MDI interface/stereo draining iPod battery when parked for 2 days?

I've been trying to get into the habit, really I have. And I do understand that the core issue here is my own laziness.

<conspiracytheory>

Maybe they want it unplugged each time so they can sell us more MDI-to-iPod cables at $40ea to replace the ones we wear out ("not under warranty" due to "extreme use")

</conspiracytheory>

getfast said:

Exactly, thanks Dan. I leave my iPhone charger plugged in 24/7 and it powers off when the car does, why shouldn't my MDI'd iPod do the same?

Click to expand...

I do agree that the MDI power should act the same as the 12v power in the cars cabin.

Mine's getting worse, ie running down after only an overnight, depending on how much charge time it had during the previous day.

So, anyone want to tackle a custom cable with a diode [g]?

-dan

What radio is being used in the problem cases? I have the rcd-510 coupled with a 1st gen iPod touch.

It sounds like a radio issue since there is always power going to the radio, and the MDI is connected to the radio. Even though the radio may appear "off", it may be maintaining communication with the iPod, thus keeping a 5V (USB Spec) draw on the iPod with no return charge circuit because the radio is not "on" per se ...

This issue might be limited to certain radios, and a simple firmware update to the radio would be able to correct the issue. Yet another bug with the new line of radios ... Come on VW, time to issue patches ....a $1500 option should not have so many bugs ....

Placing a diode on the comm circuit will break USB spec, and the iPod will not communicate at all since the diode will permanently break the 2-way communication by cutting power on the +5V, or -5V (even when the power to the radio is on)

Placing a diode on the VCC circuit will prevent all power supply to the ipod.


See USB spec here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus

soundchk said:

What radio is being used in the problem cases? I have the rcd-510 coupled with a 1st gen iPod touch.

Click to expand...

Is mine the RCD-510? (Base model "Premium 8" radio on 2010 Golf TDI, color touch screen, three buttons down each side, non-nav, non-Dynaudio, bluetooth, MDI under armrest.) This is it:



iPod in question is a 5th gen classic aka 30gb Video.

yep, that's the rcd-510. I haven't paid much attention to power drainage on my iPod, but I will now. I'm interested....


Just checked my iPod, it says "Accessory Connected" even though the car is off, and the alarm is activated. Since this confirms that the radio is maintaining comm with the iPod and the iPod says it is charging (Little lightening bolt in the battery). It's doing one of the following:

-The iPod *thinks* it's charging, because comm is still active, but power to VCC has been cut because the car is off, thus, a drained battery after 48hours (depending on the age and state of the iPod's battery)

-The iPod is actually charging because the radio is adheering to USB spec by providing full VCC power along with full COMM. (IOW, no dead iPod battery after 48 hours)

If the former is what is actually happening, then only a firmware update to the radio can correct the situation. If it's the latter, then there is no issue. I will check my iPod before I drive to work tomorrow to see if there is any drain....I suspect that as iPod's age and lose battery life more quickly, this problem will become more prevalent.

Mine's RCD-510 as well. My observation is that the radio supplies juice to the iPod for a period of time after the car is shut off and the alarm activated, but then after a while (an hour?) shuts off that power and the circuit design allows the iPod to bleed charge from then on.

-dan

Has anyone gotten a firmware update or other "fix" for this? At my 10k the dealer claimed no new firmware is available for the RCD-510 and no bulletins on the iPod issue.

-dan

I haven't taken mine back in, but it's on the list for my 10k visit in February/March.

Although by then I may have switched over to the SD card method

I'm in for the long haul with the iPod because I have a substantial amount of music encoded in other than MP3 formats (mostly AAC), which won't play from an SD card.

-dan

I have the 5th Gen Classic Video and the same head unit, same issue.

If I unplug the ipod, I've noticed that the unit has turned on loop on the Ipod.

I think the issue is really the MCD connection not allowing the Ipod to enter 'sleep' mode on this version of the ipod. When the vehicle is shut off I still connection indication on my screen.

I might start pulling the ipod or go to SD in any event as -20c overnight can't help. If i could get the iphone4 to stream i wouldnt be in this mess. lol @ Jobs.

