Emission Testing the Diesel

Dezl Don

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 21, 1999
Location
Cleveland, OH
Ohio requires emission testing of cars and light trucks in most of its counties. The testing even includes VW TDIs. I was hoping that the test would be the exact same dyno test as used for gas cars, so that I could brag about how clean my little A4 Jetta is. But, no luck.

The diesel test requires the test operator to enter the GVWR of the test vehicle (sound truckish to you?) as well as the VIN number, etc. And the only emission tested is opacity. The test is conducted on a dyno. The allowable amount of opacity is 20 units or less (I don't know what the unit of measure is -- just "units"). The TDI scored a "0" -- that right, zero, measure of opacity units. So it must be clean, eh? Who knows....

Any of you smart people know what this test proved, besides the removal of $19.50 from my wallet, and permission to renew my license plates?
 

TDITim

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2001
Location
Cleveland, OH USA
TDI
None :(
I think all they did was rip you and everyone else in the state with a passenger vehicle less than 5 years old out of $20. I had posted about the Ohio test a few months back and how insane it is. Interestingly enough, I contacted the Ohio EPA and asked them for passage rates by make/model/year. They only sent the by year rates, but from '95-'00 model years the passage rate was over 95%. This is not helping the environment, it is ripping off the people!

Specifcally on the subject of diesels all Ohio does is check PM. They don't even look at NOx for any vehicle, gassers included. What is up with that? There were a number of bills under consideration in the state house or senate exempting cars under 5-6 years old, but I never found out what happened to them. Futhermore, the state is in a contract with the testing company (Envirotest) for a number of years.

There is an exemption for alternative fuel vehicles though so I wonder if you run Biodiesel 100% of the time they would exempt you - probably not. This even though CNG vehicles would be exempt and some of them have unleaded fuel tanks as backups.

[ December 18, 2001: Message edited by: TDITim ]</p>
 

rocketman

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2001
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio
TDI
NB 2001 GAL BLUE
Oh! don't get me started on this subject...somebody stop me!
Ohio has the most absurd emissions reg's of any state or country. Ever wonder why the county Columbus is in, does not have to have this test! UURRRGGG! At least that was the last poop I heard.
I was wondering about my NB TDI and if I was going to have to get it tested...now after reading this post I'm really pissed! Something has got to be done come election time. I'm going to ask my State REP's where they stand and the next round of elections I will be voting solely on their stance on the subject. What else can we do???????????
 

Coolin90

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2001
Location
Vancouver BC Canada
I hear you. This is the same situation we have here in Vancouver, Canada.

It's called "Aircare" up here...it costs around the same...and they measure the same thing. I've got a '81 MB 300SD and a 2002 TDI Jetta, they both don't show up on the tests radar...and I end up spending money for what appears to be no reason at all.

If we don't take the test we can't put our cars on the road.

I feel you pain....
 

GoFaster

Moderator at Large
Joined
Jun 16, 1999
Location
Brampton, Ontario, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI
Hey, you typo'ed the name of the BC emissions test. I thought it was called "AirScare"


Don't think we have such a good nickname for our "Drive Clean" test. All they do for ours is glance at the exhaust to see if there's visible smoke at idle.
 

tdi_veedub

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2001
Location
Barrie, ON, Canada
You guys think you got it bad??? Check this....


In Ontario all they do is start the car, and stand behind it for about 2 minutes to see how much it smokes. Then they subjectively decide whether the vehicle passes or fails, and charge you $30.

No dynos, no probes, no nothing. now THAT is a ripoff!
 

TDI Envy

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2000
Location
Ajax, Ontario, Canada
I was talking to a guy doing TDI's and he feels he earns the 30 bucks. Says the paperwork and procedures are "10 times" more hassles than the reg DriveClean.
Still think it's a rip.
 

tdi_veedub

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2001
Location
Barrie, ON, Canada
Thanks for that tidbit of information....

Next time I go for a drive clean I'll tell the guy to give me the damn papers and I'll do the damn test myself.
Maybe I'll shove the tailpipe up his....ahhhhh nevermind....


OOOHHH the Ontario Government pisses me off to no end. This is ludicrous, my blood boils every time I think about this.


