john.jackson9213
Top Post Dawg
Good to see you are almost ready to get the car back. Looks Great.
1997 B4V 1Z Grocery Getter Build
- Thread starter kooyajerms
- Start date
kooyajerms
grocery getter
- Joined
- May 5, 2004
- Location
- Pomona, Southern California
- TDI
- 97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Thanks Louis, see, I'm not totally hardheaded. 
foxracer1
Veteran Member
Interesting! Would need: cam gear, crank gear, tensioner, pump gear and belt from AHH?
Are AHHs from overseas? T-belts easy to get for them?
sorry for the hi-jack
G60ING
Top Post Dawg
- Joined
- Aug 5, 2001
- Location
- MD
- TDI
- No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
There are 2-3 ways you can install an 11mm pump on a 1Z/AHU/AFN
The easiest is probably what was done in this thread machine the mk3 Ip bracket and backing plate and get a mk4 IP cog and have it machined flat. I did this on a friend's car and it works great. You'll also need a plastic plug for the wiring. This is all outlined in the mk3 forum.
The ahh is a derivative of the AHU and AFN and was sold overseas. There were 2 or 3 sold in the USA in the B5 Passat. There are several parts that are different. The crank cog, cam cog, IP cog, tensioner, belt, IP bracket, backing plate, TB cover upper and lower, misc hardware and probably even the serp belt parts too. I gave up after realizing how much was different when I thought about going this route.
If I were to consider doing an 11mm pump I'd just buy a mk4 11mm pump (same part number as the ahh) and have the AHU parts machined. I might consider buying the AHH's IP timing cog but I'll cross that road when I get their. I've actually done this method on a friend's car and it was fairly easy.
The 3rd method would require the AHU pump to be rebuilt with the 11mm parts but I know nothing about this route.
The easiest is probably what was done in this thread machine the mk3 Ip bracket and backing plate and get a mk4 IP cog and have it machined flat. I did this on a friend's car and it works great. You'll also need a plastic plug for the wiring. This is all outlined in the mk3 forum.
The ahh is a derivative of the AHU and AFN and was sold overseas. There were 2 or 3 sold in the USA in the B5 Passat. There are several parts that are different. The crank cog, cam cog, IP cog, tensioner, belt, IP bracket, backing plate, TB cover upper and lower, misc hardware and probably even the serp belt parts too. I gave up after realizing how much was different when I thought about going this route.
If I were to consider doing an 11mm pump I'd just buy a mk4 11mm pump (same part number as the ahh) and have the AHU parts machined. I might consider buying the AHH's IP timing cog but I'll cross that road when I get their. I've actually done this method on a friend's car and it was fairly easy.
The 3rd method would require the AHU pump to be rebuilt with the 11mm parts but I know nothing about this route.
foxracer1
Veteran Member
I have 11mm pump and mk4 cog etc.
Was just asking about the AHH. haven't heard much about them and its cause they are super rare. I'll just change my t-belt more often.
Thanks
Was just asking about the AHH. haven't heard much about them and its cause they are super rare. I'll just change my t-belt more often.
Thanks
dok
Veteran Member
Looks awesome Jeremy! Glad you got it all together and enjoying the ride
kooyajerms
grocery getter
- Joined
- May 5, 2004
- Location
- Pomona, Southern California
- TDI
- 97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Thanks David. You got yours done pretty damn fast over at Rich's. I've been to Al's a couple times but he's never been home. We should hook up sometime, unless you're too busy bringing scripts to the Exec Pro's
Jeremy
*Still no internet for Matt, lol sorry guys*
Jeremy
*Still no internet for Matt, lol sorry guys*
dieseleux
Théoricien -TDIClub Contributor
silverbox
Veteran Member
Farfromovin
Torque Addict
I could've swore Matt had an iPhone, and if true, should be jailbroken and have a teathering app for instances just like this. That's what I do at least (am I showing my internet addiction yet?). Sorry for the off topic.
Keebler145
Veteran Member
bahahaha matt with an Iphone! Sorry FFM that's just all sorts of funny.
the day Matt has an Iphone I'll have an ALH that puts out 350whp and it be a daily driver As for that tethering thing have fun with that till AT&T starts watching your bandwidth usage... even on your "Unlimited grandfathered plan" lol
john.jackson9213
Top Post Dawg
Jeremy,
Any information on where the torque peaks? Meaning RPM.
Any information on where the torque peaks? Meaning RPM.
kooyajerms
grocery getter
- Joined
- May 5, 2004
- Location
- Pomona, Southern California
- TDI
- 97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Matt's watching right now, but he can't send the graph over his phone, oh "smart"phones lol.
Whitbread
Vendor , w/Business number
Haha, wayyyy off. Samsung Instinct that is a total POS.
Finally got a neighbor's wifi password
. I'm in southern Corona (California) right now for my brother's wedding this weekend. Anyway, here's the graphs! As I said, the first run that did 194/290 got deleted because the optical tach wasn't set up quite perfect yet and it had a big spike at the beginning and squigily at the end. Not thinking it was going heat soak as bad as it did, I didn't save the run
. But the shape of the curves are all the same so you get the idea of power delivery. We were starting at 40 and ending at 105 in 4th gear. This was the 3rd or 4th run where we were still playing with the placement of the optical tach eye so it wouldn't loose signal when the motor torqued up.
