Front brake caliper failures

How common is it that front brake calipers go bad? I know that the back ones are a weak link.

I'm in the middle of dealing with a bad front brake caliiper on the wife's car. The PO had front brake work done on the car at around 142k miles. New pads and rotors AND both calipers. I seem to recall that the invoice showed a pretty low cost on the calipers ($70 ea?), which would tend to suggest they were rebuilt ones.

This is, and, as far as all the records I dug up show, has always been a PNW car. Both front brake calipers bad at 142k miles? And now at 191k miles one is totally freezing up on me? Fluid struggles to come out of the bleeder valve: I have a Motive power bleeder hooked up.

The shop that did the brake work at 142k miles wasn't, to put it mildly, very good. I encountered, and on this same caliper, a stripped guide pin (I heli-coiled the knuckle- it took the pin torque fine). I wasn't able to replace all the pins, only one (the stripped one), the others sanded a bit, all got greased up. I suspect that once pins are at this stage that it's a lost battle.

I received new rotors and pads (my favorites- Zimmerman rotors and Akebono pads). I just ordered, from VW two new calipers (and all new pins). Is there anything I should be concerned about that might be happening to cause all of this to prematurely fail? I know how to install and grease things up correctly. I wouldn't think that the knuckle is causing any problems as the pin seemed to go in just fine: the brakes also seemed to be pretty good for a while (I'd have to look at my records, but I'm pretty sure the car has at least 10k miles since I did that heli-coil work).

If ever there was a car whose front calipers should be bad it's MY car! Everything sticking out from the axle looked like heck when I got my car with 114k miles on it: one brake pad had separated from its backing plate; rotors were actually delaminating; yet, the calipers work great (now with 157k miles). Go figure!

Usually auto parts store brake calipers are decent. That's a huge liability that would go on them for a failure. My reman units look like they were in the northeast. Pitted to **** but work great. From experience usually hanging is related to a stripped pin. Unless inside the piston wasn't machined correctly and wore itself out. (Or a idiot compressing vs screwing)


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I've seen brake lines fail to the point where fluid goes into the caliper but does not come out. Meaning the brakes act as it they are always on. The brake line crimps were to blame where it transitions from flex to fitting, they were so swollen from rusting that they pinched off the line.

I've never had a vw caliper go bad. I thought I had a rear caliper that was hanging up, but that turned out to be a sticking e brake cable.

Maybe it's the brake line that is causing the problem. I've had two separate vehicles with front rubber brake line failure. Those hoses leading to the calipers might be worth replacing.

At this point I don't have VW originals on the front: that will be rectified.

Until recently the braking was pretty decent. No pulling. Just always this slight pulse. I thought that the repair of the knuckle (and a new pin) was going to resolve this (in my mind I was hoping that was the source).

Pulsing would seem to be warped rotors imo, without actually feeling it

Or maybe a bad tire

The slight pulse has been there almost since day one. I've had three different sets of tires since then and this pulsing continues. It's just faint, but if I can detect it at it is still too much.

Today (after yanking more parts off my Jetta parts car) I pulled the passenger side caliper and rotor. The driver's side rotor has quite a bit of wear compared to the passenger's side rotor. There's a far more discernible ridge on the driver's side, which suggests that it's been engaging a LOT more than the passenger side. Could be that the passenger side is a bit weak (slight fluid blockage? I was unable to break that bleeder free when I went to do a fluid flush last April) and the driver's is a bit too much (sticking). It's interesting, though, that the brakes did not pull.

Are the sliders clean and working freely? I had a ranger burn up 1 side before. The slider pin on one end of the caliper had some nasty stuff inside that locked it up. So now I always pull the pins and clean them and the holes real well and re grease them. Make sure they slide in and out nice and easy.

I've had some success with stuck bleeders by warming them with a torch and letting them cool down, on other vehicles. Heat it, spray so PB on to cool it; may take a few heat cool cycles but it has worked for me on several occasions.

The major cause of front brake caliper failure I see is when the calipers have been replaced in the past due to a tire store brake job. Around here they do it automatically.

The originals rarely fail, even on high mileage cars, if they get a brake fluid flush occasionally.

Dieselmonkey02 said:

Or maybe a bad tire

Click to expand...

Spent a bunch of time and money on a customer's truck that would pull only when braking. Finally swapped front tires side to side and it pulled the other way.

But that doesn't seem to be the problem here.

Dieselmonkey02, I went through several cycles of heating and applying PB Blaster w/o any success. I was going to just drill the stupid thing and run a tap (and push fluid through to clean). Now that I'm getting new calipers it's a non-issue (helps me feel better about the cost- won't have to be messing with a stuck bleeder valve).

pdq import repair, pretty much what I believe is happening here. Victim of a cheesy "repair" shop.

I e-mailed the PO asking him if he could shed some light on why the calipers were replaced. I won't hold my breath that he'll respond, but I figure I'd give it a shot.

whitedog said:

Spent a bunch of time and money on a customer's truck that would pull only when braking. Finally swapped front tires side to side and it pulled the other way.

But that doesn't seem to be the problem here.

Click to expand...