I have been unplugging my iPod anytime the car is parked for more than just an overnight. In my opinion it's needless wear on various connectors and cables, not to mention my center console armrest. If this stupid power issue wasn't happening none of that would ever be touched, unless I added more music to my iTunes and needed to re-sync of course.

I have a spare 8gb SDHC card available and have been thinking about loading up a bunch of tunes, then plugging that in and forgetting about this iPod problem forever. Can someone please direct me to info about exactly which formats will work this way (guessing mp3's sourced elsewhere and rips from cd's I own = yes, stuff bought from iTunes = no?) Also there's something about making a certain number of folders and files, and a particular format? Tried a search but didn't find the info I'm after. Thanks for any assistance.

New data:

Yesterday I unplugged my Gen 5 iPod video and brought it inside without looking at it. Today I slid it out of its pouch and the iPod had never gone to sleep. It was at the main menu screen and did not go through the usual Apple logo and HD spinup that would be normal after it sat for 24 hours. The battery, which had been fine, was nearly dead.

I have to wonder if the VW head unit is leaving iPods in this non-sleep mode and draining the battery as a result. If so, unplugging is only going to work if you also reset or at least sleep the iPod -- at least under some circumstances.

For my next test I plan to leave the iPod plugged in but pull it out of the armrest cubby and manually put it to sleep and see what happens to the battery.

-dan

Dan, mine has been doing the same thing since day one. My primary gripe has always been that the MDI will wake the iPod from sleep, then never put it back to sleep. Dealer says it's normal, VW says it's not Finally have time to leave the car at the dealership for this and the seat fabric issue, maybe early next month...

@getfast,

At the risk of sounding overly picky, I'm seizing on a subtle difference between what you say (and I too have experienced), and what happened yesterday.

Specifically, my iPod has (like yours) always failed to sleep when connected to the MDI. Yesterday I unplugged mine while it must have been in that state and it still failed to put itself to sleep for about 24 hours, running the battery down while it was sitting on my desk.

This suggests to me that it is not a question of the MDI failing to put the iPod to sleep. Instead, the MDI is preventing the iPod from sleeping and apparently if you unplug it at just the wrong point in the process as I must have done yesterday, the iPod stays in that non-sleep mode. Normally, of course, it would sleep after just a few minutes and then deep sleep after more time has passed, with the familiar Apple logo display and hard drive spinup when you wake it the next day (which didn't happen in this case).

I go into all this boring detail in hopes it leads us closer to a fix.

-dan

Sorry Dan, my bad for not explaining further. Mine has also done the same thing you mentioned - it will not automatically go back to sleep whether it's plugged into the MDI or not. I have done exactly what you mention - i.e. unplug it, expecting it to go back to sleep (just like it would do with a wall charger for example), and had it stay on indefinitely.

OK, cool. Thanks for bearing with me then.

Have you tried manually sleeping the iPod with it plugged in to the MDI? That'll be my next test.

-dan

Holding down the "play" button for 3sec or whatever it is? That doesn't work when connected to the MDI either, from what I recall.

I had mostly forgotten about this problem, and have been in the habit of disconnecting the iPod for the last few months, but more testing may be necessary soon.

Found more info (Google "iPod hibernation") and it looks pretty much like we will be stuck with this problem until/unless VW updates the firmware or perhaps even the hardware [gulp].

All iPods have sleep mode (press and hold Play for a few seconds), then either deep sleep or hibernate modes, strictly on timers (no key presses we can invoke). Older ones go into deep sleep after about 36 hours; newer ones (like our Gen 5s) go into hibernation at about 14 hours.

Several iPod interfaces, including the VW MDI, handle these modes badly. Problems include inability to wake it up once it enters deep sleep or hibernation without physically touching the iPod (not much fun if it's in the trunk and it's raining out), and allowing the iPod battery to discharge down to nothing after one or two days of the car being parked, or the interface never allowing deep sleep or hibernation (perhaps to try to fix the wake up problem), also resulting in a dead iPod battery.

All this suggests to me that we not only have to unplug our iPods, but also make sure they sleep and even check them many hours later for deeper sleep. Put another way, it looks like the deep sleep/hibernation issue is key in our VWs; shallow sleep not so much. Big PITA.

