Timing belt

Don_and_Herbie · May 29, 2018

Ok guys time to educate the idiot.

New to tdis not new to engines.

I have a 2003 beetle with a alh engine trying to put on a timing belt.

Rebuilt head.

Cam is locked down sprocket free to move, injection pump pinned.

Know the question, according to the Bently I turn then tensioner untill the raised tab aligns with the notch. Now no matter what i do i cant get the raised tab to move. what am i doing wrong.

Have turned the tensioner cw.

Tab on tensioner is in square hole in rear cover.

ffemtp · May 29, 2018

When was the timing belt failure? If it was just now then you have more issues to deal with before you can put that belt on. If it just took place you'll need to take the head off and assess / fix the damage....

KLXD · May 29, 2018

What ff said.

Are you rotating the tensioner CW?

Is the tension increasing?

The it's an eccentric. As you rotate the center mount the roller moves to the right. If the tension isn't increasing maybe you have the belt routed incorrectly? Missing idlers? Not rotating it enough?

Where'd you get the parts? Maybe incorrect belt length?

Oh, your last sentence makes absolutely no sense. I can't get anything from it.

Don_and_Herbie said:
Know just to checked i did it right this engine had a timing belt failure so nothing was locked down before belt cam off crank at tdc easy to set cam easy with lock bar know injection pump I turned it till i was able to slide in the pin this was in between 2 of the pulses did i do this right.

MichaelB · May 29, 2018

Don_and_Herbie said:
Know just to checked i did it right this engine had a timing belt failure so nothing was locked down before belt cam off

If the timing belt broke you cannot just replace it and motor on. The valves and lifters are crashed and the head needs to be rebuilt before you can proceed with the belt replacement.

Don_and_Herbie · May 29, 2018

head was rebuilt not that dumb to think I could just throw a belt at it.

Parts were a timing kit from Idparts so they should be right

Don_and_Herbie · May 29, 2018

KLXD said:
What ff said.

Are you rotating the tensioner CW?

Is the tension increasing?

The it's an eccentric. As you rotate the center mount the roller moves to the right. If the tension isn't increasing maybe you have the belt routed incorrectly? Missing idlers? Not rotating it enough?

Where'd you get the parts? Maybe incorrect belt length?

Oh, your last sentence makes absolutely no sense. I can't get anything from it.

Yes rotating cw
Yes tension is increaseing just not showing on tensioner marks.
parts were from IDPats

jokila · May 29, 2018

Don_and_Herbie said:
head was rebuilt not that dumb to think I could just throw a belt at it.

Parts were a timing kit from Idparts so they should be right

You do realize you never mentioned that fact even though you blab some slightly hard to understand sentence about a timing belt event? We don't know what you know nor would we know that you are not that dumb.

As the others have said, you should be rotating the tensioner in only one direction, clockwise. If you did it backwards you could have broken it in some way. Also, the tab of the tensioner should be in the square hole to allow this to tension. Is it?

Don_and_Herbie · May 29, 2018

tab is in square hole have turned it only cw

MichaelB · May 29, 2018

jokila said:
You do realize you never mentioned that fact even though you blab some slightly hard to understand sentence about a timing belt event? We don't know what you know nor would we know that you are not that dumb. /QUOTE]

Thank-you. This guy is hard to follow It is almost like he is evading our questions.

jokila · May 29, 2018

Don_and_Herbie said:
tab is in square hole have turned it only cw

Sounds like you have a bad tensioner. That's really odd though. Never have had that in the many timing belt jobs I have done over the years getting parts from IDparts or having customers source the same.

By the way, it's proper grammar to end a sentence with a period and capitalize the start of every sentence. It's not only proper, it makes reading your comments easier. If you are typing your responses on a smartphone all you have to do is tap the space-bar twice in a row. Not only will it add the period at the end of the sentence, you get a space added for the next word, AND...the next letter you type is capitalized!

MichaelB · May 30, 2018

jokila said:
By the way, it's proper grammar to end a sentence with a period and capitalize the start of every sentence. It's not only proper, it makes reading your comments easier. If you are typing your responses on a smartphone all you have to do is tap the space-bar twice in a row. Not only will it add the period at the end of the sentence, you get a space added for the next word, AND...the next letter you type is capitalized!

Hence Smart Phone

AndyBees · May 30, 2018

OP, in case I missed it, did you loosen the three bolts on the Injection Pump Sprocket?

Don_and_Herbie · May 31, 2018

Yes I did.

jokila · May 31, 2018

MichaelB said:
Hence Smart Phone

It's only smart if you let it.

jokila · May 31, 2018

AndyBees said:
OP, in case I missed it, did you loosen the three bolts on the Injection Pump Sprocket?

It should still tension even with them tightened down inappropriately for that part of the procedure.

oilhammer · May 31, 2018

I am always left scratching my head at threads like these, but I have certainly seen enough tooefed engines from incorrectly tensioned belts, so I guess it must not be as clear as I think it is.

Couple tips:

The nut must be tight enough to hold the tensioner assembly in place, but not so tight it cannot rotate freely. There is a fine line there.

I have the spanner pin holes angled back and down when I slip the tensioner down over the stud. And wobble it back and forth to make sure the tab is indeed in the square hole, and that square hole need to have the metal ring in it to allow the tab to slide as the tensioner is turned.

At this point, I be taking the tensioner back off, and look to see that nothing is bent on the back side. I doubt it was a bad tensioner. Man I have installed a boat load of these, never had a single bad one.

Windex · Jun 1, 2018

Is the small roller (at the top of the timing cover) installed?