Yeah, this one is slightly puzzling, and it's why I decided to post this thread. There really wasn't much in the way of it pulling to one side. But, toward the end (after I tried re-bedding) one was hanging on to a shaking steering wheel, in which case how much one was compensating for any pull was hard to tell (and that it was hard to tell would tend to suggest it wasn't severe).

BTW - Here's an example of some seriously screwed up brakes (what mine were like when I installed new pads and rotors- again, my calipers looked like crap - I even sanded up the pistons- but now the brakes are excellent):

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/data/photos/m/1/1280-1424823443-79854173d2e55d04d4b6a406fbd1357b.jpg

UhOh,

The picture looks like the cheap rear rotors I bought. Delaminated.
On sale was not the best deal.
Replaced them with premium rotors and ceramic pads when they went on sale.
So far so good.

Rich, yeah, not EVER going to use any cheap brake parts!

I took a closer look at the pads today and could clearly see that the pads on the driver's side were worn down a significant amount more than on the passenger side: no surprise given that the rotors are also showing this. This leads me to believe that this thing has been dragging for quite some time.

The pads on the driver's side also look like they were heat soaked. That's the only term that I can think of that would describe what they look like. I'll take a picture and post it.

FE really hasn't been negatively impacted all that much. FE is down just a bit and I kind of just figured that it was due to winter. Could be that some of the decline has been due to the brakes dragging.

UhOh
I'm picturing the bluish marks from heat.
I've seen it a few times over the years.
My mileage has been down a bit for a long time.
I do feel near the rotors once in a while after a long ride but rarely have a hot one to check.
I think I might have stumbled on my 108 relay for the turbo being bad.
Short version, was tracing a power loss and boost pressure loss for a few weeks.
Thought it was the hose from the vacuum reservoir when I removed it doing a compression test.
Replaced that hose and the one to the turbo but still low.
I put the mighty vac on each of the ports on the solenoid and all would not hold vacuum (other 2 ports open).
Then I tried covering the 2 open ports (fingers w/ latex gloves).
Was able to get vacuum but not hold it for more then a second or two.
Shot a bit of penetrating oil in each port (quick spritz) and shook it.
Now it held vacuum for sevaeral seconds.
Put it back on and now I seem to be getting to much boost again.
Gona order one in the very near future.
Must be a hair line crack.
It's nice to have the power again.

Rich, the pads actually have a more reddish tone to them. It's like rust. Perhaps it's just water instantly oxidizing off the hot pads? The pads look like they're kind of crumbly. The entire rim was bone dry (no way would I touch it- I could feel the heat just holding my hand out from the wheel) when the other three only had the normal dry spots right in the center of the rims (where the wheels attach to the hubs). The car would not roll freely.

Is the wheel bearing good? That might throw your rotor out enough to drag on the pads.

Here's some pictures of the pads and rotors:

Pads from both fronts (should be able to tell which is which)


Rotors (outside)


Rotors (inside)

Installed everything. All is nice and pretty BUT, the driver's caliper's line is leaking on me I tightened it down a bit more, but no go- didn't want to try tightening any further: I'm going to check on torque specs and see if I still have some more room to tighten; I thought I'd seen someone mention 28 ft-lbs, but this sounds pretty high to me. From stuff that I've read it appears that the crush washers might be fatigued (keep in mind that this is the THIRD set of calipers on this car, and I doubt the lines have been changed) and that I might be able to replace them (there's contradicting info on this); some folks have mentioned Loc-Tite 545 (I have some around). And I was wanting to button this all up and get on with bedding in the brakes!

Oh! Other than the discoloration, can anyone spot what's wrong in that first picture in my above posting? It took me a while to realize it, and it wasn't until I got to puzzling over which pad goes where did I figure out what was wrong.

And in case anyone else is baffled about where that brake squeak is coming from:



Found on top of the knuckle, behind the hub.

It's not a matching set of pads for 1. 3rd pad from left looks unevenly worn in the picture.

Better than a skunk

A buddy of mine hit a skunk once and couldn't figure out why the stink was so bad. Yep, it was still riding shotgun.

Dieselmonkey02 said:

It's not a matching set of pads for 1. 3rd pad from left looks unevenly worn in the picture.

Click to expand...

Actual evenness of pad wear is kind of hard to note in these pictures. You're right, not a matching set of pads. I was kind of puzzling over this a bit, BUT, what struck me more so was the fact that the passenger side's caliper was loaded up with TWO outer pads while the driver's side was loaded up with TWO inner pads (there's the obvious one, the pad with the sensor).

I'd moved the pads and when I was trying to assure myself of how they're supposed to go (I can never seem to remember!) and saw them lying with their backs up I noticed that the clear impressions left by the pistons was on one inner pad (sensor) and one outer pad.

I cannot express how much contempt I have for the shop that did this work. If I'd have been the one to have engaged them to do the brake and I later discovered this I'd be there pounding on their door (and skulls).

I can't believe a shop would mix and match pads.

I think you're orangish colored pads jus have that break in grit on them.

Got my line leak sealed up. Required a slight bump in torque value- was about 22 ft-lbs and the torque spec is 26 ft-lbs.

Need to bed-in the pads & rotors (per Zimmerman's procedures).

Completed the bed-in procedure. Everything works and feels great. Hoping that this will my last post (for this car) in this thread!