-dan

danham said:

All this suggests to me that we not only have to unplug our iPods, but also make sure they sleep and even check them many hours later for deeper sleep. Put another way, it looks like the deep sleep/hibernation issue is key in our VWs; shallow sleep not so much. Big PITA.

Click to expand...

I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me why the $169 Alpine in my old E36 BMW (with a factory wiring setup that was designed in about 1990 and a $29 Alpine iPod charge-and-play cable) will automatically sleep the very same iPod a couple minutes after the ignition is turned off, but the PREMIUM TOUCH SCREEN AUDIO SYSTEM in my 2010 MODEL VOLKSWAGEN won't.

Can't explain (or justify), but some of the info I cited above came from unhappy BMW/Alpine owners whose iPods sleep just fine but will not wake up once they enter deep sleep or hibernation. That's where the joke about the trunk came in; apparently some Alpine setups in Bimmers mount the iPod back there. Some of those folks were shipping their interfaces to the UK to get modified to prevent deep sleep.

Also, if my theory is correct (?), the "instant" sleep your Alpine does is not the issue; it's lack of deep sleep/hibernation 36/14 hours later that is killing our iPods.

-dan

Granted I had no idea there were two modes of iPod sleep, but I can tell you for sure that my fully charged iPod will only lose a few percent worth of battery charge whether it's asleep for a day or a week, then it will immediately turn on and play through earbuds for 10-12 hours before it goes dead. And that leaving it plugged into the MDI while the car is locked with the alarm on does neither of those things and will run it dead in under 48 hours, even though that very same car woke it up from sleep in the first place to start making music happen.

So something is definitely not correct in the firmware or whatever else. After a series of emails, my contact at VW said it wasn't normal either. His exact instructions were:

[FONT=&quot]Please go to the dealer and have them open a VTA ticket. L[/FONT][FONT=&quot]et me know [/FONT][FONT=&quot]who the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]deale[/FONT][FONT=&quot]r is so our lead person can follow up with the dealer.[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT][FONT=&quot] There are no technical bulletins out for this, so please have the dealer call the tech line.

[/FONT]I just haven't yet been able to leave the TDI at the dealership for the probably 4 to 7 days (without loaner car) that just about anything but an oil change seems to take there.

Another (odd) data point: After a five-hour trip yesterday, the iPod was obviously fully charged. But I forgot to unplug it. Today, approx. 19 hours after the car was shut off and locked, I opened the driver's door, got in and looked at the iPod. Its screen said "Media Connected, OK to Disconnect" (or something like that) and the little battery icon showed it was charging (!). The battery was still at 100%.

Another observation: problems such as skipping the beginning of songs, freezes while navigating menus, or even loss of connection (the dreaded "No Media" error) do not seem to happen as often or perhaps at all when the iPod's battery is fully charged. They seem to happen a lot more frequently if the battery is very low.

-dan

getfast said:

So something is definitely not correct in the firmware or whatever else. After a series of emails, my contact at VW said it wasn't normal either. His exact instructions were:

[FONT=&quot]Please go to the dealer and have them open a VTA ticket. L[/FONT][FONT=&quot]et me know [/FONT][FONT=&quot]who the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]deale[/FONT][FONT=&quot]r is so our lead person can follow up with the dealer.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] There are no technical bulletins out for this, so please have the dealer call the tech line.

[/FONT]I just haven't yet been able to leave the TDI at the dealership for the probably 4 to 7 days (without loaner car) that just about anything but an oil change seems to take there.

Click to expand...

Hopefully this problem will soon be solved forever! Same contact at VW emailed me this morning:

I believe the technical bulletin is out to get the MDI box flashed.

I'm having the same problem on my '11 Golf with an RNS-315, only my 4th gen nano will go from fully-charged to nearly dead in only a few hours after the car is shut down. The radio is also very slow to display more than the first page or two of the song list and, though I haven't experienced any skipping in the playback, tonight it did fail to display the title of one of the songs that was playing...choosing instead to continue to display the title of the previous song until a third song began to play and then displaying the title of the third song, skipping the title of the middle song altogether...