And now that we got the eye perfect for the 5th run, it was heat soaked to hell. We did 7 runs total, last 3 were all within 5hp of each other. Dyno cell probly got up to 95* and IAT wou'dn't go below 95-100*
. Started at about 50F.
Last edited:
dieseleux
Théoricien -TDIClub Contributor
Pretty good curve!
With GTB2056VK is possible have full HP at 2500rpm, just close a little bit more vane.
20-30mil to open on stop screw, you lost 500rpm easily.
Dieseleux
With GTB2056VK is possible have full HP at 2500rpm, just close a little bit more vane.
20-30mil to open on stop screw, you lost 500rpm easily.
Dieseleux
hgeittmann
Veteran Member
funny, I forgot how everything in CA was the 101 or the 80 and so on. I'm an hour north of Denver. If you come through on the 76 it's a bit closer as you can jump off on the 52 to the 25 and come in on the 119. If you're coming in from Kansas (the 70), I'm a much bigger detour. When you coming through? If it's next week I'll be in Summit County, right off the 70 in Dillon/Silverthorne.
foxracer1
Veteran Member
^ lol i agree my cali friends say the same thing. even my navy buddy whos from Oh
Farfromovin
Torque Addict
Yeah, I'm not sure how much I trust the Whitbread *hater* dyno lol. For sure it reads low, but now I'm not so sure the RPM axis is even close lol. Driving accounts say the turbo is spooled by 2k, but dyno graph peaks at 3k+?
dieselpower04
Veteran Member
Why is there nearly 30 hp difference between the first and last runs? That thing heat soak that fast?
TDIJetta99
Top Post Dawg
Yeah something doesn't seem right with that... I hope for the car's sake the graph is shifted lower than that.. The DentSport Dyno in the northeast is a "heartbreaker" but nothing like that..
TDIsyncro
Veteran Member
I agree with above. RPM calibration must be out, or turbo vanes are set too much open causing late spool, or N75 values need to be readjusted to keep vanes closed more. The GTB spool does not look right..too slow.
kooyajerms
grocery getter
- Joined
- May 5, 2004
- Location
- Pomona, Southern California
- TDI
- 97 B4V (mine), 11 x5 35d (hers) 04 V10 (that one you want), 2014 Q7 (mom's) 74 Shasta 1400
Mark did all the tuning without getting any logs =) So we'll see if we can fine tune it some when we get the lift pump in on Tuesday. It will be a bit tight since we are both flying in on the same day. Too bad we don't have another set of injectors or I'd force another dyno run >=)
struikie
Veteran Member
I'd say the dyno is a bit off... was a bit surpised that the torque was so slow to build...
but not calibrating the rpm's is a bit stange as this is the first thing that is done with a car on the dyno...
just compare it to mine...
JW
but not calibrating the rpm's is a bit stange as this is the first thing that is done with a car on the dyno...
just compare it to mine...
JW
Scott02
Veteran Member
Turbo spool point, turbo spooled... all subjective topics.
We should really only talk about torque peak, as that is (generally speaking) when the turbo is first making full requested boost.
In one of whitbreads utube vids the car will make 25-ish when floored at 2000rpms, so me thinks the rpm part of the dyno plot is amiss.
JFettig
Vendor
How much boost it makes at a certain rpm is dependent on when its stomped, what the tune allows it to at what rpm, what gear the car is in, the loading, the terrain.. That video is taken in 5th gear, lets see what it'll do in 3rd, floor it at 1800rpm.
Jon
Jon
Whitbread
Vendor , w/Business number
The rpm plots are correct on my "heartbreaker" dyno. As the youtube vids show, the turbo does spool earlier than 3k easily. Why the tq peak is so late on the graph, I don't exactly know. The stop screw needs turned a bit more for sure, and maybe the n75 maps need adjusted slightly at 100% TPS. Now looking at the graphs and vids, I also probably didn't load the motor early enough to get it to spool similarly to on the road. I only had about 40 mins total to do the dyno runs so I didn't have enough time to try everything I wanted
. I'll try to revisit the dyno after the lift pump install (which was supposed to be at my shop yesterday or today) and play with the stop screw some more. No promises though as Jeremy is planning to drive the car back next wednesday. Maybe he'll get it dyno'ed out in cali.
Rome wasn't built and tuned in a day, there'll be more to come
.
Farfromovin
Torque Addict
Pff, I heard Rome WAS tuned in a day lol.
dieselpower04
Veteran Member
john.jackson9213
Top Post Dawg
Jeremy & Matt,
Loved following Jeremy's build for the last 9 months or so.
Hope you will each have the time for another run on the dyno before Jeremy has to head home.
Sure that some real logs will help Mark dial in the tune. Expect to see big improvements from that.
Also was surprised to see what I thought was "weak" low end torque around 2K rpm. The dyno chart looks more like a gasser mussel car, with a low state of tune, but tons of low end torque.
Have to think about how great a Toureg V-6 TDI engine with front wheel drive only would be in a 26 ft. GMC motor home with a 7 speed tiptronic.
Loved following Jeremy's build for the last 9 months or so.
Hope you will each have the time for another run on the dyno before Jeremy has to head home.
Sure that some real logs will help Mark dial in the tune. Expect to see big improvements from that.
Also was surprised to see what I thought was "weak" low end torque around 2K rpm. The dyno chart looks more like a gasser mussel car, with a low state of tune, but tons of low end torque.
Have to think about how great a Toureg V-6 TDI engine with front wheel drive only would be in a 26 ft. GMC motor home with a 7 speed tiptronic.