I think all of us Ontarians that drive diesels get a petetition together or something and slam it on desk of the transportation minister. I know there are alot of us. Hell, I'll even drive it to Ottawa, it won't even cost me a tank of fuel. Only in Canada do we allow our Government to blatently rip us off....this must stop!!
 

cgs2000

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2000
Location
Cincinnati
Here's some correspondence I had with Ohio EPA:

April 18, 2001

Dear Sirs:

I apologize for not fully explaining the two-speed idle test. If a diesel vehicle is not able to be tested on the dyne due to gross vehicle weight or other conditions, it is given a two-speed idle test. The first phase of the test is referred to as "high idle". In this portion of the test, a vehicle is taken up to 2200 +/- 300 rpms for approximately ten seconds. Most inspectors will take a vehicle up to 2500 rpms, which is the maximum, because it is easier to bring the vehicle up to that point and slowly coastdown over the ten second period. If the vehicle does not pass this portion of the test it is given a "curb idle" test which for your vehicle would be 900 rpms. This is a diagnostic test for vehicles that are not able to pass the high idle portion.

It is important to remember that a four cylinder engine can easily reach a maximum of 2500 rpms when driving at highway speeds. The high idle test does not damage the vehicle, it only takes the vehicle up to a higher idle in order to simulate a load under real driving conditions. This test often sounds harsh to the motorist as they have never stood outside their vehicle while it is moving at a speed that involves such high rpm's.

State emissions testing programs cannot be set up to include vehicles registered out-of-state because there is no way to track those vehicles. It is not practicable to have a program that attempts to force testing on vehicles outside of your jurisdiction. This is much easier to do on a small scale, or case by case like speeding tickets are for the highway patrol. There is no state in the country that enforces their emissions testing on other state's vehicles because it would be impossible to enforce such a program.

In regards to the number of vehicles travelling to and from work everyday, approximately 1.9 million vehicles are tested annually through the E-Check program in the fourteen E-Check counties. Since vehicles are tested every two years, that equals approximately 4 million vehicles which are included in the E-Check program, and therefore registered in an E-Check county. These four million vehicles do the majority of their travelling in and around the fourteen counties. These vehicles account for 42% of all vehicles registered in the state of Ohio.

If you have any further questions, please let me know.

Sincerely,

Robyn Shick
Mobile Sources Section
Division of Air Pollution Control


>>> <cgs2000@juno.com> 04/13/01 11:56AM >>>
Thanks for the prompt reply. Please note that, if "...An idle test is always given at 2500 rpm. The inspector does not have to guess on the rpm's for each vehicle." that inspector is overreving my car which idles at 900.
You state that vehicles registered outside Ohio cannot be subjected to Ohio laws: how about regulation of speed and weight? Does Ohio not check these...and ticket violators?
Are there really "millions of vehicles driving to and from work" in the echeck areas, every day?

Her email is robyn.shick@epa.state.oh.us
 

cgs2000

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2000
Location
Cincinnati
Here's more:

On Fri, 13 Apr 2001 07:57:34 -0400 "Robyn Shick" <robyn.shick@epa.state.oh.us> writes: (added emphasis by CGS)
> April 13, 2001
>
> Dear Sirs:
>
> I wanted to take the time to address the additional questions that
> were brought up concerning diesel testing.
>
> 1) Yes, all diesel vehicles under 10,000 pounds are tested. Garbage
> trucks and school buses weigh well over 10,000 pounds, so they are
> not tested. In fact, the average sanitation vehicle weighs 40,000
> pounds and the average school bus weighs 23,000 pounds.
>
> Public vehicles are also included in the program. Ohio EPA has a
> separate government fleet program which requires all government
> fleet vehicles under 10,000 pounds to test in the odd model years
> and report directly to Ohio EPA.
>
> 2) The majority of vehicles weighing over 10,000 pounds that are
> excluded from the program are those commercially plated vehicles.
> However, many of these vehicles are subject to other forms of
> regulation on a federal level. On the other hand, Ohio EPA is
> developing an urban bus program that will require emissions testing
> of all urban bus fleets in the fourteen E-Check counties as of
> January 1, 2002.
>
> 3) The E-Check station inspectors go through a minimum of 56 hours
> of training, with 16 of those being in the classroom and 40 being
> on-the-job. Part of this training is learning how to correctly test
> a vehicle. The ASM 2525 testing procedure only allows a vehicle to
> be accelerated to 25 mph. If an inspector does not, or cannot keep
> a vehicle at a steady 25 mph, the test is aborted. An idle test is
> always given at 2500 rpm. The inspector does not have to guess on
> the rpm's for each vehicle.
>
> 4) There will always be those people who avoid having their vehicles
> tested. Unfortunately, the only way to track vehicles is through
> registration. Ohio EPA would prefer that all individual's living in
> an E-Check county actually register their vehicle in that county, and
> therefore, have their vehicle tested. Although this is not always
> the case, the BMV does make an effort to identify those individual's
> registering out of their county of residence.
>
> 5) The semi-trucks that pass through E-Check counties on a daily
> basis are subject to federal regulations through manufacturing
> standards, etc. The majority of these vehicles belong to fleets
> outside of the state, so they cannot be subjected to Ohio law.
> Although these vehicles do contribute to pollution problems, they
> are not the major source of vehicle emissions in the fourteen
> E-Check counties. The air quality along the I-75, I-70, and I-71
> corridors is not poor compared to the air quality in the greater
> metropolitan areas. True these highways pass through Ohio's major
> cities, but the vehicles just passing through are not the major
> source of the problem. The major source of vehicle emissions in the
> fourteen E-Check counties can be contributed to the millions of
> vehicles driving to and from work and other activities on a daily
> basis.
>
> If you have any further questions regarding the E-Check program or
> diesel testing specifically, please do not hesitate to call me at
> (614) 728-1347 or email me at robyn.shick@epa.state.oh.us.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Robyn Shick
> Mobile Sources Section
> Division of Air Pollution Control
>
> E000410
> >>> <cgs2000@juno.com> 04/12/01 11:11AM >>>
> Thanks, Mike: I'm forwarding this to TDI guys, with a copy to the
> original sender. Note that emphasis was added by me to cogent points
> of
> possible special interest to our group. Should we also post it on
> Fred's
> TDI Club? It definitely affects other parts of Ohio.
>
> The EPA message brings me to ask:
>
> (1) Are all diesels under 10,000 lbs really tested? I've been behind many garbage trucks and school busses which pour out soot. How much do
> they weigh? What about "public" vehicles: are they tested, or do we just inhale and enjoy?
> (2) Does "exposure to particulate matter" not cause health problems...if the vehicle should weigh more than 10,000 lbs? Are we talking about
> health or truck industry lobbying? What about the OH constitution, which mandates equal application of the law?
> (3) Should we worry about the "25 miles per hour" test? Would these folks overrev our low rev engines? I can imagine someone thinking that
> 4000 revs might be about right!
> (4) I certainly have the impression that diesel fueled trucks are never tested: do they register the trucks in a non-echeck county to circumvent
> the rule, and then drive wherever to vent the fumes? Isn't the point of impact (exhaust) more important than the county of registration.
> (5) What about the thousands of trucks which pass thru Cincinnati every day on I-75 and I-71, leaving behind their tons of particulate?
> Should we expect Ohio EPA to set up test sites, similar to the truck weighing stations, and then fine/impound violators?
 

rocketman

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2001
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio
TDI
NB 2001 GAL BLUE
CGS 2000.. I'm a west sider, from Delhi.
So from the reply you got from the state, they basically can look for smoke at idle only, and if there is none...you pass!
Blows my mind. Lets face it. They just want our money to help reduce the overall cost of their stupid program that does not work..makes sense now!
CGS2000..what part are you from?
 

jaydhall

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 2, 1999
Location
Aurora Colorado
TDI
2012 Passat SE, 1999 NB, 1999.5 Jetta GLS, 2004 Jetta
Seems fair to me! Here in Colorado it is $50 PER YEAR for a nothing test. Sigh. I would LOVE to pay just $19.95...
 

tdibugman

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2001
Location
Forked River, NJ
Our testing in Jersey is a freebee - and every two years. Had to laugh - When the new system was implemented,I was the first diesel to go through the new station - and it consequently took 2 hours to get through. They had to call ten different offices to get the right passwords for the computer, so I could get a sticker out of the machine!!!
 

Smithers

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 7, 1999
Location
Lower Slobovia
In Wisconsin, testing is free and diesels are exempt. When I took the wife's gasser, all they do now is hook the computer up to check for CEL's or fault codes. The car is never brought above idle, and the actual emmisions aren't tested. Go figure.
 

troy_heagy

BANNED
Joined
Feb 23, 2001
It isn't truly free. They charge you when they subtract tax money from your paycheck.

I have to take my Shadow for emissions check soon. In Maryland, I think it costs $25. Since I have a blown head gasket, I expect to fail the test.

Troy
 
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