 3, 2011
First tank went 720 with 17 gal.(42MPG) Second tank 703 with 15.6 gal.(45MPG) I didn't expect this good of mileage so soon. It's not like I'm babying this thing either. Once its warm I shift right around 3200 RPM. I'm thinking now after break in 48- 50 MPG maybe possible.
Once it's warm, try shifting consistently around 2000 rpm and get back to us after a couple of tanks.
 

NateM

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2011
Location
NW Conn.
TDI
2012 Passat TDI Manual
2nd tank. top off to top off...651miles and I calculated 39mpg. The computer says 39.5. This is an average speed of 35mph mostly back roads and 5% highway.
I am rolling on 19" reps with the same overall diameter as stock and maybe a couple pounds heavier. Looking foward to a highway trip!
 

cj42

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Location
East CT
TDI
80 Rabbit,84 jetta,85 Jetta,03 Cummins, 2012 Passat SE 6MT Tdi
Once it's warm, try shifting consistently around 2000 rpm and get back to us after a couple of tanks.
After I put 5000 miles on it I will start driving more conservative but I hear on the 2000 rpm level.
 

VeeDubTDI

Wanderluster, Traveler, TDIClub Enthusiast
Joined
Jul 2, 2000
Location
Springfield, VA
TDI
‘18 Tesla Model 3D+, ‘14 Cadillac ELR, ‘13 Fiat 500e
Once it's warm, try shifting consistently around 2000 rpm and get back to us after a couple of tanks.
If you want *really* good fuel economy, accelerate quickly (shift at 3200 rpm) until you reach speed, then coast in neutral for a while. Pulse and glide, baby... 60 mpg should be no problem, especially if you have elevation changes to take advantage of.
 

Niner

duplicate account, banned
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
After I put 5000 miles on it I will start driving more conservative but I hear on the 2000 rpm level.
80 miles yesterday, average speed shown was 47 miles per hour, quite a bit of city driving, 20%, 40% country road in 5th gear at 50 mph, 40% freeway at 70-75mph. MPG read 54.6 MPG. I know from past fillups, I will be within .75 of a MPG either way.

Polished concrete freeway really ups my MPG's, just does not seem to offer much rolling resistance.
 

jbright

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2009
Location
Indianapolis
TDI
2009 Jetta DSG
Polished concrete freeway really ups my MPG's, just does not seem to offer much rolling resistance.
I first noticed this when watching my instantaneous mpg as I changed from one surface to another. Very rough highway surfaces can have a significant effect in the other direction.
 

wolfsburg_de

Ross-Tech AssociateVendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Location
Lansdale, PA USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6MT
What's the speed limit? 9 mph tells me nothing when I don't know what roads or freeways or tollroads you took?

I'm really interested in requested versus actual fuel pressure at the rail, vs rpm's and load on the motor, does VCDS monitor that too, if you log it? Any logs, charts or screen shots you could put up of that, would love to see it.
Mostly 65 mph limit divided highways:

http://tinyurl.com/89jkbng

My #2 MFA readings have gone down a bit since I drove to and from work this week, but have average speed 50 mph, 564 miles, range 130 miles, consumption 45.3 mpg, travel time 11h15m.
 

Niner

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Jun 3, 2011
Mostly 65 mph limit divided highways:

http://tinyurl.com/89jkbng

My #2 MFA readings have gone down a bit since I drove to and from work this week, but have average speed 50 mph, 564 miles, range 130 miles, consumption 45.3 mpg, travel time 11h15m.
Yeah, but does VCDS log fuel rail pressure, requested vs actual, as well as rpm and throttle position, all 4 at the same time? or perhaps engine load?
 

wolfsburg_de

Ross-Tech AssociateVendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Location
Lansdale, PA USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6MT
Yeah, but does VCDS log fuel rail pressure, requested vs actual, as well as rpm and throttle position, all 4 at the same time? or perhaps engine load?
Looks like yes. There are 700 different UDS Advanced Measuring Values to choose from. At idle, I can see for example:

96-0:Accelerator pedal travel 0.00 %
161-0:Crankshaft speed (RPM) 829.0 /min
148-0:Fuel high pressure; actual value 336800 hPa
150-0:High fuel pressure; specified value 334700 hPa

UDS units are kinda goofy, but hPa = mbar.

You can pick up to 12 different values to view/log/graph at once, but the sample rate gets worse, the more you choose.
 

Niner

duplicate account, banned
Joined
Jun 3, 2011
They have really dropped the idle speed off of the old A4 903 rpms.

Can this be logged in graph form too, say, like if you did an interstate freeway on ramp romp for the pressure too? Have you done so yet to see what the rail pressure is? I'd love to see a graph of that sometime.
 

wolfsburg_de

Ross-Tech AssociateVendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Location
Lansdale, PA USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6MT
Sure, that stuff can be viewed and logged. I haven't done that for rail pressure but will when i get a chance.
 

wolfsburg_de

Ross-Tech AssociateVendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Location
Lansdale, PA USA
TDI
2012 Passat TDI 6MT
Yep, I love setting it up in the car, logging it and then playing it back at home with the Scope. Fun to graph the stuff and speed it up and watch key areas of the drive.
I'm guessing you already do this, but just in case anyone else isn't aware, I'd HIGHLY recommend using the "Save Selection to File" function:

http://ross-tech.com/vcds/tour/adv-meas-blocks.html

We have 700 MVB, of which at least 250 seem to be "real" in that they are different between idle and KOEO. It's hard to keep track of all of them but a few handy lists of a commonly used ones can be pulled up lickety-split.

 

TomB

Veteran Member
Joined
May 1, 2003
Location
Cle Elum, Washington/Las Vegas, Nevada
TDI
2015 Audi TDI Prestige Sport
I'm guessing you already do this, but just in case anyone else isn't aware, I'd HIGHLY recommend using the "Save Selection to File" function:

http://ross-tech.com/vcds/tour/adv-meas-blocks.html

We have 700 MVB, of which at least 250 seem to be "real" in that they are different between idle and KOEO. It's hard to keep track of all of them but a few handy lists of a commonly used ones can be pulled up lickety-split.

Nice!!! More things to play with. I did not know these were there... :) But only 4 diesel.
 
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