I had hoped to avoid these problems on my car/radio as they're both so new. My '09 Challenger has a nav/radio that is similar in function and capability to the RNS-510. Early versions of that unit's firmware were allowing the same battery/charging/shutdown problems for iPods until the unit's manufacturer (Harman-Becker) issued a firmware update, which I installed. Those problems are now history on my Dodge. That same unit is offered on VW's version of Chrysler's minivan, so there is a tie-in between Chrysler and VW on a similar issue with the minivan's Nav/radio. Therefore, none of these iPod problems should be news to VW, and there should be a fix forthcoming at some point. I wonder if the update in the posted link will work for all of VW's radios/MDI combinations, including the 2011s...

I'm having the same issue with a iPod Photo (the first color screen iPods) and the RNS-315. Are there any iPods that do NOT have this issue? I guess if the current iPods are fine, it would be an excuse to replace my 5 year old iPod. So, from reading this thread, here's a list of combos:

RCD-510:
5th Gen iPod Classic (drains)
2nd Gen iPod Nano (ok)
4th Gen iPod Nano (drains)
iPod Touch (ok)

RNS-315:
4th Gen iPod Photo (drains)

But this problem doesn't seem to happen to ALL mentioned iPods here. Mine is a 5th gen Classic and stays plugged in the car all the time, I bring it in only for music updates once in a while.

As I mentioned earlier here, there may be other issues involved here as well.

I too am looking forward to the MDI box software flash mentioned above. Any news on that?

gaogi said:

I'm having the same issue with a iPod Photo (the first color screen iPods) and the RNS-315. Are there any iPods that do NOT have this issue? I guess if the current iPods are fine, it would be an excuse to replace my 5 year old iPod. So, from reading this thread, here's a list of combos:

RCD-510:
5th Gen iPod Classic (drains)
2nd Gen iPod Nano (ok)
4th Gen iPod Nano (drains)
iPod Touch (ok)

RNS-315:
4th Gen iPod Photo (drains)

Click to expand...

You can add "4th Gen iPod nano (drains)" under RNS-315...

I figured out why my nano drains dead in only a few hours, rather than the day-or-more reported by others here: when I leave the nano plugged into the MDI and shut everything down/lock the car/set the alarm, not only does the nano stay awake...the display back light on the nano comes on and stays on! No wonder it goes dead so fast.

I ordered my car and it arrived the last week in November. The new download is dated week 45 of 2010. Is that the release date, or the "birth" date? I'm trying to figure out whether or not my car might already have the update. If it does, I'm really screwed...

Here's an update: when I took my car in for it's 90-day checkup, I told the service manager about the whole "car-killing-the-nano-battery" deal. He was aware of the existence of the update download, but was unsure of the format for it's delivery to the dealer or whether they even had the fix on-site. I said "no problem...I downloaded it to my thumb drive and have it right here". He said "how do we connect that to the radio? We don't have a USB adapter cable". I said "no problem...I ordered one last week. It should be in the parts department as we speak". So, we went and got my new USB cable out of parts, went out to the car, and plugged it in. The update performed automatically when I turned on the RNS-315, taking almost no time at all. I plugged in my fully-charged 4th gen nano and played it the rest of the afternoon while running errands. When I got home, I decided to leave the nano plugged into the car over night to test the "fix". Previously, the battery in the nano would have been completely dead within a few hours, but when I went out to the car to check on it at around noon today (about 19 hours later), the nano's battery was still fully charged! What I found through testing is that you have to actually lock the car when you get out or the nano won't go fully to sleep, but if you do lock it...the nano will be out cold within 10 or 15 minutes. That problem is toast. Another improvement: when I pull up a list of artists, songs, whatever...the display no longer shows blanks when I'm scrolling through it, so that's much faster. And, the song titles for the songs that are currently playing are now correctly updated while they're playing, instead of skipping one or two titles while the songs change.

I've only noticed one problem with the update. When I'm listening to an album and I hit the "up" list button once, now...instead of showing me the other songs on the album that I'm listening to (like it used to), the display jumps all the way back out to the alphabetical beginning of the entire song list! This is a real PITA, to say the least. The other fixes make this livable, but why must there be "two steps forward, one step back" when they're trying to straighten out the firmware? Now, I'll just have to wait for the next update...

So, we can only update via the MDI USB cable (000-051-446B), and not through the SD/SDHC?