Are you able to take a picture (or two) of the current belt install and post up here for us to have a gander?

cwatson9510 · Jun 1, 2018

Try loosening the tensioner a bit with the tool (counterclockwise), then tighten, and repeat a few times. I find that you usually need to rock it back and forth a bit to get the tab to start moving if that makes any sense.

whitedog · Jun 11, 2018

How far around have you turned the tensioner? If you have the standard tensioning tool that fits in the holes at a right angle to said holes, I believe the tool should be somewhere between 9:00&12:00. Oilhammer would know better. He probably did more timing belts last week than I have in my life!

jokila · Jun 11, 2018

The OP started a new thread instead of responding to all of the kind help in this one.

oilhammer said:
At this point, I be taking the tensioner back off, and look to see that nothing is bent on the back side. I doubt it was a bad tensioner. Man I have installed a boat load of these, never had a single bad one.

I followed up for a guy once who started the timing belt work but couldnt finish, much like the OP. He sort of broke the tensioner through working over incorrectly. The tensioner came apart. I manage to put it back together correctly where it was under some preloaded tension as they are assembled, but it was easy to have the main shaft come apart from the crimped backside. My point... it can be broken up causing the tensioner to not work right.

Don_and_Herbie · Jun 15, 2018

Took everything off all looked good reinstalled.
Tried to set tension and this time everything worked like i had read.

KrashDH · Jun 16, 2018

Don_and_Herbie said:
Took everything off all looked good reinstalled.
Tried to set tension and this time everything worked like i had read.

I just got done my TB job this morning. Those first few miles driving and starting are always nerve racking!

TDIdaho · Oct 7, 2018

Question here. Did the camshaft get replaced after the belt failure? My son-in-law broke a belt and although the cam looks ok should it be replaced?

Genesis · Oct 7, 2018

The cam is USUALLY ok. But the valves and lifters are not, and if the head didn't come off he's begging for BIG trouble in another few thousand miles (like a dropped valve and wiped-out cylinder.)

AndyBees · Oct 7, 2018

TDIdaho, to be sure, at least one exhaust valve will be trashed as they are the ones hit first. The pistons are chasing exhaust valves shut. Intake valves are opening as the piston is going away. Once the belt breaks, the cam almost immediately stops rotating. So, any valve that is only partially open will get a good lick from the piston as the engine spins to a stop.

As suggested, do not trust anything. The head should be pulled and look on the corresponding pistons for the tell-a-tale sign of a kiss by a valve.

New set of lifters and depending on miles on the engine, either replace all the valves or only those damaged including the valve guide and seal. Franko6 says he only replaces those damaged. That's what I'd do.

Amathieson7 · Oct 14, 2018

Dealer changed my timing belt incorrectly

Hi everyone. I live in Bristol, TN and would love to know if there’s a specialist near me. This is my first post here and I hope it’s in the right spot and I apologize this may be lengthy. I bought an 03 jetta tdi a couple of weeks ago to keep miles off my truck and gain on my 12mpg I’m getting. It has 133k miles on it and the timing belt had never been changed. I drove it home from where I purchased it and parked it until I could get it changed. I work at an auto shop and my friend there is a very good diesel tech and has done a lot of work to his tdi over the years, but never a tb change. So I decided to go with the dealer thinking it would be done properly and if something went wrong they had to deal with it. When I picked it up I instantly knew something was off when I fired it up. Started fine but was noticeably louder. During the drive home I noticed that it had no power and felt like it had no boost. Got home, opened the hood and started looking for any vacuum lines loose or if the inter cooler pipe was on right. Didn’t find anything. What I did find was that they broke my dipstick tube, they didn’t change the upper roller, and I’m sure the lower, and then I got very pissed when I saw that the valve cover and vacuum pump(I think it is) had 1000% sure not been taken off. I just paid them $900 and I’m sick to my stomach and worried it was a waste. I’ve tried reading everything and seems some people say it’s possibly a tooth off or not timed properly. I took the car back the next morning but it was a Saturday so no manager was there. I really need some help on what to do or what to say when I go speak to them in the morning. And also if there’s maybe any damage done to the car. Again sorry this was long and thanks so much!!

WildChild80 · Oct 14, 2018

This is why I do my own work

That's shameful, hope you get it worked out

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

mk3 · Oct 14, 2018

Amathieson7 said:
Hi everyone. I live in Bristol, TN and would love to know if there’s a specialist near me. This is my first post here and I hope it’s in the right spot and I apologize this may be lengthy. I bought an 03 jetta tdi a couple of weeks ago to keep miles off my truck and gain on my 12mpg I’m getting. It has 133k miles on it and the timing belt had never been changed. I drove it home from where I purchased it and parked it until I could get it changed. I work at an auto shop and my friend there is a very good diesel tech and has done a lot of work to his tdi over the years, but never a tb change. So I decided to go with the dealer thinking it would be done properly and if something went wrong they had to deal with it. When I picked it up I instantly knew something was off when I fired it up. Started fine but was noticeably louder. During the drive home I noticed that it had no power and felt like it had no boost. Got home, opened the hood and started looking for any vacuum lines loose or if the inter cooler pipe was on right. Didn’t find anything. What I did find was that they broke my dipstick tube, they didn’t change the upper roller, and I’m sure the lower, and then I got very pissed when I saw that the valve cover and vacuum pump(I think it is) had 1000% sure not been taken off. I just paid them $900 and I’m sick to my stomach and worried it was a waste. I’ve tried reading everything and seems some people say it’s possibly a tooth off or not timed properly. I took the car back the next morning but it was a Saturday so no manager was there. I really need some help on what to do or what to say when I go speak to them in the morning. And also if there’s maybe any damage done to the car. Again sorry this was long and thanks so much!!

You should start a new thread and re-post this.

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